Undercurrent CCH20 DIY (Current Culture)

Hey everyone. I had posted regarding an Eb and Flow grow I wanted to pursue a few weeks ago but before I wound up buying the system I saw a video on the Current Culture undercurrent system. It's pretty gnarly, and I have heard nothing but great results about the undercurrent system. I've decided I'm using heat exchangers, a deep freezer with a reservoir plumbed inside of it to cool it (and possibly a water cooled c02 burner if I decide tanked isn't the route I want to go).

Anyway. I spent HOURS searching online and couldn't find much more than a shitty DIY system most people made with $300 and some cheap shit. I'm a firm believer that you get what you pay for (within reason, obviously). But today I managed to make essentially the same UCE12XL13 system which retails at about 2419.95, and created it for...about $1400. This is a minimal DIY kit, using mostly genuine Current Culture equipment I found on there website. I've never ran a hydro grow before (I think I'm a smart guy, I'll pick it up) but using the manuals provided by Current Culture and the parts list(s) I managed to find. I think FOR THE MOST PART I have this system pretty figured out. I'm sure a few adapters are missing and some of the plumbing you'll have to do yourself (Sorry, no pics to come with this DIY yet, or instructions for that matter. I suggest using this:
https://www.atlantishydroponics.com/itemimages/instructions_UC _9_26_11.pdf

I also used this price sheet:
http://www.cch2o.com/resources/CCH2O_Retail_Price_List_1.01.13.pdf

This explains the differences in some of the equipment as well:
http://cch2o.com/parts_uc.html

Last resource was googling random part names and model numbers for what exactly I needed. If any interest is showed in the thread I'll take pictures when I actually get it all in the mail and assemble it. If a source isn't listed, it's because with the model name available it's readily available on Google and it took me absolutely no time to find. Some parts I had to chase down a bit longer than others. The intake and return manifolds I decided weren't worth the $56 and $102 or whatever that they cost. I couldn't justify spending more than $50 on it using the Uniseals (which are more than enough to keep your system from leaking with a good bucket). I'm not against the 3" spin tight bulk heads but I feel its just unnecessary. I thought about using it on the manifold ends and using the Uniseals from pot to pot in the middle but...I think the Uniseals will be more than enough seeing how hard they are to install.

Finally, long awaited...

My parts list;


13 pal EZ STOR * 12 = $244.32
http://www.bayteccontainers.com/13-gal-square-ez-stor-pail-no-handle.html

3" Uniseal * 26 = $160
http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=89947&catid=477&clickid=searchresults

4" holesaw = $16

3 in x 10 ft PVC Schedule 40 Foam Core Pipe * 3 = $26.55

3/16 ID x 100 ft Clear PVC Hose = $22
http://www.amazon.com/Clear-PVC-Tubing-Wall-Length/dp/B000FN0OXA
($10 from CCH20)


Medium Round air stone * 12 = $24
($2.50 from Current Culture * 12 = $30)

Undercurrent 13 Gallon Epicenter kit - $210
EPICENTERCOMPLETE13 Includes: 13 gallon Epicenter™ module, Uniseals™, Epicenter™ lid, 9” Air Diffuser Disc, Diffuser Disc Manifold, Epicenter™ Kit: Adjustable Float Valve with Reservoir Adapter Kit, Drain Valve, Return Pump Diffuser, Chiller Adapter, Garden Hose Drain Adapter.
http://growgreenmi.com/current-culture-undercurrent-13-gallon-module-epicenter-complete-kit

Evolution Fitting kit - $60
http://hydrobuilder.com/evolution-fitting-kit.html
($52 from Current Culture)

8" Net pots * 12 = $120
http://hydrobuilder.com/8-heavy-duty-net-pot.html
($5 from CCh20 * 12 = $60)

3/4" return hose (25 footer) = $35
http://hydrobuilder.com/return-hose.html

Danner Mag-Drive 950 (MAG950) - $120

Air Force Pro 80 Linear Air Pump - $180
http://www.greenerhydroponics.com/Air-Force-Pro-80-Linear-Air-Pump_p_78772.html

Return Pump Manifold 13+ Kit (RETURNL13+KIT) - $20

Air Force Pro 15 Linear Air Pump - $90
http://www.greenerhydroponics.com/Air-Force-Pro-15-Linear-Air-Pump_p_78769.html

Most of that should go together without much work. Like I said, some adapters and pvc corners aren't on the list (Real total is $1327 - there is some wiggle room). It's 3 inch. You know the shape you want it. You'll figure it out. As for the lids, I'm just going to trace the net pot, drill a hole, and use a jigsaw. You should also round the edges of the pipes before you put them into the Uniseals. Lets see....Any other thoughts.

Anyway, I'm hoping to produce 16 oz a plant in this system (I'm building two identical copy's of it). I think I can probably do better than that though. Plus rotating 50 SOG in a 3x6 flood table in the back closet. *shrug*

We'll see how it goes I suppose. Sorry I get high and rant.

I think the only other plumbing missing is 4 - 90 degree corners (3"), and a 3"-3/4"-3" T adapter to connect the return line kit too (maybe a reducer/something to thread that kit onto - hardware store will have it all).

Saving a ton of money, and I scoured the internet to find and consolidate this parts list. I've heard of the list being created on a few forums but this is the first time I've ever seen it readily available.

Maybe I'm the only one who cares. >.<



Mine was designed for two rows of six. Not 3 rows of 4. It seems to me logically that the water would flow better only having 2 paths so there is less 'fighting against itself' in the pipes and the currents figure out which way the path of least resistance is. Even though I did get a fatty air/water pump(s).

Oh, I also (for the same price), decided to just make a shitload of bulkhead fittings for myself.

http://www.truetex.com/bulkhead.htm is where I got the idea.

The parts were from Menards (Except the 3" seal you can google)
http://www.menards.com/main/electrical/rough-electrical/pvc-conduit-fittings/3-schedule-40-female-adapter/p-1715987-c-6424.htm - $2.90 each

http://www.menards.com/main/electrical/rough-electrical/pvc-conduit-fittings/3-schedule-40-male-adapter/p-1715995-c-6424.htm - $2.85 each

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/plumbing/orings/gaskets/3-inch-epdm-short-shank-gasket
$0.75

So bulkhead fittings I can build for...$6.50 each. Which is about the cost of a Uniseal. I know which method I'm using.

Not trying to knock your hustle bro, but i think you over spended on the system you are trying to build. With that 1400 you couldve built your uc and buy a chiller for it. Build to suit your needs, not how they want you to do it im almost done building mine and im at 425 bucks plus the new xxxl air cooled hood i just purchased. I got a few pics that i havent posted yet cuz of my laziness...lol

Holy shit! I just notice that pic of that uc system. Is that the one that you a trying to replicate? Im fucking twisted right now....way to many bong rips.

Disregard my first post.....geesh im gonna go lay down, im done...lol

Yeah I am building the exact same one as the picture except mine is 2 rows of 6 instead of 3 rows of 4. Like this:



I mean, I'm sure I could get some of the parts for cheaper (Parts of the kit I ordered) but...I don't want to have to run around and try to make adapter to adapter to adapter to this and that. I'd rather just have it all be efficient, and clean.

It's not your ordinary style system that's for sure. I don't think people will really appreciate this thread as much as I did (Or thought they would've). I looked on the internet for days to find all this information in one place and couldn't. (My Google chi is good usually). Maybe when I put mine together with some DIY pictures it'll attract more attention.

I'm getting all the parts ordered this week for the first build.

Also with the amount of water that will be in the reservoir, I would need a 1/2+HP chiller which are $500+.

I'm perfectly content using my 6 YARD deep freezer with a half inch copper manifold inside circulating water through with some sort of fan blowing (If I can get a fan to keep working full time in the freezer?) up on them. I feel that if I could run the cooler on its absolute coldest and maybe throw some Ice bags in the bottom to kind of absorb and radiate the cold, maybe with enough tubing I could actually not use a reservoir at all for my chilling and have it all on a "closed loop" system. I'm high lol. I made this to describe it. Maybe just throw a 35 gal reservoir on each side to make sure the flow is split well between all the hoses. I may even just with tanked Co2 since I'm using a Fuzzylogic controller. (Cap Xgc1e). Seems like a waste not to.



Yeah I'm building a room that reflects the quality of this setup. This isn't your average builders home made DWC system made out of scrap Walmart parts.

This is the big daddy shit.

http://hydrobuilder.com/under-current-evolution-12-xl13.html

I guess I'm only saving $700 anyway. I guess fuck it I'll just buy it.

I got a few PMs asking about similar setups so I will update:

The Rubbermaid smartstore or whatever 18 gal totes I used have too thin of a sidewall for the uniseal to seal correctly so I spent $500 on 13 (1 extra just in case) buckets and lids, 13 gallon each (Ezstor buckets).

Should be good.

Other than that the system went together fairly easily MAKE SURE TO CHAMFER the pvc you run between the totes. Will save you so much frustration when you have to do 25 of these. I've had to take mine apart together...5 times now between all the leak testing and changes. Everything else seems to be going fine. I have a few pics but, I don't think the overall interest level is worth my effort emailing them to myself and saving them to post them here.

Killer thread bro. I'm about to do the same and have been parting out/sourcing for a couple weeks now. Subbed. Did you end up going with that all inclusive setup instead? Only thing I would personally sub out would be the Danner Mag and the DIY bulkheads. I'm heavy into the aquarium hobby and Mags are considered sort of a second rate pump. Run hot and aren't efficient. They're $$, but check out Reeflo pumps if you ever wanna upgrade that Mag.

i see in your link that the bucket is white. Do NOT get white buckets. They do not act as light barriers, and you can see through the bucket EASILY with even a small cfl light on the other side. Make sure they are black. Not blue, Not white, Black.

Friendly Caregiver said:

i see in your link that the bucket is white. Do NOT get white buckets. They do not act as light barriers, and you can see through the bucket EASILY with even a small cfl light on the other side. Make sure they are black. Not blue, Not white, Black.

Click to expand...

Sorry, this statement is simply inaccurate. It depends solely on the composition of the material, the density of said material, as well as thickness. Blue, Black, white, pink, orange... takes a back seat to the above variables. A white HDPE bucket can easily be just as lightproof as a black pvc bucket

Bump for an update, how did this turn out for you? Also what benefit does chamfering the pipe add?

I'm changing out the res tonight so I don't have a lot of time but I wanted to stop in. First off; you're ignorant if you think the color of the bucket REALLY matters. First off, you can breed enough beneficial bacteria that it won't even matter if light is in your res (See Heizenberg's Tea Recipe), secondly - It's REALLLYYYYY easy to tape a piece of panda film to a bucket. I paid $500 for the buckets as it were from US Plastics. Black wasn't an option. I didn't think inside the box.

Oh; and chamfer every pipe. If you took one thing from this entire thread. CHAMFER EVERY PIPE.

Also, try to make your manifolds REALLY square; a small imperfection each way can cause an issue with plant centers and then plant growth and then all sorts of things down the line. I wound up tossing up my first one and making a second one.

Gotta go empty the system out.

I cut my system down to 9 plants tonight due to size constraints. I had pulled 3 buckets about 3 weeks ago due to some sulfur burn; flushed them and threw them in soil and they came back looking pretty good. So I had these 3 extra buckets running nothing. The roots were absolutely amazing. I took some pictures; maybe I'll get around to adding it; but...I vegged these for 2-3 weeks in a flood table and it slowed my initial root growth. As soon as it hit the undercurrent system it exploded.

How did you get it water tight? I tried for weeks to set one up... ended up with 2" uniseals and pvc and 5 gallon buckets; I couldn't get it to stop leaking even with aquarium silicone. You are right about the shitty rubbermaid containers... tried square ones and usually they just split like cheap pieces of shit when you push pvc through the uniseal.

I was having leak issues with the shitty totes. As soon as I converted to the expensive US plastics tote with the stiff sidewall - I haven't had ANY leaking at all through the uniseals, even through weird angles.

13 gal EZ store on 3" PVC working fine for me. I even turned the pump off to see if it would leak with it sitting and not in vacuum. It had a tiny pinhole leak on the manifold so I marine expoxy'd it.

If you buy a good bucket and it has a stiff sidewall - It just flat out won't leak. I spent $500 on 13 buckets (Shipped price).

Also some changes I've made since this initial post (Not all were necessary and I don't want to try to explain myself here. I'd rather buy too good of equipment instead of just enough.) These include:

1/2 HP water chiller (Got online for around 750$)
1800 GPH Danner Pond pump (125$?)
700 GPH Danner Pond on the chiller
2 - 110 LPM air pumps with in line check valves - 12 way air manifolds ($110 each)

Definitely worth going with the name brand air stones over some generic Petsmart brand. I bought them all and then threw them out and replaced them with Active Aqua stones and some giant ass air diffuser "H" that can handle 80 LPM by itself which was... $60 online.

You get what you pay for. Remember that. Through all the struggles of adapting this to that and this to this and that to there and this and that. I might've just paid for the CCH20 kit (My budget at the time was like $7000 smaller so it wasn't necessarily the same option). I would've saved 20 trips to the hardware store, to town, waiting to order more of this online (Prices online just can't be beat - flat out; Even for the same exact product. Most offer discreet shipping).

Did you use the Dow Corning vaccum grease on the seals and pipe? I've been wondering if the drain on the epicenter is necessary. Thinking that you could just put a bypass or disconnect at the return to the epicenter and use the pump to drain the system.

I used whatever I had handy. Vegetable oil worked well.

I didn't have a drain on the epicenter, but a set of ball valves on each return line was mandatory to simplify filter changes and for the system drain I just use my main system pump and plumb it to a garden hose which runs through my house once a month for two hours. Really not an inconvenience. It doesn't however empty the last of the buckets which I generally try to do with a shop vac (At least as low as possible, recycling 10% of the last months nutrient mix doesn't appeal to me).

What is so special about these Under Currents?

All I've done in the past is DWC and want to try RDWC (for solution stability and a reasonable way to auto-topoff if I'm out of town for a few days). I've done a lot with marine reef tanks in the past so I know about oxygenation, heat from pumps, ph stabilization in small systems versus large ones, etc. But I don't see why these are any better that a thought-out DIY one. I have a very small workable space, anything bigger than a 4'x6' footprint won't work for me. Anything more than about four plants would be a waste for me anyway. I see htgsupply sells the Under Current 4 bucket but it is $800+ !!! I guess I'm missing something. Thanks for any opinions.

noosphere said:

What is so special about these Under Currents?

All I've done in the past is DWC and want to try RDWC (for solution stability and a reasonable way to auto-topoff if I'm out of town for a few days). I've done a lot with marine reef tanks in the past so I know about oxygenation, heat from pumps, ph stabilization in small systems versus large ones, etc. But I don't see why these are any better that a thought-out DIY one. I have a very small workable space, anything bigger than a 4'x6' footprint won't work for me. Anything more than about four plants would be a waste for me anyway. I see htgsupply sells the Under Current 4 bucket but it is $800+ !!! I guess I'm missing something. Thanks for any opinions.

Click to expand...

I almost made a DIY guide for this setup (as well as a grow journal) but the community didn't show interest and I wasn't going to waste my time I could spend doing something else - as this system is one of three that I run in my home. If a 4x6 area is the best you're working with then you might want to look into some Eb and Flows you can move around so you still have the larger water displacement (Actually now that I'm cut down to 6 sites I'm only running 60 gallons). It's about the hyper oxygenation and water movement, nutrient stability, and of course....explosive root growth. This is my first grow not in soil. I'm not saying these roots are impressive or anything but - I'm just flowering these and those are 13 gallon EZSTOR totes they are in.

Make up your own mind. You can see up top on the root mass where I vegged them in a flood table. The time they spent in the flood table was an absolute waste when watching the quality of the roots as well as the quantity of the roots produced in the UC DWC system.

Thanks very much for the reply. I was misleading in saying 4'x6'. That would be my actual plant area. Auxiliary stuff included I have about a 4'x10' area but height is limited in part of it (it is under a staircase). My little 3 bucket DWC worked great but controlling ph and topping off was a major pain in the behind. I spent so much learning as I went along (buy cheap, buy twice) I'm trying to avoid that this time and do it right. I like electronics and ended up with a CO2/ph controller and had amazing results with the CO2 but was never able to figure out a feasible way to deal with ph in three separate systems.

That is one impressive root mass. You don't have any algae problems with the white buckets?