what changes have YOU made and seen the biggest improvement in quality?

I like everything except the 48 hours of darkness. Absolutely no reason to do that plus it plays havock on the plants.
I mean sure, florigen levels will skyrocket and the plant will begin flowering immediately. But as soon as you go to 12 again, the levels will drop down to where they would normally be.

I think it's just grower myth that's been perpetuated and perpetuated. Dude, plants flower when it gets dark. Let's make it REALLY dark, then the will like super flower!

The idea of giving the plant a dark period just before harvest comes from the theory (possibly fact IDK) that TCH in the tricheads acts as sun block for the plant. Read info on UVB lighting and equatorial strains for more info.

Many feel the function of the THC is to provide a protective covering for the seed development from harmful/mutating UV rays. A number of studies claim that the during the dark period (night) the THC production continues and during the day a % of the THC is degraded by UV rays. Most agree that stimulating the plant with UV rays triggers an increased THC production rate but would also lead to an increased THC decomposition rate. Thus one would expect, following this logic, that if you boost THC production gradually throughout flowering then remove the source of decomposition you will build up a small boost in THC levels just prior to harvesting, the damage this may do to other areas of the plant is negligible at this point when overall plant health is of little to no importance.

Not sure if this was mentioned.As mundane as it seems but patience.I think better results are always obtained through patience.

Stellah said:

Not sure if this was mentioned.As mundane as it seems but patience.I think better results are always obtained through patience.

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Probably the best non-laughable advice yet.

DonPepe said:

The idea of giving the plant a dark period just before harvest comes from the theory (possibly fact IDK) that TCH in the tricheads acts as sun block for the plant. Read info on UVB lighting and equatorial strains for more info.

Many feel the function of the THC is to provide a protective covering for the seed development from harmful/mutating UV rays. A number of studies claim that the during the dark period (night) the THC production continues and during the day a % of the THC is degraded by UV rays. Most agree that stimulating the plant with UV rays triggers an increased THC production rate but would also lead to an increased THC decomposition rate. Thus one would expect, following this logic, that if you boost THC production gradually throughout flowering then remove the source of decomposition you will build up a small boost in THC levels just prior to harvesting, the damage this may do to other areas of the plant is negligible at this point when overall plant health is of little to no importance.

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I hope you were not directing this at canna wizard and I. If you were, you need to reread what we both commented on because your reading comprehension skills are awful.

Yeah I understand the theory of dark before harvest. The suggestion that I don't understand the theory of, and frankly, think is horse shit, is subjecting a plant to two days of darkness before flipping to 12/12 in order to somehow "jump start" the flowering process

Proper well balanced nutrition, aerated room temperature water, and studying each issue i have had. No one thing. Trying different methods and nutrients until i found what worked well. Patience grasshopper.

legallyflying said:

I like everything except the 48 hours of darkness. Absolutely no reason to do that plus it plays havock on the plants.
I mean sure, florigen levels will skyrocket and the plant will begin flowering immediately. But as soon as you go to 12 again, the levels will drop down to where they would normally be.

Click to expand...

legallyflying said:

I think it's just grower myth that's been perpetuated and perpetuated. Dude, plants flower when it gets dark. Let's make it REALLY dark, then the will like super flower!

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With all due respect, have you experimented with it?
You are absolutely correct about it triggering a strong hormonal change but the part about the florigen levels stabilizing as soon as the 12/12 cycle starts, I might have to disagree with you on this.

When I start my 12/12 cycle with 48hrs of uninterrupted darkness, it's more to reduce stretching than to jump start flowering, I should have added in my post that I also turn the lights completely out for another 24hrs right after week one.

But hey if it doesn't sound good to you, no worries bro, it's pretty simple, don't do it.

can someone point in the direction of published data -- where specific hormones/florigen from dark photo periods help reduce stretching in cannabis sativa strains? not here to argue about anyone's opinion, just trying to see if there is any scientific study done to lend to that notion.

*i'm currently reading this http://www.plantcell.org/content/18/8/1783.full (its on "florigen")

DonPepe said:

The idea of giving the plant a dark period just before harvest comes from the theory (possibly fact IDK) that TCH in the tricheads acts as sun block for the plant. Read info on UVB lighting and equatorial strains for more info.

Many feel the function of the THC is to provide a protective covering for the seed development from harmful/mutating UV rays. A number of studies claim that the during the dark period (night) the THC production continues and during the day a % of the THC is degraded by UV rays. Most agree that stimulating the plant with UV rays triggers an increased THC production rate but would also lead to an increased THC decomposition rate. Thus one would expect, following this logic, that if you boost THC production gradually throughout flowering then remove the source of decomposition you will build up a small boost in THC levels just prior to harvesting, the damage this may do to other areas of the plant is negligible at this point when overall plant health is of little to no importance.

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--i was under the assumption that it wasn't the purple spectrum (ultra violet) that degraded THC+ but the visible spectrum (blue/red/green) of sunlight.. ?

ignoring certain advice. see my sig.

cannawizard said:

can someone point in the direction of published data -- where specific hormones/florigen from dark photo periods help reduce stretching in cannabis sativa strains? not here to argue about anyone's opinion, just trying to see if there is any scientific study done to lend to that notion.

*i'm currently reading this http://www.plantcell.org/content/18/8/1783.full (its on "florigen")

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Hey bro I'm not looking for any arguments or debates, I didn't start a thread telling everybody to start doing it, I just responded to the question in the OP. Like i told legallyflying, if he or anyone else thinks it's BS, it's simple, don't do it.


A couple of years ago I was talking to a well know breeder in the Bay Area when he brought up flowering hormones and how he had a power failure in one of his veg rooms. Apparently his lights went out for over three days and he had a hell of a time getting them back into veg because he said the uninterrupted dark made the plant release hormones to halt leaf growth and start the flowering stage. after that I started researching "flowering hormone" and came across a couple of articles on florigen.

The link below is not a cannabis study but combined with the information I had, it was enough for me to start playing around with the photoperiods of a couple of plants.
From what I gathered, the hormone florigen instructs short day plants to stop the production of leaves and start the production of flowers.

Is it scientific, of course not but I did notice a small decrease in stretching when I started with 48hrs of darkness followed by another 24hrs after week one. What I'm not sure about are other factors like the temperature drop because of the lack of light or the rise in RH or the lack of far red light, but one thing for certain is, there's a subtle change and it works for me.
it works for me.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/howtogrow/fruitandvegetables/7532224/Key-to-sweeter-tomatoes-uncovered.html

cannawizard said:

--i was under the assumption that it wasn't the purple spectrum (ultra violet) that degraded THC+ but the visible spectrum (blue/red/green) of sunlight.. ?

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I may be wrong but I was taught that UV light actually increased THC production and that it was indeed the visible light and heat that causes the degradation of THC.

1. Flushing isn't drowning, so don't over do it. Just double your run off % for the last 2 weeks . You'll still get fade,tasty flowers, and yield is allowed to increase. Plants don't like being drowned for 2 weeks without anything, and I've never really seen better results by flushing my soil with over 2 times my regular amount of water. It's fun to harvest everything at once, but honestly flushing too heavily kills yields on the lowers. I harvest every plant 2 times; the first time I take the tops with 5-20% amber and anything faded out. The lowers are left to mature another 4 to 6 days. Yields went up 10% and the lowers more towards the center end up being the most resinous because they are allowed to finish, and they are protected the whole grow.

2. Defoliating. Before flowering I defoliate any foliage that I feel will not be saturated enough with light to compete with the canopy. Though this can be done after the onset of flowering, I like to begin about 2.5 weeks before the 12-12 flip. I thin out side shoots as they come up to prevent them from using energy, leaving the leaves on stem so that it can stretch to fit into the canopy above. It is an ongoing process, but the goal is to produce fewer branches with larger overall production. It got me to nearly 1g/w and I feel that this method makes fewer, larger, higher quality buds.

3. Organics/Supersoil/Fading. Supersoil isn't just about being one of Subcool's followers. A lot of people have different methods of cooking organic supersoil to their liking, but Subcool's recipe is a great place to start. Ever since I started putting soil with heavier nutes at the bottom, I have noticed increase resin production early in flowering, and amazing colors in the last few days of flowering. Green buds fade to; blue, purple, orange, red, and yellows. Organics are now taken seriously, when my plants are in this type of system they just seem to be on overdrive.

4. Carbs. Molasses is awesome for lowering ph of low ppm water, it adds in a nice mix of cal/mag, and increases energy to your rhizosphere. Using it too much will have bad results, a lot of people say to use 1tbs/gallon when using it. I use 1tsp/gallon, and feed it 3 to 4 times per flowering period depending on strain. Since using it my plants have picked up more funk to their smell; generally all the aromatics have increased. This was one of the first tricks I learned early on.

5. Harvesting/ Trimming. The way you trim can have a large effect on the final quality of the cannabis buds. I like to take everything green off, give that too my worms, then I trim all sugar leaves with exposed stems into the trim bucket. After crushing the cut stem ends, I hang for three days until the buds go from being super juicy, to having a more robust form, also thinner branches tend to not flop around when they get dried for a few days. Then I do a final trim. This amount of drying shrinks up the buds a bit and makes it easier to reach some of the sugar leaf stems. 70% of the work before you hang, 30% 3 days after. I know a lot of people like to talk about letting the plant sit in 24 or even 48 hours of darkness before harvest, personally I know that the plant is still alive when you cut it down, and it remains alive for the next day at least. End result, is whiter flowers in your jar

6. DIY and Workers Pride. Ever since starting to make my own nutrients, recycle my soil, create cabinets, and raise cannabis; I have noticed that my quality threshold increased, and my bullshit half-assed threshold decreased. Doing things yourself creates a pride in your work that alters your thinking and leads to better quality. You no longer settle for O.K. You want the best, and you are willing to make it if no one is up to the task. Truly you make all of the important changes, and if your head isn't in the game you may not be making the right calls.

Really great question, and even better answers. It would be great to have "1 Million and 1: Ways to increase cannabis potency" on rollitup.
Sincerely,
ILovePlants

legallyflying said:

I like everything except the 48 hours of darkness. Absolutely no reason to do that plus it plays havock on the plants.
I mean sure, florigen levels will skyrocket and the plant will begin flowering immediately. But as soon as you go to 12 again, the levels will drop down to where they would normally be.

Click to expand...

legallyflying said:

I think it's just grower myth that's been perpetuated and perpetuated. Dude, plants flower when it gets dark. Let's make it REALLY dark, then the will like super flower!

Click to expand...

legallyflying said:

I have seen positive results in the last two weeks reducing the light to 11/13 and then 10/14 in the last week. I have seen that they mature and ripen a few days faster that way.

BTW. I always flip from 16/8 to 13/11. Plenty of dark to induce flowering and a lot of light for good bud growth.

So basically my schedule is, well, if you look out your window in the fall you will see what my schedule mimics.

13/11
12/12
11/13
10/14

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I do basically the same thing except I cut back on the light period by 15 minutes every week.

But bro, your comments are a bit contradictory and confusing to me.
In one thread you're mocking the technique of using 48hrs of uninterrupted darkness prior to flip by saying " Dude, plants flower when it gets dark. Let's make it REALLY dark, then the will like super flower!"

And in another thread you're claiming that incrementally increasing more darkness is making your buds mature and ripen faster, so are you saying, let's make it really darker and they will like, super flower?

No dude, its not contradictory at all actually. You are putting your plants through an unnatural and stressful situation by magically making the sun disappear for two days. My light reduction pattern in the last two weeks follows the natural shortage of light that occurs in the fall.

the 48hr dark to make the plants flower is just bunk dude. Yeah, it will make them flower, but so will 12 hours of dark. Florigen is constantlly being produced by the plant but i degrades rapidly, like ultrarapidly in the presence of light. Think of it this way, Florigen is like water filling a glass. And light will empty that glass. During veg, the glass almost gets full enough to trigger flowering, but it doesn't the lights come on and empty the glass. When you go to 12/12, the glass has a long enough time to fill and flowering is initiated. Once the plant has this flowering signall for a couple days, it is on the path to flower and it will take a week or two to reverse it. Plants have evolved over milenia to be triggered by the shorter days of fall.

What you are saying is that you should cause the florigen jar to fill all the way up and spill over as somehow this will trigger the plant to enter flower more quickly. But as soon as you go to 12/12 your hormone levels will be right back where they are supposed to be.

But as you said.. Just don't do it. no problem there, just don't misquote me or insinuate that I am being contradictory.

legallyflying said:

No dude, its not contradictory at all actually. You are putting your plants through an unnatural and stressful situation by magically making the sun disappear for two days. My light reduction pattern in the last two weeks follows the natural shortage of light that occurs in the fall.

the 48hr dark to make the plants flower is just bunk dude. Yeah, it will make them flower, but so will 12 hours of dark. Florigen is constantlly being produced by the plant but i degrades rapidly, like ultrarapidly in the presence of light. Think of it this way, Florigen is like water filling a glass. And light will empty that glass. During veg, the glass almost gets full enough to trigger flowering, but it doesn't the lights come on and empty the glass. When you go to 12/12, the glass has a long enough time to fill and flowering is initiated. Once the plant has this flowering signall for a couple days, it is on the path to flower and it will take a week or two to reverse it. Plants have evolved over milenia to be triggered by the shorter days of fall.

What you are saying is that you should cause the florigen jar to fill all the way up and spill over as somehow this will trigger the plant to enter flower more quickly. But as soon as you go to 12/12 your hormone levels will be right back where they are supposed to be.

But as you said.. Just don't do it. no problem there, just don't misquote me or insinuate that I am being contradictory.

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Hey bud, I'm not misquoting you. The fact is, I'm not doing anything different than you did to me, you just don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot.

Look at this from my prospective, I was responding to a question posed by the OP and I answered honestly, you jumped in right away mocking what I had to say, not cool bro. It's fine if you disagree, but you could have taken a much more friendly approach in doing so.
Just my 02.

legallyflying said:

If your replacing your HPS more than once a year your pissing your money away. Unless you have some janky ballast that roasts bulbs

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I replace all my bulbs yearly on Super Bowl weekend. Easy to remember that way.