So You Hate the EPA, huh?

[Harrekin]

I can already feel the earth healing...its amazing isn't it?

And all we had to do was agree the single largest transfer of wealth from "rich nations" to "developing nations".

Hows that for fixing "income inequality" on a global scale?

It's funny, I've been saying it was about money all along and this Paris Accord proved me to be 100% correct.

Wheres the research funding?

Where's the new technologies to combat CO2 emissions?

"Fuck it, just throw money at it and it'll limit temp increases to 1.5°C"

 

[bravedave]

OK, Dave, in your own stupid words: "The EPA needs some sort of oversight that comes from above them. As anunelected agency they should not be able to shut down businesses without due process outside of their own."

This is why I said you needed a civics class. You are wrong, just wrong.

The director nor anyone beneath are elected. What are you trying to pretend to catch, stupid me, on?

 

[bravedave]

The Oyster Farm was closed down by the national park service not the EPA
they had a 40 year lease and the lease wasn't renewed.
now you want to post a link ignorant one?
I just want to see your sources

I was going from memory and made no claims except thinking the EPA was involved. But more govt. over reach certainly.

 

[Fogdog]

The director nor anyone beneath are elected. What are you trying to pretend to catch, stupid me, on?

Just forget it dave, you are only 85% wrong. That 15% is the best you can do.

 

[bravedave]

Just forget it dave, you are only 85% wrong. That 15% is the best you can do.

So I ask for details and you provide deflection. But sure, you are forgotten. Although, besides the Oyster Bar fiasco I bet you all found some goodies to ponder about the EPA that you are not adding to the narrative. Glad I could help with your quest for knowledge.

 

[UncleBuck]

And all we had to do was agree the single largest transfer of wealth from "rich nations" to "developing nations".

Hows that for fixing "income inequality" on a global scale?

It's funny, I've been saying it was about money all along and this Paris Accord proved me to be 100% correct.

http://davidduke.com/global-warming-is-still-a-hoax/

Not only would Global Warming be used to extort money from big corporations; some liberals wanted to pay Third World nations for all the pollution caused by the industrialized world –a sort of Global welfare system. Once again White people were going to be punished and compelled to feel guilty about having a more advanced lifestyle than billions of Third World poor.

it's kinda funny that you are repeating white supremacy propaganda, little dude.

 

[ChesusRice]

Sad, bad govt. story...

http://savedrakesbay.com/core/

http://www.newsweek.com/2015/01/30/oyster-shell-game-300225.html

Exacty why unelected officials at the EPA or anywhere should not have the right to shut anyone down without due process.

So the owners signed a 40 year lease knowing the lease would not be renewed then cried to a Koch Brothers attorney about it.
Now their former farm is part of a protected wilderness
The EPA had nothing to do with it
btw this is what the bottom of a aquaculture (fish farm) looks like

 

[Rob Roy]

I googled "EPA bribes" and found this:

https://sunlightfoundation.com/blog/2011/10/04/koch-industries-had-inside-man-at-the-epa/

Also, Monsanto. Also, energy companies that frack. In other words, people within the EPA can be bought for a whole lot of money by corporations with a whole lot more. Nothing new or "high browed" about this. So, what's your point?

The blowout that polluted the Animas river was not the result of bribery. It's pretty complicated but from what I could tell, the EPA was working with the county and the mine owner to prevent the river system from going into Super Fund Status. It was a case where the EPA overstepped its mandate and ended up costing the taxpayers a whopping big bill to clean up the spill because it was trying to minimize red tape and government oversight. They shouldn't have done it but I'm not sure they had the wrong reasons. And corruption wasn't involved.

Changing your argument mid-stream are you? You couldn't win the prior argument and you can't win this one either. The courts are part of our system of government. This is true. The other bit about the US government being plaintiff and judge is not. Do you need a lesson in civics? In a jury trial, the people sitting in judgement are citizens of the community. The judge runs the trial and certainly affects the outcome but he doesn't decide guilt or innocence, the jury does that. And if the losing party doesn't like the outcome of the trial, they in fact can appeal the result. All within the framework of our legal system.

The nutty idea that people at odds with each other will agree upon an arbitrator is laughable. Each party will only agree on an arbitrator that they feel will give them the best chance to win. They will pick the one they like best and reject the ones that their opponent picks. There will never be a resolution to this.

I answered your question, now answer me this: If a person or a company pollutes the surface water that runs onto your property, renders your property unusable, denies doing so and refuses to go through arbitration, what means would you use to collect compensation?

LOLbertarian, indeed

Your argument eats it's own tail. I could explain but think I'll let it sit awhile for my amusement.

 

[Harrekin]

So the owners signed a 40 year lease knowing the lease would not be renewed then cried to a Koch Brothers attorney about it.
Now their former farm is part of a protected wilderness
The EPA had nothing to do with it
btw this is what the bottom of a aquaculture (fish farm) looks like
View attachment 3563435

Oyster farms have virtually no effect on ecology, if anything in an Oyster farm you've got nature's natural water filters.

Commercial fisheries are different.

 

[ChesusRice]

Oyster farms have virtually no effect on ecology, if anything in an Oyster farm you've got nature's natural water filters.

Commercial fisheries are different.

Marin County judge has ordered an oyster farm to comply with Coastal Commission cleanup orders on its property at Point Reyes National Seashore while awaiting a federal court ruling on the Obama administration's attempt to shut the operation down.

Superior Court Judge Lynn Duryee told Drakes Bay Oyster Co. on Wednesday to obey the state commission's directives, dating from 2007, that found the company responsible for plastic debris, disruptions to the habitat of harbor seals and the planting of nearly 2 million Manila clams, an invasive species.


Environmental advocates said the order requires Drakes Bay to clean up pollution and remove the clams while awaiting its fate at the Ninth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, which heard arguments May 14. But Peter Prows, a lawyer for the company, said the ruling requires Drakes Bay only to submit plans to the Coastal Commission and does not compel any immediate changes in operations.

 

[Fogdog]

So I ask for details and you provide deflection. But sure, you are forgotten. Although, besides the Oyster Bar fiasco I bet you all found some goodies to ponder about the EPA that you are not adding to the narrative. Glad I could help with your quest for knowledge.

That's funny! You say I deflected because I quoted back your own barefaced ignorant words?

Dave you can't handle details. I don't know why, maybe its a problem with your meds or maybe inbred genetics? I gave all the necessary details to you in my first response when you were demonstrably confused about how the US government operates. Furthermore, you can't even track who said what in consecutive threads. @ChesusRice responded to you regarding your (again) confusion regarding the shut down of an oyster farm. And by the way, he's 100% accurate. Give it a rest dude.

 

[Fogdog]

Your argument eats it's own tail. I could explain but think I'll let it sit awhile for my amusement.

This is great. You can't think of what to say, so you respond with the equivalent of "I know you are but what am I?". I'll repeat my question to you: If a person or a company pollutes the surface water that runs onto your property, renders your property unusable, denies doing so and refuses to go through arbitration, what means would you use to collect compensation?

 

[bravedave]

That's funny! You say I deflected because I quoted back your own barefaced ignorant words?

Dave you can't handle details. I don't know why, maybe its a problem with your meds or maybe inbred genetics? I gave all the necessary details to you in my first response when you were demonstrably confused about how the US government operates. Furthermore, you can't even track who said what in consecutive threads. @ChesusRice responded to you regarding your (again) confusion regarding the shut down of an oyster farm. And by the way, he's 100% accurate. Give it a rest dude.

I said that nobody at the EPA is elected. You highlighted it and insinuated I was wrong. I called YOU on it and you failed to add clarity to your mistaken, if not asinine, statement...so now you accuse me of not being able to handle the details followed, of course. by speculative insult. Funny , in a hypocritical sort of way, when it is ONE detail you cannot grasp.

 

[ChesusRice]

I was going from memory and made no claims except thinking the EPA was involved. But more govt. over reach certainly.

So it is government over reach not renewing a lease the business signed knowing that it wouldn't be renewed?

 

[bravedave]

Marin County judge has ordered an oyster farm to comply with Coastal Commission cleanup orders on its property at Point Reyes National Seashore while awaiting a federal court ruling on the Obama administration's attempt to shut the operation down.

Superior Court Judge Lynn Duryee told Drakes Bay Oyster Co. on Wednesday to obey the state commission's directives, dating from 2007, that found the company responsible for plastic debris, disruptions to the habitat of harbor seals and the planting of nearly 2 million Manila clams, an invasive species.


Environmental advocates said the order requires Drakes Bay to clean up pollution and remove the clams while awaiting its fate at the Ninth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, which heard arguments May 14. But Peter Prows, a lawyer for the company, said the ruling requires Drakes Bay only to submit plans to the Coastal Commission and does not compel any immediate changes in operations.

The government has already been caught utilizing fraudulent data to make their case. Why should we believe them now? In reading both sides it now seems this govt. agency is retaliating because of being embarrassed...a condition the liberals here would find during soul-searching. You know, if you had a soul. Speaking of, as the creator of the EPA...
"Even Richard Nixon has got soul"

 

[ChesusRice]

The government has already been caught utilizing fraudulent data to make their case. Why should we believe them now? In reading both sides it now seems this govt. agency is retaliating because of being embarrassed...a condition the liberals here would find during soul-searching. You know, if you had a soul. Speaking of, as the creator of the EPA...
"Even Richard Nixon has got soul"

So the lease the oyster farm signed was fraudulent data?
Again. The EPA has nothing to do with the oyster farm

 

[bravedave]

That's funny! You say I deflected because I quoted back your own barefaced ignorant words?

Dave you can't handle details. I don't know why, maybe its a problem with your meds or maybe inbred genetics? I gave all the necessary details to you in my first response when you were demonstrably confused about how the US government operates. Furthermore, you can't even track who said what in consecutive threads. @ChesusRice responded to you regarding your (again) confusion regarding the shut down of an oyster farm. And by the way, he's 100% accurate. Give it a rest dude.

And if you want details, read the Newsweek article (yes even liberal Newsweek gets it as well as Feinstein).

http://www.newsweek.com/2015/01/30/oyster-shell-game-300225.html

 

[ChesusRice]

And if you want details, read the Newsweek article (yes even liberal Newsweek gets it as well as Feinstein).

http://www.newsweek.com/2015/01/30/oyster-shell-game-300225.html

Did the farm sign a lease?
Did that lease expire?

 

[bravedave]

So the lease the oyster farm signed was fraudulent data?
Again. The EPA has nothing to do with the oyster farm

While maybe not a highlighted in many of the stories the EPA was involved by not granting permits.

http://savedrakesbay.com/core/2013/11/30/the-truth-about-permits-2/

 

[Grandpapy]

The real rape in the Oyster case........$79,000 for Oceanfront property!