Lets be honest and talk about microbes there use, affects and cost

[hotrodharley]

Tons and tons of scholarly articles regarding beneficial microbes and the effects on crops. Meaning food and not cannabis.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5609239/

“Summary
Plant‐associated microbiomes have tremendous potential to improve plant resilience and yields in farming systems. There is increasing evidence that biological technologies that use microbes or their metabolites can enhance nutrient uptake and yield, control pests and mitigate plant stress responses. However, to fully realize the potential of microbial technology, their efficacy and consistency under the broad range of real‐world conditions need to be improved.”

 

[Don_Sequitor]

There might be a lot of interest in microbes for a nutrient deficient soil.

 

[Lightgreen2k]

Yes it's always good to not spend money you don't have to. I don't buy into all the cannabis specific marketing hype. I just grow them as I would any of the other dozens of plants I grow. I've been growing things for almost fifty years. I've never seen the money grab that I'm seeing targeted towards cannabis growers. So many have bought into the nonsense and seem happy to give their money away. I'm not one of them.

Roots grow just fine without spending money on unnecessary and unneeded products.

So you where growing marijuana in the 1960's "around" and born in the 1940's
And are using the net.

Those roots are root bound and not a healthy white. The facts are those microbes do make a difference, but I'm sure someone with all those years knows best

 

[xtsho]

So you where growing marijuana in the 1960's "around" and born in the 1940's
And are using the net.

Those roots are root bound and not a healthy white. The facts are those microbes do make a difference, but I'm sure someone with all those years knows best

Those roots are just fine. Not staged for a photo. Covered in dirt after just being watered. Plant exploded in growth after transplant without need for any microbe product. I'm not saying microbes are not good for a plants growth but hardly worth the ridiculous prices they charge for what is already present in soil and under proper growing conditions will thrive and multiply on their own naturally.

 

[Herb & Suds]

So you where growing marijuana in the 1960's "around" and born in the 1940's
And are using the net.

I'm Guilty as charged

 

[xtsho]

Cannabis targeted? Read about more than cannabis. It’s not bullshit. Some may overhype it but the science is real.

http://smsf-mastergardeners.ucanr.edu/Elkus/The_Effects_of_Mycorrhizal_Fungi_Inoculum_on_Vegetables/

Thank you for linking a real article and study and not something from Maximum Yield or another cannabis publication. I'm not saying microbes are not beneficial. My issue is with the ridiculous prices for products that are specifically targeted at cannabis growers. Any good soil already has microbes and they will continue to grow and multiply if you keep the soil happy. I grow in coco and roots grow like crazy without the need for microbes. Many things are good for growing plants. Many things are good but not needed. Where does one draw the line and stop paying for products? I have great harvests of good weed without those products. Do they help? Some do. Are they necessary? No. Are they worth the money? Not at all.

And that article was based on studies done outside in the ground growing vegetables not some closet grower dumping twelve bottles of Advanced Nutrients on their plants in HP Promix in a five gallon container. I'm a big fan of the Master Gardeners program and am glad you linked a valid source of information instead of some article from Stoner Science magazine. I'll admit microbes are good. But I also think that if you create the proper environment that they will grow and thrive on their own without the need for some expensive microbe product. And with the way people grow indoors dumping all kinds of stuff on their plants, flushing every time they check the pH runoff, etc... they are basically wasting any benefit they might get from adding additional microbes. A handful of worms will do the same thing. The problem is that worms can't survive in the toxic soup created when people dump a dozen bottles of stuff into their grow medium.

We might disagree on this but in the end I think we both are after the same thing. Healthy happy plants. There is more than one path to that end. Adding microbes isn't on the path that I'm taking. Others might want to have them in their journey but they are not necessary to reach the final destination.

 

[Lightgreen2k]

Thank you for linking a real article and study and not something from Maximum Yield or another cannabis publication. I'm not saying microbes are not beneficial. My issue is with the ridiculous prices for products that are specifically targeted at cannabis growers. Any good soil already has microbes and they will continue to grow and multiply if you keep the soil happy. I grow in coco and roots grow like crazy without the need for microbes. Many things are good for growing plants. Many things are good but not needed. Where does one draw the line and stop paying for products? I have great harvests of good weed without those products. Do they help? Some do. Are they necessary? No. Are they worth the money? Not at all.

And that article was based on studies done outside in the ground growing vegetables not some closet grower dumping twelve bottles of Advanced Nutrients on their plants in HP Promix in a five gallon container. I'm a big fan of the Master Gardeners program and am glad you linked a valid source of information instead of some article from Stoner Science magazine. I'll admit microbes are good. But I also think that if you create the proper environment that they will grow and thrive on their own without the need for some expensive microbe product. And with the way people grow indoors dumping all kinds of stuff on their plants, flushing every time they check the pH runoff, etc... they are basically wasting any benefit they might get from adding additional microbes. A handful of worms will do the same thing. The problem is that worms can't survive in the toxic soup created when people dump a dozen bottles of stuff into their grow medium.

We might disagree on this but in the end I think we both are after the same thing. Healthy happy plants. There is more than one path to that end. Adding microbes isn't on the path that I'm taking. Others might want to have them in their journey but they are not necessary to reach the final destination.

If you have never used them how can one Judge .

 

[Lightgreen2k]

Thank you for linking a real article and study and not something from Maximum Yield or another cannabis publication. I'm not saying microbes are not beneficial. My issue is with the ridiculous prices for products that are specifically targeted at cannabis growers. Any good soil already has microbes and they will continue to grow and multiply if you keep the soil happy. I grow in coco and roots grow like crazy without the need for microbes. Many things are good for growing plants. Many things are good but not needed. Where does one draw the line and stop paying for products? I have great harvests of good weed without those products. Do they help? Some do. Are they necessary? No. Are they worth the money? Not at all.

And that article was based on studies done outside in the ground growing vegetables not some closet grower dumping twelve bottles of Advanced Nutrients on their plants in HP Promix in a five gallon container. I'm a big fan of the Master Gardeners program and am glad you linked a valid source of information instead of some article from Stoner Science magazine. I'll admit microbes are good. But I also think that if you create the proper environment that they will grow and thrive on their own without the need for some expensive microbe product. And with the way people grow indoors dumping all kinds of stuff on their plants, flushing every time they check the pH runoff, etc... they are basically wasting any benefit they might get from adding additional microbes. A handful of worms will do the same thing. The problem is that worms can't survive in the toxic soup created when people dump a dozen bottles of stuff into their grow medium.

We might disagree on this but in the end I think we both are after the same thing. Healthy happy plants. There is more than one path to that end. Adding microbes isn't on the path that I'm taking. Others might want to have them in their journey but they are not necessary to reach the final destination.

Secondly where are you getting your info on, from people that add microbes. Many grows on rollitup are no**eidt till and have thriving systems.

No said anything about using advanced nutrients with microbes or 12 bottles. That is what you invented in your head only you think people are doing.

Where do they find you guys from?

There are a plethora of threads on rollitup on other places on the benifits.

You sound cheap or some might say frugal.

 

[xtsho]

Secondly where are you getting your info on, from people that add microbes. Many grow not till and have thriving systems.

No said anything about using advanced nutrients with microbes or 12 bottles. That is what you invented in your head only you think people are doing.

Where do they find you guys from?

There are a plethora of threads on rollitup on other places on the benifits.

You sound cheap or some might say frugal.

Cool. Thanks for the kind words.

 

[Lightgreen2k]

Cool. Thanks for the kind words.

Words tongue and cheek on the interwebs as there is no "tone in voice" associated

 

[xtsho]

Words tongue and cheek on the interwebs as there is no "tone in voice" associated

It's all good. I just had a conversation with my niece. She gave me a good schooling. She's doing Post-Graduate studies at a major university and is currently working on a paper about microbes and their potential in the agricultural industry. So yes there is a benefit from microbes but on a larger scale. The way people grow indoors and control every aspect of a plants life in a five gallon container the benefits are likely minimal. Farmers are looking at things like nitrogen fixing microbes as a way to reduce fertilization costs. But they are not buying those expensive products. They are adding things like manure and other components that help accelerate the growth of beneficial microbes. Things they used to do years ago but stopped when chemical fertilizers became widely available. They've found that they're killing the soil and are looking at ways to revive it naturally.

A couple handfuls of EWC should be enough to start microbial growth for growers. You don't need an expensive product marketed to cannabis growers to get microbes in your grow medium.

So yes microbes are good. But they can be cultivated for much less than what people pay for these products targeted towards cannabis growers. Some may say I'm cheap. Well I say yes I am. That's why I have money. I'm not broke and I plan on staying that way. I don't need to pay $25 for a small bag of microbes when I can just use some manure and EWC to make a tea for the soil. The microbes will grow and thrive on their own if I give them the right environment and food, I don't need to pay for anything other than standard amendments anyone mixing soil is going to have on hand.

I didn't mean to come off as an ass but I am what I am...

 

[doniawon]

Just wanted to mention for the 444millionth time .

Recharge is decent stuff!

 

[eyderbuddy]

I don't think microbes are absolutely necessary or that you can't grow without them but in my experience they work to improve plant health, and show visible results within days.

I'm quite the "frugal person" and usually just DIY everything on the cheap side. But then i spent about $25 on microbes... Just to give them a try, i thought... and haven't looked back ever since.

Products like Recharge, Tribus, Mammoth P, Photo Plus... They just work (yes, i've tried them) when used correctly. Some may be on the cheap side and some on the expensive side, but that's up to the buyer.

 

[hotrodharley]

Thank you for linking a real article and study and not something from Maximum Yield or another cannabis publication. I'm not saying microbes are not beneficial. My issue is with the ridiculous prices for products that are specifically targeted at cannabis growers. Any good soil already has microbes and they will continue to grow and multiply if you keep the soil happy. I grow in coco and roots grow like crazy without the need for microbes. Many things are good for growing plants. Many things are good but not needed. Where does one draw the line and stop paying for products? I have great harvests of good weed without those products. Do they help? Some do. Are they necessary? No. Are they worth the money? Not at all.

And that article was based on studies done outside in the ground growing vegetables not some closet grower dumping twelve bottles of Advanced Nutrients on their plants in HP Promix in a five gallon container. I'm a big fan of the Master Gardeners program and am glad you linked a valid source of information instead of some article from Stoner Science magazine. I'll admit microbes are good. But I also think that if you create the proper environment that they will grow and thrive on their own without the need for some expensive microbe product. And with the way people grow indoors dumping all kinds of stuff on their plants, flushing every time they check the pH runoff, etc... they are basically wasting any benefit they might get from adding additional microbes. A handful of worms will do the same thing. The problem is that worms can't survive in the toxic soup created when people dump a dozen bottles of stuff into their grow medium.

We might disagree on this but in the end I think we both are after the same thing. Healthy happy plants. There is more than one path to that end. Adding microbes isn't on the path that I'm taking. Others might want to have them in their journey but they are not necessary to reach the final destination.

Great White - very good but ridiculously expensive. All we are trying to do is duplicate nature and a natural environment. Including those of us who use peat. I have done enough side by side comparisons and the stuff is a bonus. Cloning - I take my cut. Scrape the outer layer of stem off with the edge of a knife. Split the stem about a half inch and dip in Clonex or honey and then in Mykos. Straight into Black Gold seedling mix in a Dixie cup. Then forget about it except checking to make sure it’s slightly damp. Try it. Works in straight vermiculite as well.



$25 for 12 ounces. It goes a very long way.

 

[hotrodharley]

I'm Guilty as charged

Same here. I must know this guy.

 

[Lightgreen2k]

The best I have used is Rootwise.

 

[Cali.Grown>408]

Best growers in the game reuse their ammended coco soil mixes for years..
you still have to feed your plants/soil but when you reuse your organic soil it’s already full of microbes

 

[Cali.Grown>408]

Easy way to save is to make your own LAB aka MYCOS then make an ammended soil mix you prefer and reuse it for a few grows..
Just use rice, milk, molasses to make MYCOS -watch a video on it..even if your not doing Korean natural farming you can still use the LAB aka MYCOS with amended soils.
I do an amended coco/vermiculite/compost with rice hulls, kelp meal, oyster shell, crab meal, rock dust, neem/karanja cake, gypsum.
This year I’ve been feeding light primordial solutions rootamentry/sea green/paleo bloom and pluc C from microbe life with homemade LAB.
Depending on the size of your grow it can get a little expensive to buy all of that but you reuse the soil for years. I’m reusing mine from last year but I’m adding more to it this year. Just added worm castings and guano

 

[DCcan]

Aerate a 5 gal bucket of Growstones, EWC,BT, Mykos, molasses for a week to inoculate, then use as microbe reservoirs.
As soon as they hit new soil, they turn gooey and start colonizing. Don't know whats taking hold, but plants love them, root magnets for young plants.

I usually just add some peat, ewc, perlite, guano,lime to old soil, or sift the Growstones out and reuse them. Nothing else can easily colonize them once they are saturated in that stuff, and PH drift from Growstones seems controlled.

 

[eyderbuddy]

Aerate a 5 gal bucket of Growstones, EWC,BT, Mykos, molasses for a week to inoculate, then use as microbe reservoirs.
As soon as they hit new soil, they turn gooey and start colonizing. Don't know whats taking hold, but plants love them, root magnets for young plants.

I usually just add some peat, ewc, perlite, guano,lime to old soil, or sift the Growstones out and reuse them. Nothing else can easily colonize them once they are saturated in that stuff, and PH drift from Growstones seems controlled.

EWC? BT?