medical marijuana providers oppose freedom for anybody but themselves

I used to be a supporter of "medical marijuana" laws, but the prop 19 fight in CA changed my mind on the topic. Medical use of cannabis is mostly a scam, and the "clinic" operators are decidedly not your friend in any quest for freedom.

http://reason.com/blog/2012/04/16/why-medical-marijuana-providers-are-oppo#comment_2982526

I agree. Here is an article I read that really vigorously (maybe too vigorous) points a finger at Monsanto and Some Big Pharm corporations. I take it with a grain of salt, but I think it is generally correct. As a biologist, it is my opinion that Terminator seeds have the potential to cause a human population and species diversity bottleneck.

Take into account the author, D.M. Murdoch, aka Acharya S. is a controversial figure. http://community.kpfz.org/node/17

i second that

abandonconflict said:

I agree. Here is an article I read that really vigorously (maybe too vigorous) points a finger at Monsanto and Some Big Pharm corporations. I take it with a grain of salt, but I think it is generally correct. As a biologist, it is my opinion that Terminator seeds have the potential to cause a human population and species diversity bottleneck.

Take into account the author, D.M. Murdoch, aka Acharya S. is a controversial figure. http://community.kpfz.org/node/17

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Yup!!. It gets worse ... millions of dollars are spent to create GMO Fusarium fungi That Kill marijuana. A former employee of an "anti-drug" agency says biotech Scientists are Trying to genetically modify marijuana to create zero-THC cannabis genetically That "terminates" high-THC varieties. Experts say GMOs pose severe health risks to us, our marijuana plants, and the world's ecosystems.... Discover How You Stop GMOs!!!

mrmtt3 said:

Yup!!. It gets worse ... millions of dollars are spent to create GMO Fusarium fungi That Kill marijuana. A former employee of an "anti-drug" agency says biotech Scientists are Trying to genetically modify marijuana to create zero-THC cannabis genetically That "terminates" high-THC varieties. Experts say GMOs pose severe health risks to us, our marijuana plants, and the world's ecosystems.... Discover How You Stop GMOs!!!

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All they have to do is cross hemp with high THC strains by widespread pollination to destroy their high effect, Jorge Cervantes warned of this in his Bible years ago.

"If the people let government decide
what foods they eat and what medicines they take,
their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state
as are the souls of those who live under tyranny."

Thomas Jefferson

jorge toyed with the idea that the gov would use planes to pollinate all the crops...but he also said it was a longshot..so many people have asthma would suffer.

Corruption through regulations to limit competition, nothing new here.

Regulation is bad mkay.

Canada is much further along in this illness. BOYCOTT SATIVEX!

dude legalization is a shame, its takes the med laws and makes everything from having pot to plants a lot less. ill stick with medical laws because you get to have more. prop 502 in WA is a perfect example

silasraven said:

dude legalization is a shame, its takes the med laws and makes everything from having pot to plants a lot less. ill stick with medical laws because you get to have more. prop 502 in WA is a perfect example

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lol, count this guy as worthless to all americans who value freedom and want to see full cannabis re-legalization.

UncleBuck said:

lol, count this guy as worthless to all americans who value freedom and want to see full cannabis re-legalization.

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dude check the laws you'll notice that medical is a whole lot better. you get to have more plants and pot then if it were legal. im all for making it de crim and legal but only if i get to have the same amount. i so sick of running out of meds just cause i cant afford these shit prices. making it legal will just futher bullshit prices and amounts. 15 plants and 24 OZ here yep i love medical

Its not exactly a new problem.

You could read the famous piece about about the "bootleggers and baptists" in the original alcohol prohibition.

In a nutshell, the two groups that ought to have hated each other the most (fundamentalist religious, and alcohol bootleggers) were on the same side as the two most ardent supporters of prohibition.

Its the same now with medical marijuana. Having what amounts to government issued monopolies on the legal retail sale of "medical" marijuana, the LAST thing the dispensaries want is their gravy train to end with full legalization. With millions of dollars flowing into their pockets every year from legal sales, these dispensaries can (and do) afford to spend some of their money lobbying AGAINST cannabis legalization.

On genetically modified marijuana and gov't attempts to eradicate, the cannabis plant, bluntly, is a lot tougher than the US gov't is! The gov't can TRY to saturate the entire continental USA (plus HI and AK) with no-THC hemp pollen, but in practice, they'll never be able to cover all of it, nor could they maintain the coverage indefinitely to ruin all ourdoor crops (which are planted at different times). Plus, no amount of spraying pollen outside is going to affect the vast majority of small growers, who are growing indoors.

i dont care about the people making money off of it, they are going to. just like corn, grapes ect.

silasraven said:

dude check the laws you'll notice that medical is a whole lot better. you get to have more plants and pot then if it were legal.

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do you have brain damage?

if it's legal, then there is no limit.

beer is legal, there is no limit to how much beer i can have.

if i want to brew my own beer, i can do that as well. if i want to brew beer and sell it to others, it is taxed and regulated, just as any other legal product.

the idea of re-legalization limiting anything is bizarro world kind of stuff.

silasraven said:

i dont care about the people making money off of it, they are going to. just like corn, grapes ect.

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To be clear, I have zero problem with people making money in the cannabis industry, including via direct sales of cannabis. In my opinion that's perfectly fine (and in fact, its even desirable economically).

What you "should" care about is having a situation where only a small number of politically well-connected people enjoy the legal "right" to make money selling cannabis, and where its a crime for anyone else. My understanding is that's basically how it is now in CA. The dispensaries have to be licensed, and their number is limited. That means *I* can't sell cannabis, and you can't. . .but multimillion dollar "medical dispensary, inc" can.

Without TRUE legalization where anyone can legally sell the stuff, you create, in effect, government sponsored drug cartels.

Arguably, that's somewhat better than total illegality, but it has many problems of its own.

For one thing, with only limited numbers of legal sellers, prices are kept artificially high for legal buyers (ie patients).

This situation can also lead to overt corruption. For example, if the only way to secure a license to run a dispensary is via a reviewed application, who is going to get them? Well, typically these sorts of things go to friends and family members of political appointees or elected officials, or simply those with the deepest pockets who can afford the bribes, or "political donations".

Once you have the license, you can use a portion of your earnings to ensure that you keep it, again the same way. Since nobody but you and other cartel members can legally sell cannabis, you enjoy a situation where the police effectively act as your enforcers to reduce competition!

UncleBuck said:

do you have brain damage?

if it's legal, then there is no limit.

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Not exactly.

'Legal' can mean many things.

Cigarettes are legal to possess by adults in all states, but there are significant limitations on how they can be sold. For example, in some states vending machine sales are illegal. Some states have limits as to how many packs can be purchased by an individual at once.

Alcohol is legal, yes, but there are jurisdictions States where alcohol cannot be purchased on Sundays, or after dark, or in concentrations above a certain amount.

Its legal to possess whiskey in the USA, but without Federal license its illegal to produce it.

Its legal to brew your own beer in the USA, but there actually *IS* a limit to how much you can legally produce per year, and I believe you are NOT legally allowed to sell any beer you brew yourself.

The point is, even "legal" drugs like tobacco and alcohol are still heavily regulated as to sale, production, and distribution.

I simply cannot imagine ANY version of modern cannabis legalization that will permit individuals to grow as much as they like then sell it to whomever they liked, however they liked, say, the way you could with corn.

If it sounds "crazy" that you even "should" be allowed to do this, consider that less than 100 years ago, it actually WAS perfectly permissible for most Americans to grow as much cannabis/hemp as they liked and sell it to whomever they liked in any quantity.

silasraven said:

dude check the laws you'll notice that medical is a whole lot better. you get to have more plants and pot then if it were legal. im all for making it de crim and legal but only if i get to have the same amount. i so sick of running out of meds just cause i cant afford these shit prices. making it legal will just futher bullshit prices and amounts. 15 plants and 24 OZ here yep i love medical

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Again, "legal" can mean many different things, and "medical" can (and does) mean many different things in different jurisdictions.

In my opinion, not only should no individual ever face criminal sanction for mere possession of cannabis, but no individual should have to seek license from the State or a licensed physician to possess it.

In Spain, for example, you can legally grow, possess, and consume as much cannabis as you like on your own private property. No license or prescription is required. On the other hand, cannabis sales are still illegal. Public possession and/or consumption are also illegal, though a misdemeanor crime not subject to imprisonment.

This, obviously, falls short of true "legalization" where anyone can produce, consume, purchase, or sell as much as they like, but in my opinion its still a very good decriminalization model.

Jogro said:

Not exactly.

'Legal' can mean many things.

Cigarettes are legal to possess by adults in all states, but there are significant limitations on how they can be sold. For example, in some states vending machine sales are illegal. Some states have limits as to how many packs can be purchased by an individual at once.

Alcohol is legal, yes, but there are jurisdictions States where alcohol cannot be purchased on Sundays, or after dark, or in concentrations above a certain amount.

Its legal to possess whiskey in the USA, but without Federal license its illegal to produce it.

Its legal to brew your own beer in the USA, but there actually *IS* a limit to how much you can legally produce per year, and I believe you are NOT legally allowed to sell any beer you brew yourself.

The point is, even "legal" drugs like tobacco and alcohol are still heavily regulated as to sale, production, and distribution.

I simply cannot imagine ANY version of modern cannabis legalization that will permit individuals to grow as much as they like then sell it to whomever they liked, however they liked, say, the way you could with corn.

If it sounds "crazy" that you even "should" be allowed to do this, consider that less than 100 years ago, it actually WAS perfectly permissible for most Americans to grow as much cannabis/hemp as they liked and sell it to whomever they liked in any quantity.

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you must have missed where i mentioned the taxing and regulating of cannabis, just like any other commodity.

I don't want to see patented genes, that is my only beef.