The Best N-P-K

eDude

eDude

Well-Known Member
It seems to me that these 7-7-7 or 5-5-5's are for tomatoes. That's not 'bad' but it's not the best. Tomatoes for the most part are in veg and flower at the same time. So they need some more N though out. If you give flower food to a tomato you'll see what I mean. Not to say that MJ doesn't need N it needs that but I think it can do with more P and K. maybe use the 1-10-10 as a PK booster on top of your 5-5-5 making something like a 6-15-15 or go half and be like 5.5-12.5-12.5

Remember, it's not about the numbers but the ratio between them. 20-20-20 is the same as 10-10-10 if mixed at half strength. Don't get caught on the number value. Look at how it relates to the other numbers.
 
B

Brother Mouzone

Member
Hi,

Just a quick question to how nutes work in a pre-mixed soil. Im using Levington Tomorite compost, NPK of 4-4.5-8 to which some Blood Meal (npk of 12-0-0) has been added. I used 2/3's of the dosage, which im hoping will mean my soil NPK is 12-4.5-8 (close to the 3-1-2 ratio ive seen recommended in this thread). My question is will my soil stay at 12-4.5-8 the whole way through Veg? My guess is it wont, as the plants will use up any nutrients in the soil over time? In which case where does that leave my NPK?

Secondly so far the only other 'food' they get is 1tsp of Blackstrap Molasses every other time I water them. Will this in addition to the nutrients in my soil be enough?
 
HeartlandHank

HeartlandHank

Well-Known Member
Uncle Ben said:
There shouldn't be an issue mixing them. But, do the jar test if in doubt. Come up with a final NPK value, add them together and toss into a jar, add water, shake and observe. High quality foods will not form precipitates and drop out of solution. I can, and do, take 15 lbs. of plant food, say, a 30-5-15, add to 5 gallons of warm water and it dissolves perfectly and fast with some stirring without precipitates. (In case you're wondering what I'm doing, I'm drip fertilizing thousands of plants.)

The following list is not a complete salts profile, but I'll pull what I don't recommend based on the NPK values only:

If you need supplements, then the above fails to provide complete nutrition.

Someone pissed off alot of money:

supplements:
general hydroponics kool bloom 2-45-28
supernatural super boost 10-49-10
fox farms big bloom organic 0.01-0.3-0.7
bio grow 1.8-0.1-6.6
humboldts countrys own snow storm 0-0-3
general hydroponics flora nectar 0-0-1
general hydroponics chi 0.2-0-0.2
grandma enngys humic acid
cal mag 2-0-0
botanicare cal-mag
age old grow mycorrhizae

With coco and soil-less mixes, you need 16 essential elements with no one element "outweighing" the other. The only one-for-all product I know of is Dyna-Gro. IOW, for $26 you can have a liter each of a 9-3-6 and a 3-12-6 of a very complete, well designed food which doesn't scam you into buying alot of other crap because the base products are incomplete. Remember, the cannabis industry is all about the money. Profits are OK in my book, scams aimed at noobs who don't know any better are not.

With well prepared potting soils - additional compost, worm castings, peat moss, alfalfa meal and such, you should be using a food designed for such soils like Peters or Schultz. Cheap and it works great. You'll find they have up to 12 essential elements. For example, look at this food's profile:
http://petersabc.com/PDFs/Peters Pro/99720ppro24-8-16FPL.pdf

UB
Click to expand...
This is very old, I know. But are you saying that when growing with coco Jacks 30-10-10 Orchid Special and the 10-30-20 bloom would not be complete for growth from clone to harvest?
I was planning on giving this a try in the future and was doing some reading on the matter.
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
HeartlandHank said:
This is very old, I know. But are you saying that when growing with coco Jacks 30-10-10 Orchid Special and the 10-30-20 bloom would not be complete for growth from clone to harvest?
I was planning on giving this a try in the future and was doing some reading on the matter.
Click to expand...
I'm putting coco in the same category as soil-less so I'm recommending a complete food like Dyna-Gro. You can try Jacks. It's almost as complete as Dyna-Gro foods but originally designed by Jack Peters for orchids grown in a bark mix.

There are different forms of coco. If you feel it breaks down like other organics thereby releasing elements for uptake, then use Jack's foods. I used to use it for orchids growing in lava rock and it worked pretty well.

UB
 
HeartlandHank

HeartlandHank

Well-Known Member
Uncle Ben said:
I'm putting coco in the same category as soil-less so I'm recommending a complete food like Dyna-Gro. You can try Jacks. It's almost as complete as Dyna-Gro foods but originally designed by Jack Peters for orchids grown in a bark mix.

There are different forms of coco. If you feel it breaks down like other organics thereby releasing elements for uptake, then use Jack's foods. I used to use it for orchids growing in lava rock and it worked pretty well.

UB
Click to expand...
Thanks for the rec. I've been on HnG coco a+b 5.4-3.4-9.4. Cut back base nutes to about 60%.
For 8 wk plants... Using Top Boost 0-.7-.6 for wk 5. Bud xl .4-0-.2 wk 4 to 6. Straight phd water with an occasional bud xl for week 7 and 8. Root excel and MultiZen or Hygrozyme.

It is House and garden coco. not cubes, not chunky. So coir and fibers i suppose. Top fed/hand watered, drain to waste.

Will definitely be trying the dyna gro. It looks like there is 10-5-5, 9-3-6, 7-9-5 and 3-12-6.

Maybe...
10-5-5 and 3-12-6
9-3-6 and 3-12-6
7-9-5 and 3-12-6
9-3-6 alone.

if you have a recommendation on these combinations, or another, it would be great to hear it. by your posts prior, im guessing 10-5-5 and 3-12-6 or 9-3-6 alone.

As far as jack's, maybe Jack's Tropical foliage 24-8-16 is a good one part option? Maybe as effective as the two part 30-10-10 and 10-30-20. http://www.jrpeters.com/Products/Jack-s-Professional/Jack-s-Pro/Specialty-Crop-Formulas/24-8-16-Tropical-Foliage.html

I ask about Jack's as well as I'm planning a side by side comparison with two flower rooms. two different plants in two rooms. Hand watered, so both plants both rooms get the side by side. Peakseedsbc Northern Lights and a Green Crack s1. 4 plants per 600watt in 42 in tomato cages, 14 oz per light with the above nute schedule. if i could kick that up a little, or even save a buck and stay at 14 per that would be great. mixing a+b and ph'ing in 15min intervals (as directed) is getting old too.

If you had a donate here link i would be all over it. I appreciate any advice.
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
The Jack's Tropical Foliage would be excellent. That's what cannabis is, a tropical or sub tropical plant. That's the food I use often by Vigoro but Vigoro doesn't contain Mg. Looks like you'll have to buy a 25 lb. bag though. Not to beat a dead horse but I discussed my approach in the Foliar Spray thread.

The general approach is a 9-3-6 for foliage, 3-9-6 for bloom. Where folks go wrong is not reading their plants right or ignoring what their plants are telling them, again as I said in the Foliar Spray ditty.
 
HeartlandHank

HeartlandHank

Well-Known Member
Uncle Ben said:
The Jack's Tropical Foliage would be excellent. That's what cannabis is, a tropical or sub tropical plant. That's the food I use often by Vigoro but Vigoro doesn't contain Mg. Looks like you'll have to buy a 25 lb. bag though. Not to beat a dead horse but I discussed my approach in the Foliar Spray thread.

The general approach is a 9-3-6 for foliage, 3-9-6 for bloom. Where folks go wrong is not reading their plants right or ignoring what their plants are telling them, again as I said in the Foliar Spray ditty.
Click to expand...
Great. Thanks. Sorry to throw this horse beating stick back your way. I think I knew the answer. I was in the foliar thread as well. I think I will run through that thread again. There was some good info in there. Would like to read on the UREA application as a quick green up again.

I've been noticing the lack of N and various lockouts in the plants for some time now. Here's to addressing the problem..

I'll side by side dyna gro 9-3-6 + 3-12-6 (using my eyes, not a calendar) and Jack's Tropical.

I saw that...25lb bag is not such a bad thing. I can use it on a few jobs and in the backyard.

Thanks again.
 
smokebros

smokebros

Well-Known Member
UB,

I had some nutrients donated to me.


What are your opinions on using Roots Buddha Grow NPK
2 – 0.25 – 1.5

If 1-1-1 is added?
3 - 1.25 - 2.5 ratio.


Roots Buddha Bloom NPK
0.5 – 2 – 1
Does this bloom formula have too much of a P to N ratio where it would cause micro deficiencies?

I am considering two options.
Option 1 is to use the nutrients named above.
Option 2 is to just purchase new nutrients like 3-1-2 grow and 1-3-2 bloom.

I would really appreciate your take.
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
smokebros said:
UB,

I had some nutrients donated to me.


What are your opinions on using Roots Buddha Grow NPK
2 – 0.25 – 1.5

If 1-1-1 is added?
3 - 1.25 - 2.5 ratio.


Roots Buddha Bloom NPK
0.5 – 2 – 1
Does this bloom formula have too much of a P to N ratio where it would cause micro deficiencies?

I am considering two options.
Option 1 is to use the nutrients named above.
Option 2 is to just purchase new nutrients like 3-1-2 grow and 1-3-2 bloom.

I would really appreciate your take.
Click to expand...
I'd use what you have, observe, and then go from there. No need to split hairs. Read your plants.
 
ROLLING12

ROLLING12

Well-Known Member
Growing the feminized Berry, THC, Super Lemon Haze, and LSD from seed (1 of each). They are now entering day 3 of their 3rd week of veg. I've got them on a solid homemade aeroponic system doing 15 minutes on and 30 minutes off with a 400W HPS light doing 18hrs on and 6hrs off at about 18" away from the top (horizontal) attached to a hammered light-reflector. Though no fans nor Co2, these meds are not enclosed in a closet nor confided in a tight space. Based on the hand test, the temp feels like tropical hotness but not too much as to burn.

I've been using advanced nutrients' Micro, Grow, Bloom, B52, and Overdrive, and also adding canna rhizotonic and cannazym to the mix.
Here's my nutrients input for a 3-week vegetative cycle:
during the first two weeks I use Rhizotonic as directed and 2mL of Overdrive per L in my reservoir;
then for each week of the 3 weeks of veg, I use:
B-52 at 2mL per L;
Micro at 5mL per L;
Grow at 4mL per L;
Bloom at 4.5mL per L.

As far as the flowering cycle, I am planning on using:
Cannazhym as directed for each week;
Micro at 4mL per L foe each wk;
Grow at 4mL/L the 1st wk then 4.5mL the 2nd wk, and 5mL for each wk after that;
Bloom at 4mL/L duringn the first half of the flowering cycle, then increasing to 5mL/L for each wk after that;
Rhizotonic as directed for the first 2 wks only;
Overdrive at 2mL/L the 1st wk and the last 2 wks only;
and B52 at 2mL/L from the 3rd wk until the beggining of flushing;
I am planning on doing a flushing with nothing but tap water for one week right before harvest. Okay so based on the set up, the strains and the feeding program what can I do to improve and get better? I was refered to Dyna Gro instead of AN but I wish I could find a feeding program based on specific strains, could anyone refer a book or webpage on that or does it not yet exist? Thanks4helping!
 
ROLLING12

ROLLING12

Well-Known Member
By reading my plants I use the Leaf Deficiency Chart and if I see a lack of something, I add the nutrient that has the needed ingredient in it and see what happens. Though there is one reservoir for the four different strains mentioned above, so... what's up here? I should split the reservoir into two? one for Indica and one for Sativas?
 
ROLLING12

ROLLING12

Well-Known Member
I'm leaving the reservoir as is but I lowered the nutes since these plants share the same reservoir but have different needs. Education never stops. THC Bomb, Berry bomb, LSD and SLH are doing great. That Berry has got the thickest stems of them all! And they are all so compact! They look like a bunch of 100 year old bonzai trees! They are finishing their week 4 of veg this week with almost zero nutrients afterall for this week only; I'm going to start their flowering cycle right after this week and re-continue their feeding program stated in the bolded post above. Also, I came across this reference page for the NPK values when making your own nutrients, economical and 100% organic, go to: https://www.rollitup.org/blogs/blog22184-list-npk-values-organic-materials.html#comment51421 Peace, love and harmony!
 
patlpp

patlpp

New Member
@rolling12 Why are U using Overdrive in Veg and during week 1 of flower? It calls for the last 2 weeks of bloom only. FYI if u use it earlier, say week 1-4 of bloom your plants will not bulk up. This is from experience. In any case, Overdrive will initiate new growth BUT it will be at the sacrifice of harvesting later. I did the math and found that using it will not outweigh the additional time. In other words it is a waste of money if you are under time constraints. One more thing: Betcha if you nix all the additives and go 1.6 EC throughout bloom, ALL your plants will be fine.
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
ROLLING12 said:
Growing the feminized Berry, THC, Super Lemon Haze, and LSD from seed (1 of each). They are now entering day 3 of their 3rd week of veg. I've got them on a solid homemade aeroponic system doing 15 minutes on and 30 minutes off with a 400W HPS light doing 18hrs on and 6hrs off at about 18" away from the top (horizontal) attached to a hammered light-reflector. Though no fans nor Co2, these meds are not enclosed in a closet nor confided in a tight space. Based on the hand test, the temp feels like tropical hotness but not too much as to burn.

I've been using advanced nutrients' Micro, Grow, Bloom, B52, and Overdrive, and also adding canna rhizotonic and cannazym to the mix.
Here's my nutrients input for a 3-week vegetative cycle:
during the first two weeks I use Rhizotonic as directed and 2mL of Overdrive per L in my reservoir;
then for each week of the 3 weeks of veg, I use:
B-52 at 2mL per L;
Micro at 5mL per L;
Grow at 4mL per L;
Bloom at 4.5mL per L.

As far as the flowering cycle, I am planning on using:
Cannazhym as directed for each week;
Micro at 4mL per L foe each wk;
Grow at 4mL/L the 1st wk then 4.5mL the 2nd wk, and 5mL for each wk after that;
Bloom at 4mL/L duringn the first half of the flowering cycle, then increasing to 5mL/L for each wk after that;
Rhizotonic as directed for the first 2 wks only;
Overdrive at 2mL/L the 1st wk and the last 2 wks only;
and B52 at 2mL/L from the 3rd wk until the beggining of flushing;
I am planning on doing a flushing with nothing but tap water for one week right before harvest. Okay so based on the set up, the strains and the feeding program what can I do to improve and get better? I was refered to Dyna Gro instead of AN but I wish I could find a feeding program based on specific strains, could anyone refer a book or webpage on that or does it not yet exist? Thanks4helping!
Click to expand...
I'm curious, do you have any idea of the NPK values your plants are getting?

If you need a feeding program, a chart or a schedule, you really shouldn't be growing.

UB
 
L

ltjs

New Member
I have gone through the thread and see a few people having similar problems like me in the flower stage. Right now I am only using Humboldt nutrients bloom natural 0-10-0 which explains the yellow leafs. I was thinking of switching up the nutrients a bit. I was thinking of sticking with Humboldt nutrients but adding the Age Old Bloom to it 5-10-5. Here is a list of the all the nutrients I will be using. Humboldt Nutrients (hn) Bloom Natural 0-10-0, hn deuce deuce 0-0-22, hn honey es .45-.25-1.8, and the Age Old Bloom 5-10-5. Added it all up and the npk should be around 5.45-20.25-28.8. Now would the p 20.25 and k 28.8 be too much? or would I have to do half dosage on the hn Bloom Natural and the hn deuce deuce? which will bring the final result to something like 15 for p and 18 for k. Im still a noob but trying to make as much sense of this possible.
 
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