Proving "God" is real..

If science leads to God, I will believe. Faith is a fallacy.

abandonconflict said:

If science leads to God, I will believe. Faith is a fallacy.

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I admire your continued search for the closest approximation to truth. As Bill Nye used to say, SCIENCE RULES!

Zaehet Strife said:

I admire your continued search for the closest approximation to truth. As Bill Nye used to say, SCIENCE RULES!

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I was trying to bait someone to defend the concept of faith so that I could point out that Christ did not expect people to have faith, he (allegedly) performed miracles, thus completely validating his (alleged) divinity. Emulating Christ is what makes one a Christian. Therefore Faith is not a Christian tenet.

That argument only works on Christians though.

pics or it didnt happen

Do not treat skeptics like heretics.



Enter the realm of discovery. In order to do so, you must free yourself from preconceived notions and foregone conclusions.

Do not say, "Here are the conclusions. Find facts to support them."

But say, "Here are the facts. What conclusions can we draw from them?"

Now I will reference the poetry of a beautifully written epic from centuries ago. It was written to guide people and in it's time, I believe that it was a good thing, and the text still has much value.

Romans, chapter 12, verse 2, King James Bible:

"And be not conformed to this world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God."

Go discover, arrive at conclusions, do not make them.

I can't prove it

So it must be __________!

abandonconflict said:

I was trying to bait someone to defend the concept of faith so that I could point out that Christ did not expect people to have faith, he (allegedly) performed miracles, thus completely validating his (alleged) divinity. Emulating Christ is what makes one a Christian. Therefore Faith is not a Christian tenet.

That argument only works on Christians though.

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Yep. Even one of his own disciple wasn't required to have faith (Thomas), jesus had to show him the wounds to convince him. Why would jesus expect more from us than from his own disciple? That's rhetorical, by the way...

[youtube]qCqTH5MtUu4[/youtube]

I believe its Buddhism that says their faith is the science of the mind.

It was proven years ago when he re appeared on a Pringles potato chip.

I believe it was the Sea Salt flavor.

My take is simple. There has been a mix up. Religion is not the answer. It's the question. Religion is what is left after a God-man got folks interested, by revealing a higher, more better, knowledge of Self. What is the limit of Self? Any? Can you imagine Self with nothing, not even Identity? Sure you can. Religion is not the answer, but a way to help us ask the question. The concepts of Heaven, Hell, Maya, Illusion, Karma, Re-birth, Saviors, Saints, Punishments and Rewards, even Deity are just made up human concepts to ASK these deep questions about Self.

The answer is un-known and un-knowable. It's a personal experience only.

I propose this definition of God. It's unassailable, even to my atheist Dad, of 84.

ALL. All that exist. All that does not. All we know. All that we will never know.
Neither inside us, or outside. Not subject the matter energy space and time. Not an
entity, not a thing. Not existent as we would define that.

Omni-present, Omni-potent, All knowing and Un-knowable. Without even the limit of Concept

What Religions are worshiping IMO, is Super-consciousness. Knows All, Sees All, Tells All.

That's the question.