Addendum: What fits this logic is I've known other growers who have used a technique where they switch to 12/12 for just a week to ten days, then go back to 18/6 for almost two weeks, then back to 12/12 again one last time till they're finished. As a result the plants just begin to enter flowering where more dense and closer internodes with tiny branching and pre-clusters appear, and this stage is thus suspended and sustained over a longer period and the finished product winds up being super looooong and thick donkey dick colas that yield far more per plant size that they would otherwise.
OK this has been debated a million times I know..but what is the main word now?
- Thread starter missnu
- Start date
missnu
Well-Known Member
Yeah...I think I will just stick with what I've got going on...which is actually 17/7...just turns out that is what my timer is set on...So there...lol. Apparently when I was setting it those were the convenient times...was just curious to see if anyone had anything good to say about 24/0...
missnu
Well-Known Member
That makes sense...so like a quick reveg...or like flowering a clone... I believe I will try that...I am doing a good bit of LST on a Super Lemon Haze...so far it looks good...except I just realized I did it in a pot I don't plan on it staying in...dammit man! Oh well... One day I'll figure out what I like and stick to it...right now my pendulum is still swinging...
bloodstone
Well-Known Member
Do you need sleep, of course you do.
...Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz... "BEEEEEEEP!" (Alarm Clock) Yaaawwwnn... Top of tha' mornin' to ya'! Time to wake-n-bake. Where's my coffee? Man, I think I grew at least 3 inches last night without even knowing it.
Often wondered myself what would happen if one were to keep the plants in a daylight or photoperiod limbo, so to speak. Something like 15/9, or... ? Would they just finish out anyway once crossing over some hypothetical photoperiod line in the sand? Would they bloom over a longer period as a result before ripening? Would they ever ripen fully? Aaaaghhh! So many questions, so little time. Time for another Bhang hit to ponder the particulars...
gotigers0420
Active Member
I run 24/0 no matter what. The reason we grow indoors is to make the "ideal" enviornment. So what youre saying Jar man is we should mimic nature to make them grow the best? So should we make it rain, and hail (which happens all the time in an outdoor growing season), should we create an artificial frost for them, or bring in some animals to munch on them just so it seems more like "nature"? The answers would all be, no. Ive run both ways and seen no benefits to 18/6. And in 18/6 the growth was not nearly as dense and absolutely no faster to height. These have been vegged for 6 weeks from clone under 24/0 t8s. Proof is in the pudding. Granted if i ran HIDs for veg my story may be different as i am a real tight ass with my money. That and my 6x12' veg room requires no heat even way up north here.
nitro harley
Well-Known Member
I am back to 24/0....I just tryed 18/6....And I think I am better off with 24/0....
I am on my 6th grow and 4 of them were 24/0..same strain as I am growing now....The facts are in with me...and the fact is I don't have to veg as long...
It took longer to veg and the finnished product was just as good at 18/6....it just took longer......So I guess for me I am likeing 24/0...I don't worry about the cost because if I don't have to veg as long I will save money....At 24/0 I veg for 3 or 4 weeks...at 18/6 I veg for 6 or 7 weeks....so I dont care about the cost...time is more important......this is my opinion with what I have experienced my self and I thought I would post it up.........nitro....
I am on my 6th grow and 4 of them were 24/0..same strain as I am growing now....The facts are in with me...and the fact is I don't have to veg as long...
It took longer to veg and the finnished product was just as good at 18/6....it just took longer......So I guess for me I am likeing 24/0...I don't worry about the cost because if I don't have to veg as long I will save money....At 24/0 I veg for 3 or 4 weeks...at 18/6 I veg for 6 or 7 weeks....so I dont care about the cost...time is more important......this is my opinion with what I have experienced my self and I thought I would post it up.........nitro....
gotigers0420
Active Member
spex420
Well-Known Member
just the facts mam :
24/0 is best. -Ed Rosenthal
This is a direct quote from Ed Rosenthal whom most of you know is a marijuana growing guru:
----------------------------------------------
marijuana plants photosynthesize as long as they receive light as well as water, air, nutrients and suitable temperature. Photosynthesis is the process in which plants use the energy from light (primarily in the blue and red spectrum's) to combine carbon dioxide (CO2) from the air and water (H2O) to make sugar while releasing oxygen to the air.
Plants use sugars continuously to fuel metabolic processes (living) as well as for tissue building. The plant combines nitrogen (N) with the sugar to make amino acids, the building blocks of proteins. They are the substance of plant tissue. When the light is off, the plant's metabolic processes, respiration and growth, continue.
The plant can photosynthesize continuously so it produces the most energy and growth when the light is on, continuously. Continuous light does not stress the plant, which reacts somewhat mechanistically to it.
Plants under an 18-6 light-dark regimen are producing sugar only three quarters of the time. They are thus growing at only 75% of their potential. Leaving the light on continuously will result in bigger plants, faster, which leads to higher yields."
-------------------------------------------------------------
"The following information is straight from Greg Green's "The Cannabis Grow Bible"
Cannabis is a light demanding plant. Professional growers keep the light on their plants using the 24/0 photoperiod for this reason. Plants that grow under 24/0 flourish and do not need a quantity of darkness in order to rest and perform photosynthesis properly. Plants that are grown in optimal conditions under 24/0 light regime grow vigorusly and the benefits of a 24/0 photoperiod can be seen actively in the results. More nodes are formed, more branches are created, leaf numbers increase, the plant is growing at its finest.
Some growers opt to use 18/6 as their photoperiod. This is 18 hours of light, six hours of darkness light regime. Under these conditions the plant will grow quite naturally but not as vigorously as the 24/0 photoperiod.
The 18/6 photoperiod expels 3/4 the amount of light that a 24/0 photoperiod does. Although this does not mean that a plant produces 1/4 less leaves,branches and nodes under the 18/6 photoperiod, it certainly does show the correlation between light and cannabis growth. As we have said already, cannabis is a light demanding plant. There are no problems associated with 24/0 and although some have attributed cannabis sexual dysfunction (the hermaphrodite conditon) to 18/6 photoperiod these problems are actually the result of heat stress.
A 24/0 photoperiod requires that your grow room temperature be kept well monitored. The 18/6 option is cheaper to run. You use a quarter less electricity and this will have an impact on your electricity bill. Also the 18/6 photoperiod will generally extend the bulb's lifespan. During the 6 hours of darkness the grow room is allowed to cool down for this period but a well maintained good grow room setup should not require a cooling down period.
24/0 and 18/6 both share the same problem though. Once you start the photoperiod you should keep that way especially when the plants near maturity (the preflowering stage). An irregular photoperiod can cause more males than females to develop. It can also cause sexual dysfunction to appear. Whether you choose 24/0 or 18/6 as your vegetative photoperiod try to keep that photoperiod unitl your plants are mature enough to express their sex."
24/0 is superior insofar as plant growth
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Most green plants are classified as either C3 or C4 which represents how carbon(C) is used during photosynthesis.
C4 plants temporarily store carbon dioxide(CO2) over the dark period to use for photosynthesis during the day. C4 plants slow down photosynthesis once the stored CO2 is used up and they need to gather it from the air. Which is why trees slow down photosynthesis in the afternoon even though the sun is still bright. This does NOT apply to cannabis.
C3 plants(cannabis/veggies) gather CO2 only during the light period when they are photosynthesizing. During the dark period these plants only use oxygen for their metabolic life processes. They don't uptake CO2, nor do they use it. As soon and as long as the light is on, C3 plants gather and use CO2 for photosynthesis.
C3 plants also have the ability to use higher concentrations of CO2 than what is found in the air. If the light is bright enough and the plants have sufficient nutes, their growth rate will accelerate from it(2000ppm vs. 400ppm of CO2), which increases yield. They can do this continuously, wihtout a dark period throughout the vegetative stage.
The dark reaction is a process of photosynthesis that takes place in both darkness and light. It uses ATP and NADPH molecules that hold energy absorbed from light to break apart CO2 into it's base components. Because it's called a dark reaction and can occur in the dark, some people(Jorge) have said darkness is needed for this to occur. This Is Not So.
Again people get anthropomorphic with their plant needs. People need rest, so plants must too. This is false as well. Light means growth. Scientifically. Although 18/6 will shock your plants less when you switch to 12/12, it's a personal choice whether you would rather sacrifice a little growth for a quicker adjustment or less photo confusion. If you want to save money or energy that's a personal choice too. Do what you need to do to make your growing scenario work.
24/0 is best. -Ed Rosenthal
This is a direct quote from Ed Rosenthal whom most of you know is a marijuana growing guru:
----------------------------------------------
marijuana plants photosynthesize as long as they receive light as well as water, air, nutrients and suitable temperature. Photosynthesis is the process in which plants use the energy from light (primarily in the blue and red spectrum's) to combine carbon dioxide (CO2) from the air and water (H2O) to make sugar while releasing oxygen to the air.
Plants use sugars continuously to fuel metabolic processes (living) as well as for tissue building. The plant combines nitrogen (N) with the sugar to make amino acids, the building blocks of proteins. They are the substance of plant tissue. When the light is off, the plant's metabolic processes, respiration and growth, continue.
The plant can photosynthesize continuously so it produces the most energy and growth when the light is on, continuously. Continuous light does not stress the plant, which reacts somewhat mechanistically to it.
Plants under an 18-6 light-dark regimen are producing sugar only three quarters of the time. They are thus growing at only 75% of their potential. Leaving the light on continuously will result in bigger plants, faster, which leads to higher yields."
-------------------------------------------------------------
"The following information is straight from Greg Green's "The Cannabis Grow Bible"
Cannabis is a light demanding plant. Professional growers keep the light on their plants using the 24/0 photoperiod for this reason. Plants that grow under 24/0 flourish and do not need a quantity of darkness in order to rest and perform photosynthesis properly. Plants that are grown in optimal conditions under 24/0 light regime grow vigorusly and the benefits of a 24/0 photoperiod can be seen actively in the results. More nodes are formed, more branches are created, leaf numbers increase, the plant is growing at its finest.
Some growers opt to use 18/6 as their photoperiod. This is 18 hours of light, six hours of darkness light regime. Under these conditions the plant will grow quite naturally but not as vigorously as the 24/0 photoperiod.
The 18/6 photoperiod expels 3/4 the amount of light that a 24/0 photoperiod does. Although this does not mean that a plant produces 1/4 less leaves,branches and nodes under the 18/6 photoperiod, it certainly does show the correlation between light and cannabis growth. As we have said already, cannabis is a light demanding plant. There are no problems associated with 24/0 and although some have attributed cannabis sexual dysfunction (the hermaphrodite conditon) to 18/6 photoperiod these problems are actually the result of heat stress.
A 24/0 photoperiod requires that your grow room temperature be kept well monitored. The 18/6 option is cheaper to run. You use a quarter less electricity and this will have an impact on your electricity bill. Also the 18/6 photoperiod will generally extend the bulb's lifespan. During the 6 hours of darkness the grow room is allowed to cool down for this period but a well maintained good grow room setup should not require a cooling down period.
24/0 and 18/6 both share the same problem though. Once you start the photoperiod you should keep that way especially when the plants near maturity (the preflowering stage). An irregular photoperiod can cause more males than females to develop. It can also cause sexual dysfunction to appear. Whether you choose 24/0 or 18/6 as your vegetative photoperiod try to keep that photoperiod unitl your plants are mature enough to express their sex."
24/0 is superior insofar as plant growth
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Most green plants are classified as either C3 or C4 which represents how carbon(C) is used during photosynthesis.
C4 plants temporarily store carbon dioxide(CO2) over the dark period to use for photosynthesis during the day. C4 plants slow down photosynthesis once the stored CO2 is used up and they need to gather it from the air. Which is why trees slow down photosynthesis in the afternoon even though the sun is still bright. This does NOT apply to cannabis.
C3 plants(cannabis/veggies) gather CO2 only during the light period when they are photosynthesizing. During the dark period these plants only use oxygen for their metabolic life processes. They don't uptake CO2, nor do they use it. As soon and as long as the light is on, C3 plants gather and use CO2 for photosynthesis.
C3 plants also have the ability to use higher concentrations of CO2 than what is found in the air. If the light is bright enough and the plants have sufficient nutes, their growth rate will accelerate from it(2000ppm vs. 400ppm of CO2), which increases yield. They can do this continuously, wihtout a dark period throughout the vegetative stage.
The dark reaction is a process of photosynthesis that takes place in both darkness and light. It uses ATP and NADPH molecules that hold energy absorbed from light to break apart CO2 into it's base components. Because it's called a dark reaction and can occur in the dark, some people(Jorge) have said darkness is needed for this to occur. This Is Not So.
Again people get anthropomorphic with their plant needs. People need rest, so plants must too. This is false as well. Light means growth. Scientifically. Although 18/6 will shock your plants less when you switch to 12/12, it's a personal choice whether you would rather sacrifice a little growth for a quicker adjustment or less photo confusion. If you want to save money or energy that's a personal choice too. Do what you need to do to make your growing scenario work.
HDPursuit
Well-Known Member
welshsmoker
Well-Known Member
simple facts. if you got no light they stretch. if you got light they bush, they stretch in dark. thats what happens, if they got low light they stretch, simple straight under a 600w and they dont stretch so much.
Detroit J420
Well-Known Member
its evalution, some strains will do o.k under 24/0 i notice plants drooping just after 16 hrs of light up until the 18hrs shut off. then they perk right back up in the morning, a large majority of the world doesnt get more then 18 even 16 hrs of light go with the majority to be safe.. theres a daylight hrs picture of the world you can look up online. Ed dont know shit i grew some jack hearer once veged it 24/0 then to 12/12 femed seeds, and the whole length of the plant under 24/0 was pure male the rest of the branches up under 12/12 was hermie. been goin with 18/6 ever since and any standard seed that starts and finishes under 12/12 will 99% be female
gotigers0420
Active Member
"Ed dont know shit" and now if you go 18/6 you can change the genetics of 99% of seeds? Sorry man, I dont think so, and Ed would know better than to think veg lighting will change the genetics of a seed. Thats some funny shit.
missnu
Well-Known Member
Very nice and informative. I like it.
I'm so glad you know for sure what is the ideal environment actually is. Trusting you've done extensive studies on the subject. Where you're going with your examples of mimicking nature isn't relevant. Obviously mimicking a perfect Hawaiian summer, shy the monsoon season or critters munching on them would be the target. Mimicking ourdoor conditions doesn't mean outdoor growers strive for the inclement weather or pests to get better results. I've heard from many growers over the years with far more experience than either of us say contrary to your insistance about 24/0 being somehow superior. Sorry, the pudding pictures aren't impressive or prove anything you say. Daylight photoperiod hours involves more than you know. My original point was, like yourself, too many actually think they can outwit mother nature and come up with something better than natural sunlight and daylength.
Funny, I've read otherwise from Ed Rosenthal and others. Where's the link to these? Sorry, having a tough time believing in what I've heard otherwise for years. My experience is 24/0 burns 'em out eventually.
Found the reason I've long believed Ed R. said otherwise:
Deluxe Edition MGG, 1990 revised edition; pg. 114 "It is important for normal development that the plants receive a regulated day/night cycle. We emphatically recomend that you use an automatic timer..."
Though later on the same page (which I'd overlooked at the time). " Some growers leave the lights on up to 24 hours. A cycle longer than 18 hours may increase growth rate, [especially if the plants are not saturated with light]..." An almost confusing mix of terms. Admittedly, I didn't find anything else claiming 24/0 was harmful.
Deluxe Edition MGG, 1990 revised edition; pg. 114 "It is important for normal development that the plants receive a regulated day/night cycle. We emphatically recomend that you use an automatic timer..."
Though later on the same page (which I'd overlooked at the time). " Some growers leave the lights on up to 24 hours. A cycle longer than 18 hours may increase growth rate, [especially if the plants are not saturated with light]..." An almost confusing mix of terms. Admittedly, I didn't find anything else claiming 24/0 was harmful.
I know that not all plants on earth follow every rule, but Botanists agree that plants in general need a nightime period where their metabolic processes change and help keep the growth rate in balance. And maybe it's just my organic mother nature roots in me that makes me feel some degree of dark period will work out best in the long run. Can't miss if you follow what the sun does as closely as possible.