Why God?... Why?

Mcgician · Oct 18, 2009

morgentaler said:
Science is a rational and methodological approach to understanding the mechanisms through which things occur.

In your opinion. IMO, science AT BEST is the closest man can come to trying to make sense of the laws of nature God put in place at the beginning. Try as you might to shrink the cosmos, and the laws of nature all you want, but grasping the consciousness of the Creator IMO, is beyond ANYONE'S grasp. Language itself is limiting in it's ability to convey thought and concepts. Mathematical and Physics equations and formulations, are mere futile attempts at man's trying to grasp the laws of nature. Try as you might, but true understanding will always be out of reach of the foulable.

morgentaler said:
God is a religious construct which is part of faith, the belief in something without substantiating evidence.

False. There is plenty of documented history (particularly archeological to back it up), if you care to look for it.

morgentaler said:
Your religious texts state that God demands worship. He does not *ask*. He extorts with the threat of torture.

Incorrect. God merely states that to not follow his teachings and to believe in him will result in an existence "apart from God". Since God= light, that existence will forever be in darkness.

morgentaler said:
So if your biblical God wants to be worshipped, he certainly does need to prove his worth.

But first, prove the existence. Because until then the point is moot.

The point is moot only if YOU want it to be. You have been given the CHOICE to choose faith or not. If that is too much for you to believe in, then so be it. That is YOUR choice, and precisely where, YOU choose for your own soul to go (if you believe you even have one). What is special about this, is that unlike a tyrannical government that imposes restricitions in freedom of choice/speech YOU control your own destiny in this matter. :peace:

CrackerJax · Oct 18, 2009

G*D doesn't state anything..... G*D is the most silent partner ever....

The BOOK tells you G*D says.... keep it real. The Book is written by MAN.

Think it through...

Brazko · Oct 18, 2009

Well, We can definitely rule him out to being a Woman, would of Heard from her Ages ago by NOw, repeatedly... :lol:

morgentaler · Oct 18, 2009

Mcgician said:
False. There is plenty of documented history (particularly archeological to back it up), if you care to look for it.

There is no archaelogical history proving the existence of God. You've made the claim it's up to you to provide the proof now.

Incorrect. God merely states that to not follow his teachings and to believe in him will result in an existence "apart from God". Since God= light, that existence will forever be in darkness.

"God states"... Look, until you prove your imaginary friend, quoting him is useless.

The point is moot only if YOU want it to be. You have been given the CHOICE to choose faith or not. If that is too much for you to believe in, then so be it. That is YOUR choice, and precisely where, YOU choose for your own soul to go (if you believe you even have one). What is special about this, is that unlike a tyrannical government that imposes restricitions in freedom of choice/speech YOU control your own destiny in this matter.

Yes, I've been given the choice to look at the world with open eyes and try to understand things, or shutter them and just accept that things are as they are because the bible tells me so.

I wonder how much that freedom gave you nightmares as a child. Dreaming that you were going to hell for some perceived wrong, after you learned about eternal torment.

Brazko · Oct 18, 2009

You See... :lol:

DogFacedDemon · Oct 18, 2009

"God" is so utterly beyond comprehension that contemplating why "he" takes certain actions is preposterous.
First of all, we're going to have to realise that if there is a "God", it's probably an extra-dimensional entity beyond the need for genitalia - god neither urinates or has an other entity of similar scale to have intercourse with. I still find it hard to believe that in this day & age - with space travel, high technology & the awe-inspiring prophecies of quantum physics - that people still think that god moves every piece on the chess-board, for petty reasons. 'Oh look, a sinner! I had better give him some STD's & whatnot...'
I find atheism as amusing as main-stream religion; the same overly-dogmatic shit with no real proof, they've got their holy book - the god delusion, hail dawkins. It's pretty funny. Materialism? Really? Have you not heard the good news from the problem child of physics - quantum physics - that; every electron is the yawning mouth of a wormhole that leads to quadrillions of higher dimensional universes that are completely beyond rational apprehension?
Have fun saying God can't possibly exist because you can't measure it with your ruler & pencil, while a moment later denouncing jesus lovers as ignorant fools - are you feeling enlightened?

This isn't aimed at anyone in particular, I just enjoy ridiculing the atheist point of view because they think they're reasoning logically from religion being BS, to the creation of this unfathomably brilliant universe/multiverse being a random occurrence - 'the hubble telescope can't see any God, so there!". Flying the banner of science, while failing to acknowledge that at the root of modern science was an angelic revelation that was visited upon Rene DesCartes. People that think 'the big bang' is a sufficient explanation of the question; 'why are we here?'.
Big bang theory states: EVERYTHING SPRANG FROM NOTHING, IN A SINGLE INSTANT, FOR NO REASON.
How is that any different from "... & God said; 'let there be light!'..."?
I think most people have no clue & should stop acting like they know what the f*uck they're talking about - even if "experts" say so.
& the rest of us, that KNOW "God" & it's endless implications & boundless love...
Ummm...
We've taken magic mushrooms before.

Babs34 · Oct 18, 2009

CrackerJax said:
G*D doesn't state anything..... G*D is the most silent partner ever....

The BOOK tells you G*D says.... keep it real. The Book is written by MAN.

Think it through...

This is really sad. Someone starts a thread about losing someone to DEATH, and even though you and others have SO many threads arguing about God and debating him, you have to nab this one to debate too.
It's you that has so much to prove......not those crazy "Believers" you continue to think you gracefully mock.

morgentaler · Oct 18, 2009

I agree with most of your post, except that there's a difference between an extra dimensional entity and a "God".

If the former exists, it is a complex being that we may have trouble finding.

The latter is a construct of man. That's it. The biblical god, Thor, Mithra, Ganesh. Those are all just characters in books and legends.

They have nothing to do with what actually brought the universe into existence, whatever reason that may be.

DogFacedDemon said:
"God" is so utterly beyond comprehension that contemplating why "he" takes certain actions is preposterous.
First of all, we're going to have to realise that if there is a "God", it's probably an extra-dimensional entity beyond the need for genitalia - god neither urinates or has an other entity of similar scale to have intercourse with. I still find it hard to believe that in this day & age - with space travel, high technology & the awe-inspiring prophecies of quantum physics - that people still think that god moves every piece on the chess-board, for petty reasons. 'Oh look, a sinner! I had better give him some STD's & whatnot...'
I find atheism as amusing as main-stream religion; the same overly-dogmatic shit with no real proof, they've got their holy book - the god delusion, hail dawkins. It's pretty funny. Materialism? Really? Have you not heard the good news from the problem child of physics - quantum physics - that; every electron is the yawning mouth of a wormhole that leads to quadrillions of higher dimensional universes that are completely beyond rational apprehension?
Have fun saying God can't possibly exist because you can't measure it with your ruler & pencil, while a moment later denouncing jesus lovers as ignorant fools - are you feeling enlightened?
This isn't aimed at anyone in particular, I just enjoy ridiculing the atheist point of view because they think they're reasoning logically from religion being BS, to the creation of this unfathomably brilliant universe/multiverse being a random occurrence - 'the hubble telescope can't see any God, so there!". Flying the banner of science, while failing to acknowledge that at the root of modern science was an angelic revelation that was visited upon Rene DesCartes. People that think 'the big bang' is a sufficient explanation of the question; 'why are we here?'.
Big bang theory states: EVERYTHING SPRANG FROM NOTHING, IN A SINGLE INSTANT, FOR NO REASON.
How is that any different from "... & God said; 'let there be light!'..."?
I think most people have no clue & should stop acting like they know what the f*uck they're talking about - even if "experts" say so.
& the rest of us, that KNOW "God" & it's endless implications & boundless love...
Ummm...
We've taken magic mushrooms before.

Brazko · Oct 18, 2009

DogFacedDemon said:
"God" is so utterly beyond comprehension that contemplating why "he" takes certain actions is preposterous.
First of all, we're going to have to realise that if there is a "God", it's probably an extra-dimensional entity beyond the need for genitalia - god neither urinates or has an other entity of similar scale to have intercourse with. I still find it hard to believe that in this day & age - with space travel, high technology & the awe-inspiring prophecies of quantum physics - that people still think that god moves every piece on the chess-board, for petty reasons. 'Oh look, a sinner! I had better give him some STD's & whatnot...'
I find atheism as amusing as main-stream religion; the same overly-dogmatic shit with no real proof, they've got their holy book - the god delusion, hail dawkins. It's pretty funny. Materialism? Really? Have you not heard the good news from the problem child of physics - quantum physics - that; every electron is the yawning mouth of a wormhole that leads to quadrillions of higher dimensional universes that are completely beyond rational apprehension?
Have fun saying God can't possibly exist because you can't measure it with your ruler & pencil, while a moment later denouncing jesus lovers as ignorant fools - are you feeling enlightened?
This isn't aimed at anyone in particular, I just enjoy ridiculing the atheist point of view because they think they're reasoning logically from religion being BS, to the creation of this unfathomably brilliant universe/multiverse being a random occurrence - 'the hubble telescope can't see any God, so there!". Flying the banner of science, while failing to acknowledge that at the root of modern science was an angelic revelation that was visited upon Rene DesCartes. People that think 'the big bang' is a sufficient explanation of the question; 'why are we here?'.
Big bang theory states: EVERYTHING SPRANG FROM NOTHING, IN A SINGLE INSTANT, FOR NO REASON.
How is that any different from "... & God said; 'let there be light!'..."?
I think most people have no clue & should stop acting like they know what the f*uck they're talking about - even if "experts" say so.
& the rest of us, that KNOW "God" & it's endless implications & boundless love...
Ummm...
We've taken magic mushrooms before.

WoW Man, This was an Awesome Post.., here I'll let a Secret out Of The Bag Too.." Atheist Remain quite More Open to the Aspect of there being A Deity God than I do"... :roll:

, but I guess I need to Start being more open to the Concept again as Well..., I have stated this As well in the past, Hey Zeus didn't believe in a Deity Father, but a Spiritual Being that encompassed everything..., but that's my opinion... Something I have come to understand and realize through the Written Scripture, No matter.., It's all the SAme..., Following in The Footsteps of Christ will Definitely lead you to The FAther.., except many so called followers don't adhere to that notion..., Excellent Post... +++++rep

:peace:

Nocturn3 · Oct 18, 2009

Babs34 said:
This is really sad. Someone starts a thread about losing someone to DEATH, and even though you and others have SO many threads arguing about God and debating him, you have to nab this one to debate too.
It's you that has so much to prove......not those crazy "Believers" you continue to think you gracefully mock.

jfgordon1 said:
I'm not trying to get sympathy. I was trying to start a discussion about "why bad things happen" if there is a god (i'm an atheist/agnostic). This was a bad way going about it...

Keep up Babs. :roll:

Interesting avatar, btw. bongsmilie

Babs34 · Oct 18, 2009

And that was supposed to be what? Worthy of a reply?
Yeah, everyone really stayed on topic, right.

morgentaler · Oct 18, 2009

DogFacedDemon said:
"
Big bang theory states: EVERYTHING SPRANG FROM NOTHING, IN A SINGLE INSTANT, FOR NO REASON.

Oh, and that's not Big Bang, this is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

You're thinking of the zero sum model, which is based on negative and positive states in equilibrium. This is not part of Big Bang theory.

And the "no reason" part is just silly.
Science doesn't look for "reason". It looks for cause. And there must be a cause for expansionism.

DogFacedDemon · Oct 18, 2009

I guess that's just my cultural conditioning, being raised catholic & all. I can't help using the term "God", & don't really mind doing so as it's just a word. I don't relate it to any pre-packaged god of any hack institution or anything. Although, I do much prefer the term 'the transcendental object at the end of time'. But, generally, mentioning that causes people to 'wtf' wildly.

morgentaler · Oct 18, 2009

Babs34 said:
And that was supposed to be what? Worthy of a reply?
Yeah, everyone really stayed on topic, right.

I think he was a bit surprised that your avatar is a statement that if it wasn't for religion the World Trade Center would still be standing.

Would it be safe to assume your interpretation is that if it wasn't for the "muslim religion" it would still be standing?

sammo · Oct 18, 2009

It is amazing how people blame all the shit that happens on God! I too have noticed that a lot of the best people die young and have lost some very good friends. In this situation and others like it of course it is sad for the family and friends but for the ones who have "passed away" I know they are in a much better place. I sure as hell don't care or worry about what all the non believing "enlightened ones" think because they will sooner or later find out how wrong they were. .

morgentaler · Oct 18, 2009

Babs34 said:
This is really sad. Someone starts a thread about losing someone to DEATH, and even though you and others have SO many threads arguing about God and debating him, you have to nab this one to debate too.
It's you that has so much to prove......not those crazy "Believers" you continue to think you gracefully mock.

You apparently missed the post by the OP stating that he started the thread specifically for debate.

Babs34 · Oct 18, 2009

morgentaler said:
I think he was a bit surprised that your avatar is a statement that if it wasn't for religion the World Trade Center would still be standing.

Would it be safe to assume your interpretation is that if it wasn't for the "muslim religion" it would still be standing?

As usual, all those "assumptions" .....
that wasn't the intended statement with the avatar at all, but with everything...there is interpretatation.
You can't see in that picture what the next can. I'm betting that won't make sense to you though, lol.

DogFacedDemon · Oct 18, 2009

Brazko said:
WoW Man, This was an Awesome Post.., here I'll let a Secret out Of The Bag Too.." Atheist Remain quite More Open to the Aspect of there being A Deity God than I do"... , but I guess I need to Start being more open to the Concept again as Well..., I have stated this As well in the past, Hey Zeus didn't believe in a Deity Father, but a Spiritual Being that encompassed everything..., but that's my opinion... Something I have come to understand and realize through the Written Scripture, No matter.., It's all the SAme..., Following in The Footsteps of Christ will Definitely lead you to The FAther.., except many so called followers don't adhere to that notion..., Excellent Post... +++++rep

Thank you much.

I believe that everyone needs to piece together their own understanding of how the reality works. I believe that we're all little perceptual organs of "god", within "god", an entity which - in the process of playing out reality - is mapping itself.
I haven't read much scripture, but I do intend on getting around to it at some point. It's on my list.

Thanks for the kind words, man!

Babs34 · Oct 18, 2009

morgentaler said:
You apparently missed the post by the OP stating that he started the thread specifically for debate.

Whether or not God exists Morgan?
Or WHY God allows things of this nature to happen?

morgentaler · Oct 18, 2009

sammo said:
It is amazing how people blame all the shit that happens on God! I too have noticed that a lot of the best people die young and have lost some very good friends. In this situation and others like it of course it is sad for the family and friends but for the ones who have "passed away" I know they are in a much better place. I sure as hell don't care or worry about what all the non believing "enlightened ones" think because they will sooner or later find out how wrong they were. .

It's funny how God is supposed to be responsible for all the good things that happen to people, but when bad things happen and other people comment on it, it's not God being an asshole, it's him letting things just play out, or "God's plan".

You forget that the biblical God is an interventionist, and brings down death and destruction where he sees fit.

The shining hypocrisy of religion is when a disaster strikes and people are interviewed on TV and thank God for answering their prayers and saving their lives and possessions, while their neighbors are mourning the dead and the loss of everything.

Yay God. Have a cookie. Try not to kill anyone else today.

Why God?... Why?

Well-Known Member

New Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member