Spider Mite Control

anyone ever use a atomizer for pesticide applications???

RemeberMe said:

Going with the CO2 gas method first (basically free for me). Here's some pics of the clones in white bags so a little light can get in to keep them from flowering. I vacuumed out the bags then filled them back up from my CO2 tank. I'll keep it on for about 24 hours.

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Pre and Post gassing shows results! I saved off a leaf that had plenty of spider mites and one that was gassed (18 hours). The non-gassed capsule still has them running around. The gas one shows no signs of life (and a few curled up ones). I'll wait to see if any of the eggs hatch in the gassed one and report back.

For the rest of the plants I'm going with Purespray which supposedly even kills the eggs.

Pic of plants after 18 hours in the bags. This is about 1 hour after getting out. Looks like they recover nicely.
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Nice to see someone else has tried my madness...Be diligent with whatever preventative, cuz they will be back if not! Lady bugs are not enough. Also if anyone else tries this, be careful not to frost bite the girls by filling the bags to fast

I am so sick of fighting these fookers, I stopped growing for a couple of months...necessity dictates I start again. I was originally going to plant some decoys and use a systemic before running the Jilly Bean and JTR...probably no time for the decoys now, but I think the idea was sound. But I think I may try the systemics if I encounter these bastards again with enough time to flush it out.

But if you get them in late flower, CO2 is perfect if you have a large enough bag.

Thanks for the tip Hayduke!

It's amazing how it also kills the eggs. After I gassed the plant I cut some heavily infested leafs off and put them in a jar and none hatched! I guess they must need air even when in the egg. I was really in a bind because it was late flowering and they were going crazy! I was trying pyrethenes spray (sp?) every night for three nights and it wasn't doing enough or anything as far as I could tell.

Lady bugs dont seem to work on spider mites they say one adult lady bug only eats like 5 adult spidermites a day .they are a prevenative but not a solution i relesed an army of lady bugs 3 times they seemed to fly off the plant wander around the room and they are attracted to your lights so they fly up to the light and get fryed not to mention the mass of dead lady bugs everywhere that grow mold when they die .REleasing alot seems to be more trouble than its worth just like 10 a plant is enough .Not a solution at all though.

kingofqueen said:

Lady bugs dont seem to work on spider mites they say one adult lady bug only eats like 5 adult spidermites a day .they are a prevenative but not a solution i relesed an army of lady bugs 3 times they seemed to fly off the plant wander around the room and they are attracted to your lights so they fly up to the light and get fryed not to mention the mass of dead lady bugs everywhere that grow mold when they die .REleasing alot seems to be more trouble than its worth just like 10 a plant is enough .Not a solution at all though.

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My experience also...released a bunch...not even works as a preventative...They seem to really like to starve to death. I think that the local pests have been exposed to so much pesticide in there past that they are quite resistant. My organic veggie garden was absolutely raped by bugs, no matter what I did. Predatory bugs also seem to be fairly smart and not eat all of their prey...rather they just manage the herd...ranchers.

If anyone chooses to try the CO2 method, or any other form of pest management...please consider your pets (kids too I suppose)...CO2 is heavier than air and obviously deadly, and most pesticides are quite toxic to cats. Piperonyl butoxide in particular which is in many Pyrethrum sprays...it is used in dog flea medications but will kill a cat. I used a small amount of Pyrethrum TR and can not rule out that it played a role in the death of our cat 7 months later. I believe it was a hepatic shunt that caused her to die in my arms while convulsing and foaming followed by mouth to face. I am not a fan of cats, but she was a decent one...Any one want a near full bottle of Pyrethrum TR???? Works great for everything but mites! Will probably kill most adult mites...but that's like kinda pregnant.

Death to spider mites!

I'm sticking with Avid combined with Stirrup-m, which is a mite sex pheromone. They come running straight at it. After a single treatment I have never found a survivor. Still, I hate mites and they make me wish for the cold months.

I am about a week from harvesting and I just noticed the mites last night. I am using a bubbleponics system and they are hiding out in the reservoir. I have not seen any damage to any of the leaves yet, but there are a lot of leaves there. Will these mites only eat fan leaves or will they go after the bud, also do I need to worry about them eating my buds while they are drying? Thanks this is my first grow.

I think I know why ladybugs are completely worthless towards spider mites. The mites are underneath the leaves while the ladybugs stay on top. Ladybugs don't go underneath the leaves, do they?

RemeberMe said:

I think I know why ladybugs are completely worthless towards spider mites. The mites are underneath the leaves while the ladybugs stay on top. Ladybugs don't go underneath the leaves, do they?

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Mine do. I think they prefer aphids.

I have been battling spider mites for the last 3 weeks.
First week I applied NEEM OIL concentrate that was 70% neem.
2 tablespoon to 1 gallon mix. I sprayed the underside of the leaves on all the plants and also covered the top.
7 days later another application of NEEM OIL. During the second application I noticed they were still there so I upped my game and started to NEEM every other day to every day. I also raised the mix to 2 1/4 tblspn for every gallon.
During my every other day stint, i noticed the numbers started to decline and most of the ones i found were white and dried out but out of every 10 found, i found 2-3 more living ones very close to the leafs main stem nestled away tightly for cover.
I would poke them with some leaf tips from ones i trimmed off and if they move, SMASH! and all the eggs too.
if all the leaves are spotted on the cluster I usually just trip it off because it looks like it's gonna die anyways.

I already gave them 4 neem oil treatments in the last week so i decided to try something else.
Yesterday I used go-nats because of the pleasant smell *cedar oil* compared to NEEM.

After reading through your post I learned a lot, switch between pestin'.
I have organicide, NEEM OIL, and Go-nats. I will start switching between them every other day.
Does anybody know the effectiveness of ORGANICIDE?
Sesame seed oil and edible fish oils..?

Organicide today since I have not used it once yet.I don't want my mites building a tolerance do i!

I have been holding off on flowering because I want to see no mites at all, plus I need to build my cooling system for the room.

Any insight will be appreciated as this is my "FIRST OWN" grow.

Also I think I'm getting a bottle of AZA-what-cha-ma-call it.
Use once or twice into the first 1-3 weeks of flowering safely?

Thanks

Photos of current plant health.

PotPower said:

Does anybody know the effectiveness of ORGANICIDE?
Sesame seed oil and edible fish oils..?

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Are you using indoors???...I could not get past the smell!!...I used it on the veggies last year, without much luck.

indoors, I guess I will hold off on it huh?
Does Go-gnats work well in keeping the population down?
Is it good to use as my other change up on them?
Or maybe I need some AVID?
I have heard some bad things about exposure to this pesticide..
I would like to stay away from it if possible but I do not want mites!

I'm using Pyrethrins .01% & Canola Oil 1.00% made by Schultz. Knocks the crap out of them but I recommend hitting them every 3 days for 3 times. It won't do you much good not to clean your grow area, if you don't your just giving them a place to cool their heels.
I also spray mist them every day while they are in Veg. with straight water.
Tim

I spray mist with water twice a day, once in the morning and once at lunch time.
In the evening, 2 hours before they go to sleep, I give them a neem treatment.

Question is, Will GONATS also work at keeping mite population controlled or bringing them down over a series of different pesticides, all of course omori listed organic. does pyrethirns come from the chrysanthemum flower?

I would like to know what other regimen I should add with my NEEM OIL treatments.

So far I am using every day to every other, neem oil and cedar oil.
Must I add avid to my mix once or twice?
I hear bad things about it when it comes to smoke and health but for getting mites out i hear good things.??

Avid remains active in your plants for 28 days. Although it does not kill mite eggs, it remains lethal so all the eggs that do hatch, those new mites become paralyzed as soon as they feed and the entire population expires. Ideally, you want to eliminate any mite population during the veg period, but you can still apply Avid if needed during the first three weeks of flowering (I've never had to do that. If there are any signs of mites when I'm ready to flower I deal with it then. Avid is very reliable. What bad things have you heard about it? If you mishandle it it will make you sick, but it breaks down rapidly in the environment. Also, the active ingredient in Avid, Abamectin, is derived from a soil microbe. Here is some real information:

ACUTE TOXICITY

Abamectin is a highly toxic material, however most formulated products containing abamectin are of low toxicity to mammals (5, 7). Emulsifiable concentrate formulations may cause moderate eye irritation and mild skin irritation (1). Symptoms of poisoning observed in laboratory animals include pupil dilation, vomiting, convulsions and/or tremors, and coma (5). Abamectin acts on insects by interfering with neural and neuromuscular transmission. It acts on a specific type of synapse located only within the brain and is protected by the blood-brain barrier. However, at very high doses, the mammalian blood-brain barrier can be penetrated, causing symptoms of CNS depression such as incoordination, tremors, lethargy, excitation and pupil dilation. Very high doses have caused death from respiratory failure (2).
Abamectin is not readily absorbed through skin. Tests with monkeys show that less than 1% of dermally applied abamectin was absorbed into the bloodstream through the skin (5). Abamectin does not cause allergic skin reactions (7).
The amount of a chemical that is lethal to one-half (50%) of experimental animals fed the material is referred to as its acute oral lethal dose fifty, or LD50. The oral LD50 for abamectin in rats is 11 mg/kg, and in mice range from 14 (5) to > 80 mg/kg (7). The dermal LD50 for technical abamectin on rats and rabbits is > 330 mg/kg (4). The oral LD50 for the product Affirm 0.011% Fire Ant Bait in rats is > 5,000 mg/kg, and its dermal LD50 on rabbits is > 2,000 mg/kg (1). The oral LD50 for the 1.8% w/v Abamectin EC product in rats is 300 mg/kg, and the dermal LD50 for this product on rabbits is > 2,000 mg/kg (8).
CHRONIC TOXICITY

In a 1-year study with dogs given oral doses of 0, 0.25, 0.5, or 1 mg/kg/day, there were no changes in tissue at any dose level. However, some dogs at the 0.5 and 1 mg/kg/day levels had pupillary dilation, weight loss, lethargy, tremors and recumbency. The NOEL for this study was 0.25 mg/kg/day (5, 8). Similar results were seen in a 2-year study with rats fed 0, 0.75, 1.5, or 2 mg/kg/day. No changes in the nervous or muscular systems were observed, but rats in all the dosage levels exhibited body weight gains significantly higher than the controls. A few individuals in the high dose group exhibited tremors (5). When mice were fed 8 mg/kg/day, the highest dose tested, for 94 weeks, the males developed dermatitis and changes in blood formation in the spleen, while females exhibited tremors and weight loss (7).
Reproductive Effects

In rats, the pup toxicity NOEL was 0.12 mg/kg/day. At 0.40 mg/kg/day, there were increased stillbirths, decreased pup viability, decreased lactation, and decreased pup weights (7). Teratogenic Effects

Abamectin has produced cleft palate in the offspring of treated mice and rabbits, but only at doses that were also toxic to the mothers (5). There were no birth defects in the offspring of rats given up to 1 mg/kg/day (7). Mutagenic Effects

Abamectin is not mutagenic. The microbial mutagenesis and mutagenicity tests in live mice were negative. One test on rat liver cell cultures was positive (7). Carcinogenic Effects

Abamectin was not carcinogenic in rats or mice fed the maximum tolerated doses. The rats were fed dietary doses of 0.75, 1.5, or 2 mg/kg/day for 24 months, and the mice were fed 2, 4 or 8 mg/kg/day for 22 months (5). Fate in Humans and Animals

Tests with laboratory animals show that ingested avermectin B1a is absorbed into the bloodstream by mammals and that it is rapidly eliminated from the body within 2 days via the feces (7, 8). Rats given single oral doses of radio-labeled avermectin B1a excreted most of the dose (69 to 82%) unchanged in the feces. The half-life of avermectin B1a residues in rat tissues averaged 1.2 days (4). Similarly, when monkeys were given a single intravenous injection of avermectin B1a, more than 90% of the dose was excreted in the feces within 7 days of the dosing (5, 8). Lactating goats given daily oral doses for 10 days excreted 89% of the administered avermectin, mainly in the feces. Less than 1% was recovered in the urine (4). ECOLOGICAL EFFECTS

Effects on Birds

Abamectin is relatively non-toxic to birds (7). The LD50 for abamectin in Bobwhite quail is 2,000 mg/kg. When exposed to abamectin in their feed for 5 days, the LC50 for bobwhite quail was 3,102 ppm, and for mallard ducks was 383 ppm. There were no adverse effects on reproduction when mallard ducks were fed dietary doses of 3, 6 or 12 ppm for 18 weeks (6). Effects on Aquatic Organisms

Abamectin is highly toxic to fish and aquatic invertebrates (7). Its 96-hour LC50 in rainbow trout is 3.2 ppb, 9.6 ppb in bluegill sunfish, 15 ppb in sheepshead minnow, 24 ppb in channel catfish, and 42 ppb in carp. Its 48-hour LC50 in Daphnia magna, a small freshwater crustacean, is 0.34 ppb. The 96-hour LC50 for abamectin in pink shrimp (Panaeus duorarum) is 1.6 ppb, 0.022 ppb in mysid shrimp, 430 ppb in eastern oysters, and 153 ppb in blue crab (6). While the above LC50 values are quite low, indicating a high level of toxicity to aquatic organisms, actual concentrations of abamectin in surface waters (fresh water) adjacent to treated areas are expected to be low. Application rates of 0.025 pounds of abamectin per acre (the highest recommended rate) should result in concentrations no higher than 26 parts per trillion in adjacent surface waters one day after the application. Rapid photodegradation and adsorption to sediments should produce even lower concentrations within days. The degradation products of abamectin are less toxic to aquatic organisms than abamectin itself (6).
Abamectin did not bioaccumulate in bluegill sunfish exposed to 0.099 ppb for 28 days in a flow-through tank. On day 28, the concentration of residues in the fish was 6.8 ppb, but this rapidly decreased to 0.32 ppb by day 42. The BCF value calculated from this study is 52, indicating that abamectin does not accumulate or persist in fish (6).
Effects on Other Animals (Nontarget species)

Abamectin is highly toxic to bees, with a 24-hour contact LC50 of 0.002 ug/bee and an oral LD50 of 0.009 ug/bee. Rapid degradation of abamectin will reduce the risk of bee deaths. Citrus and alfalfa foliage was not toxic to bees 24 to 48 hours after treatment with abamectin (6).
The 28-day LC50 for abamectin in earthworms is 28 ppm. Earthworms will not be adversely affected by use of abamectin at recommended application rates.
ENVIRONMENTAL FATE

Breakdown of Chemical in Soil and Groundwater

Because abamectin is nearly insoluble in water and has a strong tendency to bind to soil particles, it is therefore immobile in soil and unlikely to leach or contaminate groundwater (6, 7). Compounds produced by the degradation of abamectin are also immobile and unlikely to contaminate groundwater (6). Abamectin is rapidly degraded in soil. At the soil surface, it is subject to rapid photodegradation, with half-lives of 8 and 21 hours (6) or 1 day (7) reported. When applied to the soil surface and not shaded, its soil half-life was about 1 week. Under dark, aerobic conditions, the soil half-life was 2 weeks to 2 months (7). The half-life for avermectin B1a in fine sandy loam, clay and construction grade sand was 20 to 47 days. Loss of abamectin from these soils is thought to be due to microbial degradation because abamectin remained undegraded in sterile soil. The rate of degradation was significantly decreased under anaerobic conditions (6).
Breakdown of Chemical in Surface Water

Abamectin is rapidly degraded in water. After an initial distribution, its half-life in artificial pond water was 4 days. Its half- life in pond sediment was 2 to 4 weeks (6). It undergoes rapid photodegradation, with a half-life of 12 hours in water (6, 7). When tested at pH levels common to surface and groundwater (pH 5, 7, and 9), abamectin did not hydrolyze (6). Breakdown of Chemical in Vegetation

Plants do not absorb abamectin from the soil (6). Abamectin is subject to rapid degradation when present as a thin film, as on treated leaf surfaces. Under laboratory conditions and in the presence of light, its half-life as a thin film was 4 to 6 hours (6).




Pyrethrins are two chemicals which are extracted from the chrysanthemum flower's seed casings. They are the common ingredient in Raid, Doktor Doom, etc. Really ineffective on mites and can burn your plant's foliage.

PotPower said:

I spray mist with water twice a day, once in the morning and once at lunch time.
In the evening, 2 hours before they go to sleep, I give them a neem treatment.

Question is, Will GONATS also work at keeping mite population controlled or bringing them down over a series of different pesticides, all of course omori listed organic. does pyrethirns come from the chrysanthemum flower?

I would like to know what other regimen I should add with my NEEM OIL treatments.

So far I am using every day to every other, neem oil and cedar oil.
Must I add avid to my mix once or twice?
I hear bad things about it when it comes to smoke and health but for getting mites out i hear good things.??

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yes and it is the greatest thing since sliced bread!! With a pump sprayer it takes me an hour to completly spray my room. the atomizer gets her done in 15 min only. Best $200 you can spend if you have a large garden!

I just ordered some floramite. I have not seen any mites since i used azatrol every 3 days for 3 times but i am gonna keep up the azatrol untill the floramite arrives. Once it gets here i am gonna use it, then set off a C02 cannister in the room, then pyrethium bomb (the commercial kind 4% not the sissy doc. doom .04%). THen i am going to order the triple threat predetory mites. I put on my fatigues and i am declaring war on all spidermites domestic and abroad! If that doesnt rid me of them then i am gonna just quit growing and become a supertramp!

Be sure to rotate miticides. Using two at the same time is a good way to breed resistant mites. I rotate between three miticides and only spray if necessary. Using these products in an irresponsible way makes it harder for the rest of us!

Hot Shot No Pest Strip. Google it. $7.50 at home depot. 4 days and every pest will be dead, guarenteed! lol

HookdOnChronics said:

Hot Shot No Pest Strip. Google it. $7.50 at home depot. 4 days and every pest will be dead, guarenteed! lol

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And this works for mites??