Seedlings drooping/ends curling down

Psylo

Member
Hi folks, would appreciate any ideas on why these are dropping and curling down so much. Thanks.

DWC
Ph about 6
EC was 1.4, I diluted to 1.15 today in case that is the issue.
Water temp about 22C/71.5F
Air temp 26C/79F
RH 67%
I tried lowering light intensity, no change so have increased it a bit now.
I have loads of airflow/bubbles (20L/min pump) so I don't see that it can be under or over watering.
 

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porkbud

Member
Were they just transferred into the dwc? Might need time to adjust to the different water and ph level if so. They don't look too bad to me color wise maybe just a little unhappy. Humidity might be too high too, 50-60% is fine for dwc room.
 
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Psylo

Member
Thanks for the reply. Been 4 days since roots poked out of the net pots and I transferred to the bucket.
I was hand watering from the top with about 1 EC for 2-3 days before that.
 

porkbud

Member
Wish I could be more helpful, hope they perk up!

Avoid changing variables too quickly like moving lights or changing nutrients as all that can contribute, and it's hard to tell what solves the problem! I know it's hard to not do that when you don't see response though :p
 

ComfortCreator

Well-Known Member
When you mention airflow, do you have fans blowing around the space and over the plants? They look good to me except they need either some breeze or more CO2 (fresh air)
 

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply. Been 4 days since roots poked out of the net pots and I transferred to the bucket.
I was hand watering from the top with about 1 EC for 2-3 days before that.
How did they look top watered? Are you sure the net basket is well clear of the solution? It's not touching it at all?
 

porkbud

Member
When you mention airflow, do you have fans blowing around the space and over the plants? They look good to me except they need either some breeze or more CO2 (fresh air)
I use two small fans, one on each side, just below the canopy, I've had issues with low pressure (no air movement) at pot/root level without the extra circulation. If you're using a powerful exhaust fan it can make that worse too.
How did they look top watered? Are you sure the net basket is well clear of the solution? It's not touching it at all?
This too, they seem overwatered, which is what i use the fans to prevent, I'm not great with dwc though i use soil.
 

Psylo

Member
When you mention airflow, do you have fans blowing around the space and over the plants? They look good to me except they need either some breeze or more CO2 (fresh air)
Thanks, this might be it! right now I have a piss-weak exhaust fan and there is barely any airflow in there. I thought at this stage it wouldn't matter (as they wouldn't be consuming much CO2). I've now got a fan blowing on them!

How did they look top watered? Are you sure the net basket is well clear of the solution? It's not touching it at all?
The pots were a bit clear but water level is much closer now (maybe touching) since I added plain water to dilute. However the problem started when there was a gap.

Avoid changing variables too quickly like moving lights or changing nutrients as all that can contribute, and it's hard to tell what solves the problem!
I totally get this! Though nothing I've done so far has worked haha. Airflow is about the last thing so hopefully that's it....
 

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
Thanks, this might be it! right now I have a piss-weak exhaust fan and there is barely any airflow in there. I thought at this stage it wouldn't matter (as they wouldn't be consuming much CO2). I've now got a fan blowing on them!



The pots were a bit clear but water level is much closer now (maybe touching) since I added plain water to dilute. However the problem started when there was a gap.


I totally get this! Though nothing I've done so far has worked haha. Airflow is about the last thing so hopefully that's it....
There must be a gap. Without one it's only going to get worse.
 

Psylo

Member
There’s a gap now, as well as a second fan to push fresh air into the tent. Not really seeing any change so far.

I’ve had to go away so they will be unattended for a number of days, no more I can do!
 

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
There’s a gap now, as well as a second fan to push fresh air into the tent. Not really seeing any change so far.

I’ve had to go away so they will be unattended for a number of days, no more I can do!
Did you cut those nets away? If not get after it. Roots might tear but it'll be okay. Wet it first. Get rid of all of it. Dig around enough to get scissors into the stuff and cut away.
 

Psylo

Member
Sorry not sure what you mean about cutting? I lowered the water level slightly so there was a small gap to the bottom of the net pots. The roots that were growing out (still pretty small) looked nice and white.
 

Psylo

Member
After coming back from some time away where they were unattended things don't look so great.

Water temp got up to 77F and humidity over 80%.

Water temp is 63F now (will drift up) and humidity is 75% and coming down.

The nutes, air pump, air stones and the rest of the actual DWC setup I've used before with decent results.

What's new is the strain, the light and the tent (last time I had a much more open environment). The room/tent is the big change.

Overall airflow is still on the low side but it's not negligible.

Any further ideas? Thanks.
 

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du$t3y

Well-Known Member
After coming back from some time away where they were unattended things don't look so great.

Water temp got up to 77F and humidity over 80%.

Water temp is 63F now (will drift up) and humidity is 75% and coming down.

The nutes, air pump, air stones and the rest of the actual DWC setup I've used before with decent results.

What's new is the strain, the light and the tent (last time I had a much more open environment). The room/tent is the big change.

Overall airflow is still on the low side but it's not negligible.

Any further ideas? Thanks.
Start Again
 

GanjaJack

Well-Known Member
Given the high humidity, they MIGHT make it.....

Usually what will happen is that the roots will melt and become slimey, no roots means it can't bring water to the rest of the plant. So the leaves droop.

Since they are real young, they MIGHT make it. But you have to keep those temps down.

At this point you have a choice, start over, or treat these like clones and allow them to bounce back and grow roots. It will probably take about 2 weeks for them to show new growth.

But you will be able to tell if you're successful in about 3 days when you lift the net pots and see if there is new root growth popping out.

Also, I don't care really what other people do... but, I fill my water up, so that the net pot is "half full". IE. I fill the entire bucket up with water, until the water fills the net pot halfway. THAT is ONLY for seedling stage. So that the seedlings roots are able to directly access water, as long as you have enough air bubbles(oxygen) bubbling around those roots, they shouldn't rot, as long as your temps stay down.

After that, once the plants get nice big set of roots, I fill it up to the bottom of the net pot. If I see little nats flying around.. I will flood the net pot up to the top , it dislodges their eggs and gives them no place to hide or have a home.

Since the water in my buckets are used up in 48 hours (Yes, plants drink a whole 5 gallon bucket in 2-3 days), I don't have to worry about root rot or stem rot when this happens.

Also, once the plants start showing roots, I put in 4 air stones,... Some people say you only need 1... NOPE... The more airstones you use, the more root growth you will get. When my plants are done, I literally have a near 5 gallon bucket full of a big ass root ball. The more root growth you get, the more you're able to supply the roots with oxygen. More oxygen supports stronger healthier larger yielding plants. This is how a lot of people have forgone the usage of C02.
 
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Psylo

Member
I don't really want to start over without knowing the cause. Problem was there very early on and cause is still a mystery. Thread title may be misleading now since they have passed seedling stage.

Roots look like they are healthy.

Could it be:
- Old/stale nutrient solution? It's a hydro store generic part A/B solution that's worked great before and I have kept stored in cool & dark place. But they are 4 years old (I last used 1.5 years ago, was all ok then).
- Lack of fresh air/CO2 (due to new tent and poor ventilation)

These are about all I can think of since other factors are the same as previous successful runs (about 3 of them, I'm still relatively new at this).
 

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Masterdank420

Well-Known Member
Poor ventilation is definitely an issue. Maybe not enough oxygen at the roots either. Im not a hydro grower but they have that droopy overwatered looked like what i see in soil. Keep the net pot outta that water and maybe add more air-stones or bigger ones? Try and keep the water temp right too. It's important as ph is. (High temps in water can cause low oxygen too)
 

Psylo

Member
Things are looking up! It looked like overwatering and I'm sure now that's what it was. I believe initially it was mainly a lack of airflow, made worse by slighty too high water temps (lower DO).

Then when I was away for a week, air flow was up (but still sub-optimal) while water temps went through the roof (crashing DO).

New growth looks pretty good and there's a small improvement in a few existing leaves. Appreciate all the input!
 

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GanjaJack

Well-Known Member
Things are looking up! It looked like overwatering and I'm sure now that's what it was. I believe initially it was mainly a lack of airflow, made worse by slighty too high water temps (lower DO).

Then when I was away for a week, air flow was up (but still sub-optimal) while water temps went through the roof (crashing DO).

New growth looks pretty good and there's a small improvement in a few existing leaves. Appreciate all the input!

The combination of low airflow and high temps.... = death.
 
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