nutrient questions for first hydro attempt...

I'm starting my first hydro grow soon, and I had a few questions on when to start adding nutes.
I have a homemade bubbleponics system (for 4 plants). It's in a 10 gallon rubbermaid w/ 2 airstones and a water pump attached to tubing that feeds the individual plants.
I bought Ionic Grow, Boost, and Bloom for nutrients.
For lights, I have 2 4ft. flouros (40 watts each) for veg; and a 400w HPS for flower.
Getting everything ready for plants is still a little confusing to me. like how much water i need, how often i add water or change the rez.
HELP PLEASE
thanks

leave them without fertilizer until the second set of leaves are somewhat large and the third set starting are coming in. Then use 1/4 -1/2 strength of what is recommended until they get a little larger (4th or 5th set of leaves). What I do and seems to work really good is get some Thrive Alive with B-1 (DON'T BUY SUPERTHRIVE!!!) because this makes the roots grow really fast and it has a very small amount of N-P-K to help them out. But no matter how big they are, always check your pH and change accordingly (5.5-6.0).

racer3456 said:

lcheck your pH and change accordingly (5.5-6.0).

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The magic number is 5.8:



Got to cut it a bit finer than 5.5-6.0. You'll see nutrient lockout at either extreme.

Al B. Fuct said:

The magic number is 5.8:

Got to cut it a bit finer than 5.5-6.0. You'll see nutrient lockout at either extreme.

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While I refuse to get into an argument over 0.3 pH, this chart is somewhat oversimplified. It is actually best to start them at 5.5, and most systems will gradually creap up in pH over time. Then when it gets to 6.0, usually a few days for me, I bring it back down to 5.5. Doing it this way allows the plant to absorb the different nutrients in the amounts it needs over the pH spectrum. For example, if it's always left at 5.8, the plant will struggle to absorb Phosphorus in high amounts. Check out my chart as it is a scientific chart from an actual peer-reviewed scientific journal and not a simplified redo. As you can see from the one on the right, phosphorus is NOT locked out and in fact, there is actually more. The chart on the left is for soil, and this is where I think many people may get their confusion. They look at this chart and they extrapolate this data and apply it to hydroponics. In hydro, nutrient availability is completely different. Not to complicate matters, but one person even says that 5.2 is best, and by the chart, they appear like they could be right. Check out the third post on this page: https://www.rollitup.org/newbie-central/18253-nutrients.html

Is my grow part of 'most systems? Gee, why doesn't my pH wander?

What are the primary reasons for pH wandering? How do you fix them?

It's very inadvisable to shoot pH low. If you'd like to see a system with nute (Mg) lockout at 5.5, look here.

thanks. i appreciate the help. I've also heard good things about the Thrive Alive B-1 and i think im gonna give it a shot.

Al B. Fuct said:

Is my grow part of 'most systems? Gee, why doesn't my pH wander?

What are the primary reasons for pH wandering? How do you fix them?

It's very inadvisable to shoot pH low. If you'd like to see a system with nute (Mg) lockout at 5.5, look here.

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I'll have to go with Al on this one. Good nutrients have Ph buffers that prevent much flux. I adjust to 5.8 and use Ionic nutes (one of the few who do), I have never had any problems with Ph flux. I change my rez out every two weeks and top with fresh water between changes.

For a DWC an inch of airspace is advisable as well

NewGrowth said:

I'll have to go with Al on this one. Good nutrients have Ph buffers that prevent much flux. I adjust to 5.8 and use Ionic nutes (one of the few who do), I have never had any problems with Ph flux. I change my rez out every two weeks and top with fresh water between changes.

For a DWC an inch of airspace is advisable as well

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Ur right about the hydro nutrients preventing flux , but 0.5 ph flux is NOTHING. In fact, if it's not fluxing, I'd be questioning the calibration and/or functionality of ur pH meter. I know that most systems will rise over time because:
1.) most tap water is not 5.5 or even 6.0 out of the faucet, and it will naturally rise back to its "base level."
2.) the plants will absorb the buffer nutrients and cause it to slowly rise.

racer3456 said:

Ur right about the hydro nutrients preventing flux , but 0.5 ph flux is NOTHING. In fact, if it's not fluxing, I'd be questioning the calibration and/or functionality of ur pH meter. I know that most systems will rise over time because:
1.) most tap water is not 5.5 or even 6.0 out of the faucet, and it will naturally rise back to its "base level."
2.) the plants will absorb the buffer nutrients and cause it to slowly rise.

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I change my rez out completely every two weeks. A .5 change in ph is quite a bit. My tap water comes out closer to 7 usually 6.8-6.9. I have been growing for years in different locations with different tap water using Ionic nutes and have never had more than a .1 flux of Ph in my rez. So I guess I'm like Al and my set up is not like "most" systems.

racer3456 said:

Ur right about the hydro nutrients preventing flux , but 0.5 ph flux is NOTHING

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Sorry, you're wrong- and I'm going to let you be wrong. Fool yourself, please don't fool anyone else.

Al B. Fuct said:

Sorry, you're wrong- and I'm going to let you be wrong. Fool yourself, please don't fool anyone else.

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If you think so, but like I said before, I refuse to get in to a stupid argument. My plants never have any problems, and neither do all the other people that do it this way. But thanks for your input!

another quick question..
how many times per day and for how long should my water pump be on??

i'm not very well versed in bubbleponics, so I'll let someone with more experience handle this one. I personally like dwc, but I've also heard good thing about bubbleponics.

geekin69 said:

another quick question..
how many times per day and for how long should my water pump be on??

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Not sure why you also have a drip feed but I would have to see your system. What kind of medium are you using just a rockwool plug in hydroton? You don't want to over saturate the rockwool. If the plants are larger and you are using hydroton you can run the pump during the light cycle and turn it off during the dark cycle. Pumps running constantly tent to heat a rez so it may be advisable to cycle you pump on/off.

i'm not very well versed in bubbleponics, so I'll let someone with more experience handle this one. I personally like dwc, but I've also heard good thing about bubbleponics.

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'Bubbleponics' is another name for DWC.

geekin69 said:

how much water i need, how often i add water or change the rez.

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5L per plant seems to work pretty well. You can top up with plain water daily if you like. A tank of nutes will last for about 2 weeks, or until you have replaced the volume of the res with plain water once, i.e. you have a 50L tank and have added 50L of water to compensate for water usage & evaporation.

geekin69 said:

another quick question..
how many times per day and for how long should my water pump be on??

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What water pump? You're running a DWC, why is there a water pump?

certain bubbleponics systems have a drip feed in addition to airstones. i decided to go the extra little bit and do it since i already had a water pump and extra tubing lying around. i believe the "Stealth Bubbleponics System" has the same feature.

There's no need for a drip if you are already watering roots with a DWC.

geekin69 said:

certain bubbleponics systems have a drip feed in addition to airstones. i decided to go the extra little bit and do it since i already had a water pump and extra tubing lying around. i believe the "Stealth Bubbleponics System" has the same feature.

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This is a waste, the pump will just heat your rez. If your Nutrient solution is properly aerated there is no need. I have looked at these stealth hydro systems, its a marketing scam. I think the confusion is with what is called a "bucket" system. These are basically drip fed/NFT systems that use a bucket in a bucket to support large plants in a hydroponic system. On the dark cycle pumps are turned off an some water is left in the bottom of the buckets to feed the plants (often people confused this as a DWC system). I like the bucket systems for their yield but I prefer the perpetual harvest that a SOG flood table can provide.
Lots of confusion in the hydro world people seem to think that hydroponics has to be complicated and expensive. Its not true hydroponics can be done very simply and at very low cost.
Ok rant over hope you learned something

Thanks for covering that, NG

Al B. Fuct said:

'Bubbleponics' is another name for DWC.

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As you see now, no it's not.

To learn more about 'bubbleponics', go to this link -->http://www.stealthhydroponics.com/product.php?xProd=2&xSec=2&jssCart=8937b8148fc88bed5f427d60aadb468e As you can see, there are drip lines directly accessing the root zones. It may seem like a waste since they are basically sitting in a DWC, but hey, people have to make money somehow.
For anyone else, if they have any questions about how certain hydro systems work, go to this link --> http://www.simplyhydro.com/system.htm It explains every system in detail and how they work. If you have any other questions, feel free to shoot me a pm.