Quantitative Airstone Test. an end to the hype

Big P

Well-Known Member
sup guys I got my Flexair 7" Diffuser in the mail yesterday. It look large.




do you think this air pump can power a 7" flexdisk?






This high output pump (394 gph/ 24,800 cc/minute capacities) has four adjustable
1/4" outputs or valves that can be teed off to power up to twelve additional
WaterFarm units. In addition, growers who use our Dual Diaphragm air pump can
use it to reliably oxygenate their reservoir with air stones. Draws 8 watts.
 

Big P

Well-Known Member
ima test it out tonight with my above air pump. I guess it should work.


lol im putting 7" flexdisk in a 10 gallon tub with 1 plant and the above air pump.



OVERKILL huh :D thats how we do.
 

UnderCurrentDWC

Active Member
^^^^^

That dual diaphragm air pump is my favorite, however it only produces 20lpm, which is only enough air for one individual grow bucket, the diffuser you show will peak out @ 30lpm, so one DD air pump, 1 Flexair in 1 grow bucket is what I would recommend.
 

legallyflying

Well-Known Member
I am wondering how you plan to attach the flex air to the pump? I have gone back and forth and back and forth about how I should do it. It has a 3/4 inch male pipe thread so I was thinking that I would run 1/2 line from my one 110 LPM pump and then just t off to each of the 4 buckets with a 1/2 inch line through a gromet and then connect via a 3/4 x 1/2 elbow barb. It just seems "gay" for lack of a better word as the outlet on my pump takes a 3/8 hose and I can't find a replacement barb for it.

I guess it doesn't matter.

That pump is not really impressive. It has an outlet volume of .81 CFM (CFM seems to be the standard for industry calculations on pumps and diffusers). The design flow rate for the 7" is 0.5 to 2.5 so your definitely on the low end of the spectrum. The good news is that you will have more than enough PSI to drive the diffuser.

The cheapest high volume pump is the active air 110lpm which you can get for around $70. I am using this for 4 buckets achieving 0.98 CFM. The downside is that they run HOT.
 

UnderCurrentDWC

Active Member
One advantage of the dual diaphragm pump is the energy savings, they run @ .4watts per lpm, my big commercial pump runs @ 1.2 watts per lpm + I have to cool it with a fan adding more watts per lpm. Over time they save you a boat load of money, anything that runs 24/7 in my opinion should run as efficiently as possible.
Another advantage of one air pump per grow bucket in a rdwc is if one pump fails the system will still be able to support itself till you can fix the problem pump.

I do think attaching this 1/4" air pump to a 3/4" flexair diffuser could be a problem, however I think Big P providing 20lpm to 1 plant is right where he should be.
 

Big P

Well-Known Member
sup guys, unfortunatly I just found out my grow has been severly comprimised so I had to kill my plant and destroy all the incriminating evidence, but I did get a chance to try and connect the 3/4" flexair to the dd pump,


I took the mettal valves part off the below pump:





then i got a 1/2" plastic T:



i purchased large & small plastic tube all differnet sizes:








also some duct tape:






then I jerry rigged it to connect.

but the problem was the thing floats meanly and makes too much noise. lol I guess it doesnt matter now cuz I cant grow anymore because of some bullshit!!

thanks for the replies.
 

legallyflying

Well-Known Member
Shit man, sorry to hear that. For future reference I just made my mounts for the flex discs. Mounting it on a rigid pipe will prevent it from floating. I used 1/2" PVC pipe and male and female PVC conduit fittings with a rubber o ring to pass through the side of the container.

3/4 mpt x slip > 3/4 x 1/2 reducer > 1/2" pipe > PVC coupling through the container > 1/2" T. Then I just hard piped them all together and then ran them to a hose barb and then the air pump
 

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
I have 4 HPA grows where atomized mist feeds the roots periodically.

My interest is for the seedlings/clones bubbler, where the greater the amount of tiny bubbles breaking the surface the more O2/nutrient rich the air space above to feed the young developing roots. I am currently using a 15L/min pump (4 head manifold) but plan on replacing it with DD pump. Prior to this, I was using an Elite 802 (2 heads) and noted good root development, but nothing like this. 2 days ago, this plant had no visible roots exiting the net pot! I just transferred it to the HPA.

IMG_0896.jpg
 

Attachments

legallyflying

Well-Known Member
I'm planning on using a similar set up for rooting before going into the UC.

My active air pump took a crap on me so I opened it up. Jesus what a piece of shit. No wonder it runs so goddamn hot. The other thing I found out. There air pumps have zero warranty none. Nada zilch. So I have a 4 month old pump that they dont sell parts for and they won't warranty it. They might as well say "buy this hot piece of shit then go fuck yourself" right on the box. Such a flawed design, super thin rubber gaskets in a high heat high psi application.

I will never ever buy another hydrofarm product again!!! I guess their idea of commercial grade is having enough money to just throw shit out
 

legallyflying

Well-Known Member
I don't know man, those look like the same pumps as mine. I like the look of the other pump and have seen a couple knock offs or unbranded pumps that look identical to the alita. you know how that goes, they may be made by the same factory...just on the third shift :)This one is cranking out 150 LPM..http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aquarium-Air-Pump-Air-Volume-9150-cu-in-min-Pressure-6-53-psi-100-watt-/170754907001?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c1c91b79#ht_500wt_1244here are some pictures of my diffuser hook ups; pretty straight forward and I really like the idea of not having them float or move around.

IMGP0799.JPGIMGP0801.JPGIMGP0800.JPGIMGP0802.JPG
 

woodsmaneh!

Well-Known Member
http://www.uoguelph.ca/research/apps/news/pub/article.cfm?id=90

Higher dissolved oxygen great for productivity, health and vigor
Research > Learn About Research > News > Higher dissolved oxygen great for productivity, health and vigor
[HR][/HR]​
By Robert Fieldhouse
(Guelph, October 13, 2005)

Dissolving more oxygen into hydroponic solutions could boost greenhouse productivity and provide a whole host of other benefits too, say University of Guelph researchers.
Prof. Mike Dixon and Dr. Youbin Zheng, Department of Environmental Biology, are investigating the positive aspects of using an oxygen diffuser to increase oxygen levels in greenhouse hydroponic solutions used to grow roses, tomatoes, cucumbers and peppers.

Dr. Youbin Zheng, Department of Environmental Biology, is studying if oxygen levels can be boosted in hydroponic solutions to help growers ward off harmful microbes and boost productivity.

Photo credit: Olivia Brown
Preliminary results suggest a higher dissolved oxygen level increase productivity, health and root vigor in greenhouse plants, and helps keep harmful microbes in check.
“These findings are really beneficial to the industry,” says Zheng. “If we can use oxygen to boost plant health, making them stronger and more resistant to disease, we've discovered a very helpful tool.”
Oxygen isn't as prevalent in warm water as in cool water, so oxygen levels tend to be low -- about two to four parts per million (ppm) -- at high greenhouse temperatures, compared to eight to nine ppm in cool water. Under hot weather in the greenhouse, the root zone is especially short on oxygen, says Zheng, because root respiration depletes oxygen in hydroponic solutions. Excessive watering can further depress oxygen levels because it makes growth media, such as rockwool or coconut fibre, less porous, blocking air. These factors all weaken plant disease defense systems, making them more susceptible to disease-causing microbes such as Fusarium and Pythium which cause root decay.
To prevent this problem, greenhouse growers typically bubble air into hydroponic solutions to bring oxygen levels up to about nine ppm. But sometimes this still isn't enough.
Two years ago, the BC Greenhouse Growers' Association asked Dixon to investigate using even higher oxygen levels in hydroponic solutions. His literature review revealed that very little work had been done in this area suggesting the problem was largely ignored – until now.
Dixon and Zheng are using an oxygen diffuser recently developed and manufactured by Seair Diffusion Systems Inc., an Edmonton-based company with an interest in the greenhouse sector. The diffuser concentrates atmospheric oxygen, and dissolves it into hydroponic solutions. With this technology, oxygen levels can reach as high as 60 ppm in hydroponic solutions.
The research team is currently studying the effects of different oxygen levels, ranging from about nine ppm to 40 ppm.
So far, preliminary results are promising. But creating optimal supersaturated oxygen solutions requires extreme precision. Oxygen can be damaging at very high levels, says Dixon , so it's important to establish application methods for using this technology for different crops.
But if the methods can be worked out, Dixon says the oxygen diffusers are inexpensive and stand to emerge as an economical, environmentally friendly solution for growers looking to enhance their crops.
“Greenhouse growers are voracious technical consumers – they'll try anything,” says Dixon . “But by the same token, they're also very shrewd business people, and they won't waste money unnecessarily.”
Dixon and Zheng will continue their research and will further investigate oxygen's effect on plant growth, physiology and disease. For example, they will inoculate greenhouse plants with specific microbes to see how the plants cope with this challenge under different oxygen levels.
Other researchers involved in this project include technician Linping Wang, graduate student Johanna Valentine and undergraduate student Mark Mallany, Department of Environmental Biology.
This research is being conducted at greenhouses in Guelph and Leamington , Ontario . It is sponsored by Seair Diffusion Systems Inc., Flowers Canada Ontario and the Fred Miller Rose Research Fund.
 

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
I have Oxy stones but needed some more, so I bought one 4" fine cylinder and hooked it up to my Walmart twin air pump. The bubbles barely came out of the top but only closest to the incoming line. I thought the stone was defective. I then replaced the WMart pump with an Elite 802 and the bubbles flowed throughout the surface area of the stone. My rez never looked so clear.
 

flamdrags420

Well-Known Member
hey lf, if you do this test again, could you add a control portion to it via just the pump and a hose without an airstone? Or was this what the last thing on the test is (the 4' air tube)?
Thanks and keep up the great work
 

legallyflying

Well-Known Member
The 4' airtube was one of those cheap hoses with the little hoses in it. It performed the worst out of all them. I doubt I'll do the test again. I summarized my feelings on the whole airstone thing above.

I'll be doing a review of the diffusers once I have them installed.
 

legallyflying

Well-Known Member
Well. The flex airs arrived today. Dude, I'm pretty bummed. So I hooked for of them up to my 6psi 110 lpm pump. Not a whole lot of air coming through. Seems I don't have the psi to drive them properly. Just blowing through them with my mouth took quite allot of effort.

So in the end. They are going back
 

mike91sr

Well-Known Member
CONCLUSION

What am I going to do for airstones? Well its pretty obvious to me is the cheap old standby..the 6" blue airstones. They are a buck a piece so when your done with a cycle, you can simply pitch them and buy new ones. For me that means $16 every 3 months as opposed to $320 for 16 of the micro diffusers.
Ok, so blue stones are the way to go according to the test, gotcha!!

11. The best air stone/ diffuser on the market? Even though I haven't used it yet, the flex air discs seem to be the IDEAL airstone. high flow rates, smaller bubbles, larger surface area and virtually impossible to clog due to their design. All that for $15.. shit man, sign me up!!

The big take away? don't be a cheap fuck, buy quality gear and check that off the list of things that can go wrong.
Blue stones aren't the way to go? Expensive diffusers are the best despite proof otherwise, duh!!! Makes total sense...

Well. The flex airs arrived today. Dude, I'm pretty bummed. So I hooked for of them up to my 6psi 110 lpm pump. Not a whole lot of air coming through. Seems I don't have the psi to drive them properly. Just blowing through them with my mouth took quite allot of effort.

So in the end. They are going back
Wait, so the blue stones that YOU proved to be more effective, actually ARE more effective? And now, despite the fact that they're "worse", you're going back to them?

Glad this thread made it full circle finally. Wow... :wall: And I'm the thick-headed douche who can't be told I'm wrong here....oh wait
 
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