Using Native Soils.

Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
For those of you that do guerrilla type grows, amending native soils is pretty much a waste of time unless you use the same plot year after year?.

I just spent an entire summer running identical clones both indoor/contained soil, and outdoors starting with some of the best native soil on the planet:

http://soils.usda.gov/technical/classification/orders/mollisols.html

The above soil(full of worms)was even amended prior to planting, and fed the same Epsoma Plant-Tone I use indoors. I dumped humus as a mulch on plants numerous times.

Yet, after all the work the outdoor is 30% less potent than the identical indoor clones taken from same mother.

I am so disappointed that no matter how much I did all summer, even harvesting/drying the same as indoor produced an inferior product.

Now I understand why Med growers replace soil.

:peace:
 
J

junior870

Member
im in illinois, and our soil is extemely fertile. but, i do add a bag of MG bag soil, to my 3x3 holes i dig, just as an added boost.
 
Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
junior870 said:
im in illinois, and our soil is extemely fertile. but, i do add a bag of MG bag soil, to my 3x3 holes i dig, just as an added boost.
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Not enough nutes for a 6 month in-ground in corn-belt Illinois, at least the top 2/3 of the state.

http://www.espoma.com/p_consumer/tones_plant.html

I used this in addition to soil amending in Illinois, as per bag instructions for in-grounds...and should have tripled the amount used.
Chopped 2 weeks ago.IMG_2989.JPG
 
T

TWS

Well-Known Member
Im not sure if you can blame it all on soil. Some strains do better or worse from indoor/outdoor. All so factor in weather,temps,lighting,bugs,etc. How did your other strains do ? And yes. Feeding a plant in a small pot with un devoted attention is a lot different then a big hungry plant outside. Maybe next year use or add another form of scratch in. It does seem like Epsoma gets used up fast.
 
T

TWS

Well-Known Member
Im seriously thinking about re using my soil next year but kinda worried and seems like a big gamble though. It was amened indoor soil and it worked fine this year. This is winters indoor soil amended to run again indoors. Bring on the bugs. lol
 
Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
TWS said:
Im not sure if you can blame it all on soil. Some strains do better or worse from indoor/outdoor. All so factor in weather,temps,lighting,bugs,etc. How did your other strains do ? And yes. Feeding a plant in a small pot with un devoted attention is a lot different then a big hungry plant outside. Maybe next year use or add another form of scratch in. It does seem like Epsoma gets used up fast.
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What about using a shitload of Jobes organic spikes?. Epsoma has a great product line, but 5-3-3 isn't enough for in-grounds competing w/the natives...plus it contains a lot of stuff already present in mollisol(loam). I like the spike idea b/c it cuts down on application trips, but not sure if even those would be enough.
 
Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
TWS said:
Im seriously thinking about re using my soil next year but kinda worried and seems like a big gamble though. It was amened indoor soil and it worked fine this year. This is winters indoor soil amended to run again indoors. Bring on the bugs. lol
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Mix DM powder/earth into the blend?...that's how I deal w/gnat larvae or root aphids.
 
BarnBuster

BarnBuster

Virtually Unknown Member
Sunbiz1 said:
Not enough nutes for a 6 month in-ground in corn-belt Illinois, at least the top 2/3 of the state.
.
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I'm at 40N a little East of you and amend my soil with as much as I can carry in. This is just for a few plants, best spot on top of a end moraine rise. Great drainage in early spring but gravely soil and I use same spot every year. Interesting experiment with the clones. Our outdoor season was pretty average around here, little wet early on. How did you measure potency?
 
Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
BarnBuster said:
I'm at 40N a little East of you and amend my soil with as much as I can carry in. This is just for a few plants, best spot on top of a end moraine rise. Great drainage in early spring but gravely soil and I use same spot every year. Interesting experiment with the clones. Our outdoor season was pretty average around here, little wet early on. How did you measure potency?
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Potency was not measured via traditional methods, but rather old school using independent testers with samples of both. We all simply came to conclusion that, "There is something missing". Perhaps this strain doesn't care for a ton of sun, and they had a LOT of it. The outdoor version also needed a good cure for proper flavor, yet indoor version tastes great even prior to cure.
 
S

shizz

Well-Known Member
im a outdoor native soil guy..... you have to get rid of the weeds and tree roots they suck the nut out. if you dig a hole 3 feet wide and kill all the roots youll see a big dif.. and if you go bigger then that even more.... and youll see from yr to yr how much they roots from trees grow back to that area. its amazing.... placing a garbage in the hole really does help to keep out the roots... just filling it back up with native soil works great..
 
S

shizz

Well-Known Member
if you read my post you can see iv changed alittle and quilty is getting better and its less work and time in the feild less chance of getting caught
 
Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
shizz said:
im a outdoor native soil guy..... you have to get rid of the weeds and tree roots they suck the nut out. if you dig a hole 3 feet wide and kill all the roots youll see a big dif.. and if you go bigger then that even more.... and youll see from yr to yr how much they roots from trees grow back to that area. its amazing.... placing a garbage in the hole really does help to keep out the roots... just filling it back up with native soil works great..
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Only problem w/this is I use locations one cannot exactly walk in and out of carrying a pick-axe.:lol:

Would have to use a fold-up tool.
 
L

LIBERTYCHICKEN

Well-Known Member
Sunbiz1 said:
Only problem w/this is I use locations one cannot exactly walk in and out of carrying a pick-axe.:lol:

Would have to use a fold-up tool.
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Pick up a used metal dectector , Shovels , picks, buckets are common gear . You may even want to invest in a metal decteor lisence 10-50$ a year
 
Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
TWS said:
Please explain.......
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It was recommended for vegging outdoors by Jorge Cervantes, due to barnyard having a high N content. As you may recall, I had to deal with yellowing leaves all summer.

Also picked-up some Earth Juice bloom yesterday for the indoor drizella ladies I'm about to flip, but guessing that it would work well for in-grounds.

As you can see, I'm doing a lot of guessing these days!.

:peace:
 
OddBall1st

OddBall1st

Well-Known Member
shizz said:
im a outdoor native soil guy..... you have to get rid of the weeds and tree roots they suck the nut out. if you dig a hole 3 feet wide and kill all the roots youll see a big dif.. and if you go bigger then that even more.... and youll see from yr to yr how much they roots from trees grow back to that area. its amazing.... placing a garbage in the hole really does help to keep out the roots... just filling it back up with native soil works great..
Click to expand...



I`m a native soil guy myself too. Your advice is good . He also said he mulched something over the soil, not a good idea either. I use gravel, fish tank or something I screen out myself. It`s also not a good idea to remove the stone from the soil.

You hit the nail with the crowded space. That clearing is easy, those ragweed can be pulled out with your hands, roots cut off and left to die in the soil. The ground their can be turned with a carpenters flat bar or straight claw hammer. (You don't need a pick-ax there). I prep in the fall and turn and plant in the spring. Plants seem to like last years nute`s . Clones don't tap deep like a seed sprout will.

I would do the experiment at least five times in five different location before drawing any conclusions with a indoor plant going outdoors.

Last years work for this years grow. (or they`ll get drunk)
 
Sunbiz1

Sunbiz1

Well-Known Member
OddBall1st said:
I`m a native soil guy myself too. Your advice is good . He also said he mulched something over the soil, not a good idea either. I use gravel, fish tank or something I screen out myself. It`s also not a good idea to remove the stone from the soil.

You hit the nail with the crowded space. That clearing is easy, those ragweed can be pulled out with your hands, roots cut off and left to die in the soil. The ground their can be turned with a carpenters flat bar or straight claw hammer. (You don't need a pick-ax there). I prep in the fall and turn and plant in the spring. Plants seem to like last years nute`s . Clones don't tap deep like a seed sprout will.

I would do the experiment at least five times in five different location before drawing any conclusions with a indoor plant going outdoors.

Last years work for this years grow. (or they`ll get drunk)
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I mulched w/compost, as per previous posting...like this:

[video=youtube;CTzH8W09EZs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTzH8W09EZs[/video]

Also, my removing all the native plants defeats the purpose of using them as camo.
 
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