First SCROG Grow, looking for help from the forum

How long ago did you begin your first grow?

  • Within a year

    Votes: 2 12.5%
  • 1-3 years ago

    Votes: 3 18.8%
  • 5-10 years ago

    Votes: 3 18.8%
  • 10+ years ago

    Votes: 8 50.0%

  • Total voters
    16

PSlacks

Member
Hello fellow tokers and growers everywhere. First off, I must state that I have been completely overwhelmed by the since of community on this forum and outright shocked at how willing the more experienced folks here on this site are to help the beginners. I myself am a beginner and am just stepping into this hobby so I am hoping that my words will move some of you to write your opinions and of course, all help is welcome. I look forward to really making this happen and look forward to interacting with the community as well. I would jump right into the questions I have and I'm sure some people might already be thinking that in need to get on to the good stuff. But I feel I must share the reason why I begun this journey in the first place. As I sit on my couch in front of a thousand pages of little notes consisted of grow setups and facts and data, it almost feels like an unachievable task! But as anyone will tell you who gets things done.. it all starts with the first step. I have been discussing, grinding, observing, smoking and most of loving cannabis for many many years. Being in an area where having a choice of the herbs you want is a unachievable task, I had no other choice if I really wished to smoke the greens that I adored and oh so longed for. I was tired of nonpungent brick weed, possibly a good batch "every now and then" and most of all, just not really knowing what truly went into the care and production of what I'm smoking, I mean these are my lungs we're talking about here.. right? Who knows where it's been and who's touched it. I would much rather know exactly where it came from. And what's better then producing your own fruits and flowers? :weed:

So, it begun. The journey that as of right now, really isn't even a journey yet. Just a series of thoughts and notes waiting to be put into action..
Or should I say a rolling paper. :roll:
As I start to really narrow down on specific products and grasp a lot of ideas and techniques in general, I feel I must attain the opinion of you guys, considering you guys have learned from trial and error and I just like to think the wisdom from everyone here would help a lot.

My first concerns are the setup I plan on using and if you guys think I can achieve the results I desire. I wish to yield 1.5-2.5 lbs per harvest. My setup will consist of the following as of now:
  • 5x5x6.5 ft. Grow Tent
  • Two 600 Watt HPS air cooled grow lights
  • 500+ CFM carbon filter
  • 4x4 ft. Scrog net
  • Four plants maximum under screen
  • Fox Farm nutrient line
  • Smart pot/air pots
  • 1-2 medium/large osculating fans for top of canopy, one smaller fan underneath canopyto keep stagnant air moving
Does this setup sound like I might be able to achieve 1.5-2.5 lbs per harvest? I know it all comes down to the thumb of the person growing it and wether it's green or not. Not everybody will achieve the same results, but I've always liked to call myself an over achiever, but of course with anything, a learning curve must come with it. :lol:

Lastly, I must finish off this first post with some questions of utmost importance to me. I must say, I tend to worry myself to death over the smallest of things, so these may not even really be things to worry about. If they're not, or have already been answered in another thread, forgive me:

1. Concerning the ventilation setup on the air cooled HPS lights, should I create a unified ducting system connecting both HPS lights to one exhaust fan and port? Or have each HPS light light with its own fan and independent exhaust port?
2. I have been reading a lot on feeding my plants nutrients and it doesn't seem too daunting. I have pretty much settled on Fox Farms nutrient line based on the fact that so many other cultivators have had great success. But I must make sure that this is all I will need to feed my plant? I've read a little here and there on cal/mag deficiencies and things of that nature and just want to make sure the Fox Farm line isn't the only thing I will be needing to feed my plants! Please help with this one because nutrient feeding is one area where I have done the least of research to be honest, oops:o
3. I have really been stumped on if I should acquire a humidifier with an option to set desired humidity on it.. I am aware that not all grow rooms require a humidifier but i would much rather be safe than sorry. I just can't seem to settle on the right option, I obviously don't need a huge humidifier that would be used for a home because I only need to maintain the humidity within a 5x5 threshold. So that makes me think I would go with a smaller option. Also I started to think the plants being in there will raise the humidity levels by itself so that might be enough? Also where should humidity levels be at in each week of the grow?
4. I have decided on going with the scrog method because it seems like I will increase my harvest by a whole lot more. It makes sense to me, make it to where mostly all of the plant is being utilized by the light. No valuable watts will be wasted. I must ask though, in your opinion is it better to flip to 12/12 once 50%, 60% or 70% of the screen as been filled up? And approx. how long will it take me to be ready to flip to 12/12 once the seed starts germinating? Trying to get a better time frame down here. Also I need to ask, is 18 inches a good distance to have the screen above the plants to grow to?

Thank you so much and I'm sure right after I post this, I will think of a million more things to say and ask. I look forward to hearing feedback from you guys and smoke one for me. Many many many more posts coming in the following months, stay tunedbongsmilie
 

Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
Im also ding my first Scrog and my first proper indoor grow (i have grown out doors for many years on and off and have dabled under lights a couple of times.

From what ive deduced fill the screen before flip will give you longer cola's and utilizes the sapce better. Seems to be no "right" % with many saying 70%-80%.

Height of screen is up to you. Remember you have to get under there and do stuff..mines 12 inches from the top of the pot, again no "right" amount.

Seed to harvest under lights in soil around 4 months. From rooted clone 3 months. Less for hydro systems. (strain dependent and what your doing of cause)
 
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PSlacks

Member
Im also ding my first Scrog and my first proper indoor grow (i have grown out doors for many years on and off and have dabled under lights a couple of times.

From what ive deduced fill the screen before flip will give you longer cola's and utilizes the sapce better. Seems to be no "right" % with many saying 70%-80%.

Height of screen is up to you. Remember you have to get under there and do stuff..mines 12 inches from the top of the pot, again no "right" amount.

Seed to harvest under lights in soil around 4 months. From rooted clone 4 months. Less for hydro systems. (strain dependent and what your doing of cause)
I dream of being able to grow outdoors, the pictures I see of outdoor plants are absolutely jaw dropping! Maybe one day, the time is just not right yet :( Anyways, thanks for the tips there Lucky Luke, I hadn't even considered the fact yet that i will be under the screen messing with the plans and trimming and things of that nature. You never realize how valuable elbow room is until you don't have it! And another thing I gotta ask ya Lucky Luke, i have read from multiple sources that the reason many folks only fill up a percentage of the scrog screen before flip to 12/12 is because apparently during the first two weeks of flower, the plants really make a "stretch" for the light the compensates for the parts of the screens that have yet to be filled yet. Just curious on your opinion, mate.
 

Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
I dream of being able to grow outdoors, the pictures I see of outdoor plants are absolutely jaw dropping! Maybe one day, the time is just not right yet :( Anyways, thanks for the tips there Lucky Luke, I hadn't even considered the fact yet that i will be under the screen messing with the plans and trimming and things of that nature. You never realize how valuable elbow room is until you don't have it! And another thing I gotta ask ya Lucky Luke, i have read from multiple sources that the reason many folks only fill up a percentage of the scrog screen before flip to 12/12 is because apparently during the first two weeks of flower, the plants really make a "stretch" for the light the compensates for the parts of the screens that have yet to be filled yet. Just curious on your opinion, mate.
I read on hear from someone (i dont remember who) that they used to do like 80% and now always go 100%.
Fill the net 100% and get 10 inch colas
Fill the net 80% and get 5 inch colas.

Now i dont know if thats true or not but does make some kind of sense to me (but its my first scrog to dont forget..)

Yes, the majority of plants stretch. Double or triple their size.
 

PSlacks

Member
I read on hear from someone (i dont remember who) that they used to do like 80% and now always go 100%.
Fill the net 100% and get 10 inch colas
Fill the net 80% and get 5 inch colas.

Now i dont know if thats true or not but does make some kind of sense to me (but its my first scrog to dont forget..)

Yes, the majority of plants stretch. Double or triple their size.
Hmmm, I'm going to have to do some more research on this for sure. I really don't wanna take any chances at reducing my yield because nobody really likes doing that.. Anyways, I must agree with you that filling up the screen 100% before 12/12 flip does seem to make more sense than 70% or even as low as 50%.. but then again I am new to this. I mean, thinking about it in retrospect, the veg stage is the chance for the plant to grow and get strong, the moment you put it into flower, it begins to focus more on producing flower, rather than growing bigger to make more bud sites. Correct? Or absolutely not?
 

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
When you flip into flower you begin the "stretch" phase for about the next 3 weeks and some plants can double or even triple their height. Or length if properly ScroGed.

Most people say to fill to around 75% then the rest gets filled up during the stretch which is kinda true. I veg longer and if a grow tip gets to the edge I'll turn it around and start it going back across. All the smaller side branches growing off them get tied down too so you get a solid layer of a few large colas, lots of medium ones and even more thumb-sized ones.
 

coreywebster

Well-Known Member
Welcome to RIU @PSlacks
Glad you find this place a good resource. We are a good bunch as a whole but shit kicks off from time to time.
Lots of great folks on here.

Your goals seem achievable with the set up your talking about. Might take some time to get used to growing but your figures are possible. Going with Scrog is a great way to go about maximising yields.
You should check out the scroggers united thread. Speak to @luv2grow , I believe he is an experienced scrogger. Plus a genuinely helpful guy.

Just one tip, don't go cheap on fans and filters. If you can buy bigger than you require and turn them down using a variable transformer type of speed controller. That will keep noise lower and prolong the life of your filter. It also means you can turn it up and down when needed, even better would be a thermostatic fan speed controller which will maintain temps year round.
 

PSlacks

Member
When you flip into flower you begin the "stretch" phase for about the next 3 weeks and some plants can double or even triple their height. Or length if properly ScroGed.

Most people say to fill to around 75% then the rest gets filled up during the stretch which is kinda true. I veg longer and if a grow tip gets to the edge I'll turn it around and start it going back across. All the smaller side branches growing off them get tied down too so you get a solid layer of a few large colas, lots of medium ones and even more thumb-sized ones.
I've been looking at copious amounts of pictures on the web of different scrog final results. I've noticed that some folks seem to have what appears to be a pretty even canopy going across their scrog with an even amount of colas.. on the other hand, I will see some scrogs where it's just uneven. Of course there is plenty of main colas but it just doesn't seem to be as even distributed. What I'm trying to ask is what are the best techniques to make sure I'm making optimal use of bud sites? Do I just take the branch to another square when it reaches the bottom of the screen to make it to where places on the plant below what has already reached the screen can grow to be main bud sites? I also see people using zip ties as a way to keep the branches in the position I desire. Thanks for the reply mate, all help is appreciated :lol:
 

PSlacks

Member
Welcome to RIU @PSlacks
Glad you find this place a good resource. We are a good bunch as a whole but shit kicks off from time to time.
Lots of great folks on here.

Your goals seem achievable with the set up your talking about. Might take some time to get used to growing but your figures are possible. Going with Scrog is a great way to go about maximising yields.
You should check out the scroggers united thread. Speak to @luv2grow , I believe he is an experienced scrogger. Plus a genuinely helpful guy.

Just one tip, don't go cheap on fans and filters. If you can buy bigger than you require and turn them down using a variable transformer type of speed controller. That will keep noise lower and prolong the life of your filter. It also means you can turn it up and down when needed, even better would be a thermostatic fan speed controller which will maintain temps year round.
It really has been a fantastic resource for me. Endless information here on this site, almost surreal.

Anyways friend, I'll be sure to get in touch with @luv2grow and see how he's doing things. I appreciate you directing me towards folks in the know how, always greatly appreciated!

As for this carbon filter talk.. I really don't have a choice in going cheap on the carbon filters. Odor cannot leak into any other thresholds. I see you mentioned this fan speed controller and have had a chance to do some minor research while on breaks at work. I've discovered a handful of facts but of course want to clarify a couple of things. I originally didn't plan on going below a 500 CFM carbon filter setup. But with these options for speed controllers I see I could possibly get a let's say 1000 CFM rated fan and use the speed controller to tone it down to 800,700 or even 500 if so desired. I would just have the comfort of knowing I have the extra push if needed, plus I wouldn't have to be running the fan on maximum capacity 24/7, which I would imagine would increase the longevity of the fan?

Thanks @coreywebster for all the great info. Couldn't help but notice your profile picture.. you a fan of The Warriors? A classic I must say myself :eyesmoke:
 

coreywebster

Well-Known Member
Yeah it will increase the longevity of the fan and more importantly the filter. Fans last a long time anyhow. Ive had the same one running 24/7 for 6 years. Try to get a Variable transformer speed controller so the fan doesn't hum when turned down. They cost a bit more but work by lowering the voltage which make them a better choice.

Haha, your the first person to mention the profile pic. Yeah its one of my favourite movies.. Can you dig it.....
 

luv2grow

Well-Known Member
What did I miss? looks like I got some back reading to do. How's everyone's nets cruising along?
 

luv2grow

Well-Known Member
First off welcome aboard. Scrog is meticulous and I'd say around 65% of the pictures of scrog pics on the I net are not technically Scrogs haha. . You sound like you are on it already. You have some good research under your belt . So let's get into this!

So why 600's? I'm just guessing that you haven't acquired them yet? In a 5 by 5 it's a crap load of heat to manage. So if I was to put money down at this point in time, I would lay it towards led's personally. You save heat management IE: fan size and length of air swaps or temp control, power consumption around the whole grow, watering rates are less frequent, Easy to get perfect coverage over your grow space, usable vertical space in a tent, the list can keep on going. Just throwing some food for thought out there.

Second. Fox farm is fine for your first run. Grab some Bonticare cal/mag as a supplement and you'll be fine.

3. Really matters depending on your grow space and climate.

4. On sativas I run 70-80% then flip. Indica doms run the whole screen out.
18 inches is a good starting point. As you gain your skill set or technique play around with it. Indicas lower screen height. Sat's Higher. Every pheno of every strain likes their own style so get into a grove with em. They'll let ya know what they want or don't.
Use the tools available to you, keep them where you want them. Just remember stems expand so keep it a little loose if you go down the tie off mode path. Net size is another thing people really don't consider.
 

wearealldumb

Active Member
Agreed bongsmilie If you don't have a bigger tent i wouldn't put more then one 1000w in there and even that seems like it will be too hot unless you maybe get a cool tube and straight duct it through from one side to the other side of the tent. Im Leaning towards leds as well myself. I would look into COBs perhaps..? I Run 2 1000w hps in a decent sized room 7x10ish without any problems. I only use about 5x7 for the plants and trellis themselves and the rest is for me to squeeze my skinny ass in there. I do need a humidifier once the buds get big because it goes way up near the end of flower. unfortunately a humidifier puts out heat. Invest in a good a/c and it should do both for a tent. Look into the growboss on youtube he does some shit in tents you may find useful. Im About to flip soon just starting to fill the trellis. Both strains are Indica dominant .. Filling the trellis 90% for the back ladys and the front will be 100% full then ill flip and adding a second layer trellis after to hold up the floppers .. Not always necessary but it was last time... :weed:
 

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Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
Agree on The Grow boss. Not many people like his personality. I dont mind it and you do get used to him. In regard to what he says I think he is spot on, he tells it like it is. After you have watched his normal grow tip vids, his call in vids are entertaining and educational (albiet a little long for the info supplied) and well worth watching.
 

sunny747

Well-Known Member
Mmmm... I think that for 4x4 1.5 is aggressive. 10 to 14 ounces would be more accurate depending on strain and grow experience. Not to say that it can't be done, but the breeders typically quantify the expected yield 300grams per meter squared etc..I don't recall any of them saying 1000 grams.

Two 600s is overkill. Two CMH would probably rock that space. COB is always a good option, but expensive.
Did you top the plants? It looks like it in the pics. That would be a good thing..

You will likely need another layer to the scrog, especially if you fill the screen before flip.

As mentioned, don't forget the CalMag.
 
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