giving defoliation during flower a try

[Uncle Ben]

It ain't ignorance that causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so.

 

[TheChemist77]

The answer to your question depends on a lot of factors. What's the strain/phenos resistance to stress? How is the general health of the plant? Also how often one prunes and how much they prune back can affect the plant. I think a safe rule of thumb for pruning (namely the fan leaves and what will becomes larfy popcorn) is to never remove more than 20% of the plant in a given session and giving plenty of time to recoup before the next pruning. In regards to defoliation and pruning vs. letting nature take it's course, one should look at the grape vine. It's best and most flavorful yields require more than proper nutrient and watering (or lack thereof) to be achieved, and the vine itself must be put under some demand to work the plant. If the vine was to simply "go to seed", aka reproduce itself through seed, the profile of the grape wouldn't matter, and obviously, letting nature take its course would be the preferred method. But for the purpose that we use grapes, the better crop is not grown without pruning and stress. This includes timing, putting a load on the plant to drive the roots deeper, pulling nutrients from deep down enhancing the flavor and preserving the vine in times of drought. Yes, before a naysayer says anything, it's apples to oranges (well, grapes to buds), but the example stands to show that not all is perfected by nature for secondary uses. If you go pulling healthy leaves during a flush, the plant will be pulling it's reserves from elsewhere. If you over-do the defol, it could shock the plant and delay the finish. No one can answer your question with 100% certainty, but lots of people do pull the leaves. Although, I'd keep searching the forums to see what others are doing and with picture evidence to backup their claims. I apologize if this isn't a good enough reply to your question.

Thank you for the info. im growng 9 different strains right now, and put 25 plants in a dwc thats5x5 with lots of light.till now ive always only pulled yellowing bottom leaves and ocasionally a large fan leaf if its removal will provide more light to whats below.Recently ive been told to start trimming the lower branches to improve yields from top branches. should i trim the branches in veg or right after put in flowering?? and will trimming the leaves 2 weaks before harvest improve bud size??

 

[stankyyank]

Thank you for the info. im growng 9 different strains right now, and put 25 plants in a dwc thats5x5 with lots of light.till now ive always only pulled yellowing bottom leaves and ocasionally a large fan leaf if its removal will provide more light to whats below.Recently ive been told to start trimming the lower branches to improve yields from top branches. should i trim the branches in veg or right after put in flowering?? and will trimming the leaves 2 weaks before harvest improve bud size??

You're definitely stacking them in there. If you have good light and airflow, don't get too crazy with defoliation in veg, but introduce the girls to it if you have the time, if you even veg that long as it is. I say this because it's obvious you can't realistically over-veg your girls and keep them all in there (especially if they bush out to become some fat indicas), and you don't want to over-trim either as it'd be unnecessary time spent growing just to pull it back. How big are they right now, and do you have any pics? Don't go crazy on defoliating or topping/etc when first flipping to 12/12, it'll stress the plant out unnecessarily. Maybe a couple here and there, but for the most part, wait till you get through the stretch before re-evaluating what you're going to pull (anything not in good health, oversized and yellowing, and lollipopping the very bottom if needed). As for "lollipopping" or lower node/bud site removal, it doesn't necessarily add to overall weight, it just gives a better average for you're buds in size. Do you usually run 25 girls in a 5x5? As far as pulling fan leaves shortly before harvest... it will speed up your flush, but I can't say for sure what the impact will be on your bud size (don't care to guess either). Additionally, if your environment is too hot, the plant won't be able to transpire as effectively without it's fan leaves, meaning growth/maturation will come to a halt. If your buds have a high leaf to calyx ratio (namely sugar leaf), you might be safe providing the last little bit of goodness without the majority of your fan leaves, but you keep temps in control. Maybe try doing just a few and seeing what your results are in comparison? There are so many factors that seem to play into this, a general answer can't be had. Good luck.

 

[Uncle Ben]

....Recently ive been told to start trimming the lower branches to improve yields from top branches.

Who's telling you this crap?

 

[J.Mike]

It ain't ignorance that causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so.

ig·no·rance
ˈiɡnərəns/
noun

1. lack of knowledge or information.
   "he acted in ignorance of basic procedures"
   synonyms:incomprehension of, unawareness of, unconsciousness of, unfamiliarity with, inexperience with, lack of knowledge about, lack of information about;
   informalcluelessness about
   

If you are not helping, its not because you know too much...

 

[EastCoastGenetics420]

people are know it alls.. no1 wants to admit there wrong. that's the real issue.. egos

 

[Sativied]

people are know it alls.. no1 wants to admit there wrong. that's the real issue.. egos

You speak for "people" and "no1" as in everyone and you mention "egos"?

I only care for the truth, and when in search for the truth all that matters is what you "know" (opposed what you want to see for example). If that what you know isn't so, the conclusion derived from it isn't necessarily the truth. Your comment, despite the spelling error, does cover the real issue: "no1 wants to admit they're wrong" as if it's about them... instead of their info being either inaccurate, incomplete or flat out irrelevant. "You're argument is invalid" does however get the same butthurt response as "you are wrong" so yeah... it's mostly egos and not facts that get in the way of the pursuit for knowledge...

 

[Uncle Ben]

people are know it alls.. no1 wants to admit there wrong. that's the real issue.. egos

"No one" want to leave their comfort zone of bullshit (RIU) and get the facts regarding what makes a plant tick.

 

[st0wandgrow]

"No one" want to leave their comfort zone of bullshit (RIU) and get the facts regarding what makes a plant tick.

I've thought the same of you. Your comfort zone circa 1970

 

[J.Mike]

"No one" want to leave their comfort zone of bullshit (RIU) and get the facts regarding what makes a plant tick.

And since we are having a teaching moment, it would be "No one wants to leave...etc"! If it works for you so be it, whatever, and you wonder why I laugh...

 

[sex pistil]

Throw all the horticultural mumbo jumbo that you learned in your book that you want. Ill take the word of experience over a booksmart wannabe anyday. I've seen the side by side differences many many times.. if you think that bud down in the shade is going to grow and mature just as well as a bud that's getting direct light then you have more learning to do, and I don't mean by reading your books.

Hey. I just signed up here just so I can go back several weeks into this thread, grab statements made by anti-stripping posers, drag them forward, and shred them to bits. These antis aren't good enough to be called book smart...they enjoy wallowing in ignorance. Let's get started with this....

 

[sex pistil]

It ain't ignorance that causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so.

It ain't ignorance that causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so.

Really, there, genius?
Here's a quote from you:


"Cannabis flowers are not capable of photosynthesis."


And here is bit of botanical knowledge from an Arkansas state U. publication:

"All green plant parts have chloroplasts and carry out photosynthesis."

you aren't fit to stand on your little soapbox.

 

[TheChemist77]

You're definitely stacking them in there. If you have good light and airflow, don't get too crazy with defoliation in veg, but introduce the girls to it if you have the time, if you even veg that long as it is. I say this because it's obvious you can't realistically over-veg your girls and keep them all in there (especially if they bush out to become some fat indicas), and you don't want to over-trim either as it'd be unnecessary time spent growing just to pull it back. How big are they right now, and do you have any pics? Don't go crazy on defoliating or topping/etc when first flipping to 12/12, it'll stress the plant out unnecessarily. Maybe a couple here and there, but for the most part, wait till you get through the stretch before re-evaluating what you're going to pull (anything not in good health, oversized and yellowing, and lollipopping the very bottom if needed). As for "lollipopping" or lower node/bud site removal, it doesn't necessarily add to overall weight, it just gives a better average for you're buds in size. Do you usually run 25 girls in a 5x5? As far as pulling fan leaves shortly before harvest... it will speed up your flush, but I can't say for sure what the impact will be on your bud size (don't care to guess either). Additionally, if your environment is too hot, the plant won't be able to transpire as effectively without it's fan leaves, meaning growth/maturation will come to a halt. If your buds have a high leaf to calyx ratio (namely sugar leaf), you might be safe providing the last little bit of goodness without the majority of your fan leaves, but you keep temps in control. Maybe try doing just a few and seeing what your results are in comparison? There are so many factors that seem to play into this, a general answer can't be had. Good luck.

yes,always 25 plants in 5x5 dwc great airflo and temp control, havnt learned how to put pics up yet,new to computers.but im looking forward to showing my set up off,plants in flower now come down next week at that time ill be putting in 25 more and was asking if i should trim them now or into flower,,i started another post and everyone was saying 2 weeks into flower you determine which branches may need to be trimmed off but was also told that with 2 600 watt hps lights above not to trim because its more than enough light to penetrate lower buds if the finished plants are 3-3-1/2 feet tall. i normally start w rooted clones and they get 1-3 weeks of veg depending on the strain,more indica more veg because less stretch in flower u know.... im hoping by next week i can get someone to help me get a pic for u guys,,i made it myself and its kind of a dwc,and ebb n flow mix..anyways its been working great and the roots are massive..i only pull yellowing fan leaves and the large fan leaves that have surved their purpose, and dont pull any during the last week of flower because those yellowing leaves are just from the flush pulling all nuts out..still not sure if i should start trimming lower branches???maybe next batch ill trim a couple and see the dif

 

[TheChemist77]

You speak for "people" and "no1" as in everyone and you mention "egos"?

I only care for the truth, and when in search for the truth all that matters is what you "know" (opposed what you want to see for example). If that what you know isn't so, the conclusion derived from it isn't necessarily the truth. Your comment, despite the spelling error, does cover the real issue: "no1 wants to admit they're wrong" as if it's about them... instead of their info being either inaccurate, incomplete or flat out irrelevant. "You're argument is invalid" does however get the same butthurt response as "you are wrong" so yeah... it's mostly egos and not facts that get in the way of the pursuit for knowledge...

its all a piont of viiew! my point of view maybe different from yours even if we both seen the same thing,,,so truth,,is only your truth or his truth... why did you tell me my father was dead?? your father was decieved by the dark side so at that point aniken was dead and he became darth vader was so i told the truth,from my point of view!lol

 

[TheChemist77]

You speak for "people" and "no1" as in everyone and you mention "egos"?

I only care for the truth, and when in search for the truth all that matters is what you "know" (opposed what you want to see for example). If that what you know isn't so, the conclusion derived from it isn't necessarily the truth. Your comment, despite the spelling error, does cover the real issue: "no1 wants to admit they're wrong" as if it's about them... instead of their info being either inaccurate, incomplete or flat out irrelevant. "You're argument is invalid" does however get the same butthurt response as "you are wrong" so yeah... it's mostly egos and not facts that get in the way of the pursuit for knowledge...

Soyy bro,,im really into jedi shit its like a bible, not trying to start anything just bsn...2+2=4 fact or truth,id say fact as truth may differ from person to person..Also its right people do tend to see what they want to see. and believe what they want to believe sometimes with no proof only faith or false hopes.

 

[sex pistil]

The picture I posted previously showed the exact OPPOSITE of what you are claiming.

Defoliated plants produced LESS bud than their non-defoliated control group, at EVERY level of the plant, from top colas to lower tier buds.

If defoliation was even remotely viable as a growing technique, then at least ONE defoliated plant would have produced larger buds than the non-defoliated control group, but this didn't happen. NONE of the defoliated plants produced larger buds. ALL of the defoliated plants produced LESS bud than their non-defoliated control group.

The results of that grow showed defoliation is NOT a viable technique to produce larger buds ANYWHERE on the plant. Period.

Or maybe it just showed how bad your technique sucked.

 

[Sativied]

Soyy bro,,im really into jedi shit its like a bible, not trying to start anything just bsn...2+2=4 fact or truth,id say fact as truth may differ from person to person..Also its right people do tend to see what they want to see. and believe what they want to believe sometimes with no proof only faith or false hopes.

A fact is something that is known to be true. If 2+2 is not 4 (as in false, as in not the truth) from certain point of views then I can see how defoliating might work

my point of view maybe different from yours even if we both seen the same thing,,,

Sure, because you look at it subjectively, and I objectively, from above, like a bird.

its all a piont of view!

No, not "all", but it it's a major factor yes. That' why we share arguments, to reach a common (objective) point of view, and then it's just a matter of logic. Many seem to fail on all three accounts (produce valid arguments, stay objective, and don't be stupid).

Good talk

 

[Uncle Ben]

And now we have a newborn Troll-It-Up member opining......

Really, there, genius?
Here's a quote from you:


"Cannabis flowers are not capable of photosynthesis."


And here is bit of botanical knowledge from an Arkansas state U. publication:

"All green plant parts have chloroplasts and carry out photosynthesis."

you aren't fit to stand on your little soapbox.

Cannabis flowers, pistils or stamens, are not capable of photosynthesis and they aren't green. That goes for calyxes too.

I don't consider leaves flowers.

Get your facts straight, shit-fer-brains.

UB

 

[Uncle Ben]

So you just "signed up" to just to troll, eh?

Hey. I just signed up here just so I can go back several weeks into this thread, grab statements made by anti-stripping posers, drag them forward, and shred them to bits. These antis aren't good enough to be called book smart...they enjoy wallowing in ignorance. Let's get started with this....

I've taken on lil trolls like you for over 15 years. A recommendation, before you starting "shredding them to bits", you best get your happy ass back into the defoliation/lollipopping threads and read them first.

Unkie Ben doesn't take kindly to repeating himself with every new crop of smart ass noobs nor those who take his posts out of context.

Uncle Ben

 

[TheChemist77]

A fact is something that is known to be true. If 2+2 is not 4 (as in false, as in not the truth) from certain point of views then I can see how defoliating might work

Sure, because you look at it subjectively, and I objectively, from above, like a bird.

No, not "all", but it it's a major factor yes. That' why we share arguments, to reach a common (objective) point of view, and then it's just a matter of logic. Many seem to fail on all three accounts (produce valid arguments, stay objective, and don't be stupid).

Good talk

Nice pics in your journal! your set up looks almost just like mine, mine is 5x5 with 4'' pvc,,, what size tubes and pots u useing? also we both use 2 600 watters they seem very close..maybe only a few diferences i use rockwool cubes insted of stones but i can run either way i thought about switching to stones as they can be reused and save money...anyways NICE