Two killed in botched grow robbery...

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reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
It's only bad if it's misinterpreted, i think (though we can assume plenty of people will misinterpret it that way...).

It's good because not only were the growers defending their property (from imposter "DEA agents" no less), they were defending their children (one of whom was apparently kidnapped during the incident, but they let her go w/out further harm).

It's also good because it *should* discourage other would be home-invaders... although it could have the opposite effect, and cause other would-be-robbers to be more aggressive.

I shared this because: 1) it's complex, there's a lot going on there, and 2) i consider it a successful defense of the home, despite any cultivation charges which may result.

It's good and bad. The residents defended themselves from unwarranted aggression, and the invaders who didn't die, got caught.

Do you think these same robbers would have been more or less likely to attempt something like this, if they were allowed to cultivate their own cannabis? I have to say i think they would rather grow their own, than risk the consequences of imprisonment and/or death. Though i suppose there are people out there who would rather be predators than farmers. If cannabis were readily available and not prohibited, it wouldn't be worth such extreme risks to rob a grow home. Imagine if even 1 in every 10 people grew cannabis. There would be more than enough for everyone who wants it. There would be no motivation to rob anyone for it, because 1) it would be easy to get if you wanted it, and 2) it would be hard to sell, because of #1.

Also, the 2nd amendment issue: what would have happened if those farmers had no guns? The criminals would have guns anyway. Most likely, the story would have been about a whole family being murdered for their weed. Luckily, they were prepared and equipped to defend themselves.
 
C

CC Dobbs

Well-Known Member
I noticed that a couple of the names of the robbers sounded foreign, as in Mexican and Chinese. Lets get some immigration people in here to look this over for problems.

Messiah
 
Yodaweed

Yodaweed

Well-Known Member
Wow just read the story that's crazy. Makes me feel naked since I got rid of all my firearms since it's illegal for medical patients in Colorado to own firearms.
 
natro.hydro

natro.hydro

Well-Known Member
reasonevangelist said:
You just convinced me not to move to Colorado. A damn shame too, because i'm sure i'd love the mountains.
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Hate to tell you is but you have anything over an ounce at your residence amd a firearm (most of the country) they are gonna look to slap you with intent to distribute and furtherance of drug trafficking with a firearm and that last one is no joke. It is the reason I do not keep my 12 gauge in the same location as my grow

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I547 using Rollitup mobile app
 
R

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
natro.hydro said:
Hate to tell you is but you have anything over an ounce at your residence amd a firearm (most of the country) they are gonna look to slap you with intent to distribute and furtherance of drug trafficking with a firearm and that last one is no joke. It is the reason I do not keep my 12 gauge in the same location as my grow

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I547 using Rollitup mobile app
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One of the problems with this whole situation, is that the government agencies have contrived all these "precedents," upon which to base unjustifiable and erroneous assumptions, and somehow, these are acknowledged as "legitimate" by "honorable" judges, in courts across the land.

I sometimes forget just how oppressed we really are. Our government is not Our government, anymore; they are infidel usurpers.

Your comment reminded me of that guy in FL who got murdered by a drug task force raid, in which only a roach was found in the house... and they falsely justified their actions by calling it "armed trafficking," just because he had a gun, and a judge declared it justified. (there's a link in the "pigs are out of control" thread)
 
Yodaweed

Yodaweed

Well-Known Member
Yep pretty fucked up how they treat us hippies we don't want to hurt anyone we just want to grow our marijuana and protect our families. I live in Colorado it is ghetto here tons of illegal immigrants here especially in pueblo, they won't hesitate to pull a gun and shoot I mean honestly what will their punishment be anyway? Deportation? They would probably be released from the jail because our government cant afford to take care of our immigration problem. On the other hand I am a US citizen and have been my whole life but just because I have a bad back and found marijuana to be the best treatment I cannot legally own a gun and defend myself so I am just a target to any thug with a gun that wants to steal my buds so I am super paranoid and never tell anyone anything about my grow or where I live I almost feel like I cant have friends.
 
colonuggs

colonuggs

Well-Known Member
Yodaweed said:
Wow just read the story that's crazy. Makes me feel naked since I got rid of all my firearms since it's illegal for medical patients in Colorado to own firearms.
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That's FUNNY..... Who told you you couldn't own any firearms???? Better yet, why did you listen to them??

I live in Colorado, own 10 handguns... have my CPL and I'm a MMJ patient and a grower.... I'm never giving up my weapons

Question # 5 on the CPL application asks.." Are you a UNLAWFUL user of, or Addicted to marijuana"...

The answer to that is "NO"....It is LEGAL to use, not UNLAWFUL for adults to use marijuana in Colorado...So you are NOT lying on the application and Marijuana is no reason not to have a handgun.... You are not ILLEGALLY using marijuana, you are within the law
 
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Yodaweed

Yodaweed

Well-Known Member
colonuggs said:
That's FUNNY..... Who told you you couldn't own any firearms???? Better yet, why did you listen to them??

I live in Colorado, own 10 handguns... have my CPL and I'm a MMJ patient and a grower.... I'm never giving up my weapons

Question # 5 on the CPL application asks.." Are you a UNLAWFUL user of, or Addicted to marijuana"...

The answer to that is "NO"....It is LEGAL to use, not UNLAWFUL for adults to use marijuana in Colorado...So you are NOT lying on the application and Marijuana is no reason not to have a handgun.... You are not ILLEGALLY using marijuana, you are within the law
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WRONG, ANY USE OF MARIJUANA IS ILLEGAL FEDRALLY SAME PLACE YOUR GUNS ARE LEGAL ( CONSTITUTION) HAVING WEAPONS AROUND A MARIJUANA GROW IS A BADDDDDDD!!!! IDEA IT GETS THE FEDS INVOLVED THEN YOU GOTO PRISON!
 
R

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
colonuggs said:
That's FUNNY..... Who told you you couldn't own any firearms???? Better yet, why did you listen to them??

I live in Colorado, own 10 handguns... have my CPL and I'm a MMJ patient and a grower.... I'm never giving up my weapons

Question # 5 on the CPL application asks.." Are you a UNLAWFUL user of, or Addicted to marijuana"...

The answer to that is "NO"....It is LEGAL to use, not UNLAWFUL for adults to use marijuana in Colorado...So you are NOT lying on the application and Marijuana is no reason not to have a handgun.... You are not ILLEGALLY using marijuana, you are within the law
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"Why did you listen?"
Because threat of consequences (this gets most people).

As for whether whatever we each choose to do with our own bodies... how can any such thing be legitimately "unlawful," if an individual is harming or endangering neither other people nor their property?

When the law is wrong (and it is), should anyone feel forced to comply with it? NO.

But the enforcers of unjust laws, don't give a shit about right or wrong, they only care about "the law is the law" and "just doing my job." And they will indeed "just do their job," regardless of whether it is acceptable to do so. This is a HUGE problem, and it never ceases to offend and disgust me, that so many people go along with it, and so few are doing anything about it, and so many of those who won't, will actually argue in favor of the unjust laws, solely because they are afraid of the potential consequences of speaking out (or better yet, acting out) against our so-called "justice system."

At some point, people need to decide they will not follow or comply with unjust laws, and will not acknowledge the invalid authority asserted by our corrupt government.

I'm tempted to say "it's going to get ugly..." but it has already been incredibly ugly for a very long time; people are just taught to look the other way, and to fear being caught on the wrong side of a system which enforces injustice, while calling itself the opposite.
 
Yodaweed

Yodaweed

Well-Known Member
This is why I listen. This is the law and if you break it you go to prison.



Is it legal to have a medical marijuana prescription and purchase a firearm? No.
Look at the BATFE's 4473 form, called the Yellow Sheet, which you must fill out when purchasing a firearm through a dealer.
http://www.thundertek.net/documents/4473.pdf
Look at question 12 e. It asks a purchaser: “Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?”
Remember, this is a federal form, so it’s asking if the purchaser is a user to a (federally deemed) unlawful substance. Federal law still considers the use marijuana illegal. So, a legal Colorado user of marijuana could not answer 12 e. with a “No”. And if you answer “Yes”, you can’t buy a firearm from a dealer.
Also, the 1968 Gun Control Act says (TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 922) click here for a link:
(d) It shall be unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person—
(3) is an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance (as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802));

Can someone who has a medical marijuana prescription possess a firearm? No.
18 U.S.C. § 922 (g)(3) and 21 U.S.C. § 802 both prohibit anyone who is a user or is addicted to any controlled substance, including marijuana, from possessing, owning, purchasing, receiving, or having within his custody any firearms.

Can someone who has a medical marijuana prescription get a concealed handgun permit? No.
From Colorado Revised Statutes, 18-12-203
Criteria for obtaining a permit
(f) Is not an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance as defined in section 18-18-102 (5). Whether an applicant is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance shall be determined as provided in federal law and regulations.
So, on every CCW application, you'll see this question:



"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

So, unless federal law is changed, application for a permit usually is denied, since federal law still considers the use of marijuana unlawful
 
R

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
Yodaweed said:
This is why I listen. This is the law and if you break it you go to prison.



Is it legal to have a medical marijuana prescription and purchase a firearm? No.
Look at the BATFE's 4473 form, called the Yellow Sheet, which you must fill out when purchasing a firearm through a dealer.
http://www.thundertek.net/documents/4473.pdf
Look at question 12 e. It asks a purchaser: “Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?”
Remember, this is a federal form, so it’s asking if the purchaser is a user to a (federally deemed) unlawful substance. Federal law still considers the use marijuana illegal. So, a legal Colorado user of marijuana could not answer 12 e. with a “No”. And if you answer “Yes”, you can’t buy a firearm from a dealer.
Also, the 1968 Gun Control Act says (TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 922) click here for a link:
(d) It shall be unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person—
(3) is an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance (as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802));

Can someone who has a medical marijuana prescription possess a firearm? No.
18 U.S.C. § 922 (g)(3) and 21 U.S.C. § 802 both prohibit anyone who is a user or is addicted to any controlled substance, including marijuana, from possessing, owning, purchasing, receiving, or having within his custody any firearms.

Can someone who has a medical marijuana prescription get a concealed handgun permit? No.
From Colorado Revised Statutes, 18-12-203
Criteria for obtaining a permit
(f) Is not an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance as defined in section 18-18-102 (5). Whether an applicant is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance shall be determined as provided in federal law and regulations.
So, on every CCW application, you'll see this question:



"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

So, unless federal law is changed, application for a permit usually is denied, since federal law still considers the use of marijuana unlawful
Click to expand...
And on that note: i consider cannabis prohibition unconstitutional, tyrannical, illegitimate and invalid, i.e. "unlawful."

Their law is unlawful. It is Not My Law, and according to what i understand about the validity of law, why we have laws, why laws are made... they are actually breaking MY law, by terrorizing innocent citizens over a plant that is unconstitutionally and illegally prohibited.

The only problem is: they have the better organization and are better equipped to use violence to impose their will, so we're at a huge disadvantage, which can and has resulted in unjustifiable murders by the mercenary henchmen employed by our usurped government.

They can write whatever law and claim "this is law," but they're imposing laws that are not allowed to be made, which makes them not enforcers, but terrorists.

So it comes down to: they'll kill you if you don't comply, whether they "have the right to do so" or not. They don't care about my rights, your rights, or apparently even their own. And yet people are taught to respect them? What a wonderful world.
 
Yodaweed

Yodaweed

Well-Known Member
reasonevangelist said:
And on that note: i consider cannabis prohibition unconstitutional, tyrannical, illegitimate and invalid, i.e. "unlawful."

Their law is unlawful. It is Not My Law, and according to what i understand about the validity of law, why we have laws, why laws are made... they are actually breaking MY law, by terrorizing innocent citizens over a plant that is unconstitutionally and illegally prohibited.

The only problem is: they have the better organization and are better equipped to use violence to impose their will, so we're at a huge disadvantage, which can and has resulted in unjustifiable murders by the mercenary henchmen employed by our usurped government.

They can write whatever law and claim "this is law," but they're imposing laws that are not allowed to be made, which makes them not enforcers, but terrorists.

So it comes down to: they'll kill you if you don't comply, whether they "have the right to do so" or not. They don't care about my rights, your rights, or apparently even their own. And yet people are taught to respect them? What a wonderful world.
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You sound like a total idiot dude. We elected these officials to represent us, and at the time of representation marijuana prohibition was open amoungst the general public. Times have changed but the laws haven't and if you live in America you should obey the laws otherwise you are a criminal. Colorado has given us the opportunity to grow marijuana legally and you want to look at your cake and eat it too. Good luck I hope you don't get busted but don't tell people the wrong laws so they are in the same situation as you, people should know what the law is so they can decide if its worth following or not.
 
R

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
Yodaweed said:
You sound like a total idiot dude. We elected these officials to represent us, and at the time of representation marijuana prohibition was open amoungst the general public. Times have changed but the laws haven't and if you live in America you should obey the laws otherwise you are a criminal. Colorado has given us the opportunity to grow marijuana legally and you want to look at your cake and eat it too. Good luck I hope you don't get busted but don't tell people the wrong laws so they are in the same situation as you, people should know what the law is so they can decide if its worth following or not.
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The Federal law is wrong, Period. That law should never have been allowed to become law, and no, i did not elect any of those officials to represent me, and i did not ever consent to anyone legitimizing the prohibition of cannabis.

Cannabis prohibition is Unjust and Unconstitutional, no matter which way you slice it, and for our government to use tax dollars taken under duress, to fund enforcement of unjust laws we do not want, is the real crime.

I am not unaware of the law; i am aware that it is unacceptable and invalid, which most people apparently aren't. It seems most people believe all laws are valid, regardless, just because some people decided to make them law, while disregarding the unconstitutionality and lack of justifiable basis for those laws.

I don't live in CO, and i don't own firearms.

These states are not united, and its citizens are not free.

We will all die someday. I will do as i please with my existence, until it ends.
 
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