Shut it the fuck down

[Fogdog]

Unfortunately not everyone can afford for their kids to stay home. If you can’t afford or don’t have someone who can take care of them what do you do? The only way closing schools down will work is if you hand out money for people to stay home from work as well. Otherwise who's helping kids learn?

my kids are doing virtual. I have one in each level of school. High, middle, grade school. Luckily we’re already a one income family otherwise it would have been a WAY harder decision.

Don't take me wrong, I'm not pointing my finger at you, I'm just riffing on what you just said.

You proposed just one solution: handing out money for everybody. That seems to me to be a static and stale solution. I don't even think it can work, given how few people in this country are able to teach kids well, much less have the education to do so. For example, although my parents cared, they were pretty much unable to help me with math. My mom was a lover of reading and she gave me that gift but she sure as hell couldn't teach me much about geometry, biology or chemistry. My dad was a wonderful artist but he topped off at 9th grade education. I could learn some creative arts from him and did so. History, sociology, civics, math, sciences, sports were all outside of their skill set, much less patience with an obnoxious little shit like me. I was physically and verbally abused, so there is that too. They were not good at teaching and flew off the handle sometimes. I don't blame them very much, they were who they were and not all that different from other parents of the day.

Are there other alternatives to pouring money on the problem and turning the solution over to parents? For example, we could fund an army of tutors who treat each student as an individual case. Some kids might require personal attention and others can work in an online classroom. Clearly we can't open schools where there are high rates of infection, so any solution would rely on remote learning. So, we have to build out the internet to the last mile everywhere. $$$ That brings us to another value from public education: socializing kids. I don't know how we do that but the solution where we just pay parents to home school doesn't address that.

 

[Wattzzup]

Don't take me wrong, I'm not pointing my finger at you, I'm just riffing on what you just said.

And for the record I have no solution I never thought it would get this bad. I’m not going to lie I was nay sayer from the start. I now see I was wrong. I still think the numbers are being inflated and the healthcare industry is getting rich off this.

You proposed just one solution: handing out money for everybody. That seems to me to be a static and stale solution. I don't even think it can work, given how few people in this country are able to teach kids well, much less have the education to do so. For example, although my parents cared, they were pretty much unable to help me with math. My mom was a lover of reading and she gave me that gift but she sure as hell couldn't teach me much about geometry, biology or chemistry. My dad was a wonderful artist but he topped off at 9th grade education. I could learn some creative arts from him and did so. History, sociology, civics, math, sciences, sports were all outside of their skill set, much less patience with an obnoxious little shit like me. I was physically and verbally abused, so there is that too. They were not good at teaching and flew off the handle sometimes. I don't blame them very much, they were who they were and not all that different from other parents of the day.

Are there other alternatives to pouring money on the problem and turning the solution over to parents? For example, we could fund an army of tutors who treat each student as an individual case. Some kids might require personal attention and others can work in an online classroom. Clearly we can't open schools where there are high rates of infection, so any solution would rely on remote learning. So, we have to build out the internet to the last mile everywhere. $$$ That brings us to another value from public education: socializing kids. I don't know how we do that but the solution where we just pay parents to home school doesn't address that.

I’m not suggesting throwing money on the problem. I’m saying people can’t afford to stay home.

I think virtual learning will be here to stay. With all the racists and instigators at schools we were already contemplating home school. So this is a good middle ground. Teachers will be teaching not the parents. The kids have to be logged on for 7 hours a day.

 

[Wattzzup]

BTW @Fogdog those remote areas you’re talking about building internet for are not even wearing masks or practicing any social distancing. They don’t seem effected but I’m sure they’re red areas so....

 

[Fogdog]

I’m not suggesting throwing money on the problem. I’m saying people can’t afford to stay home.

I think virtual learning will be here to stay. With all the racists and instigators at schools we were already contemplating home school. So this is a good middle ground. Teachers will be teaching not the parents. The kids have to be logged on for 7 hours a day.

That's a beginning. The internet doesn't reach everybody, so we should get started now building it out to the last mile. That last mile is really costly.

Remote learning isn't working for all kids even if they are in a good situation. Imagine what it's like for kids in an economically challenged household, with a lot of people crammed into an apartment.

Food security. Do I need to clarify?

The list goes on and on. I think it can work. Or could if we didn't have an administration that thinks America was great fifty years ago. spoiler alert: it wasn't.

So, remote learning is one alternative. How about communal bubbles, of, say, 500 people per bubble. Each school teaches all the kids in that bubble, across age groups. Each bubble has a coronavirus counselor, test-trace-isolate system and agreements between people within that bubble to follow specific practices for safe living during the epidemic. Within the bubble rules of social distancing and interactions between people can be relaxed. People sign up to fulfill tasks that need doing in some sort of social equity bank. This is pretty radical, I know and won't happen but I'm putting it out there to try to shake loose the way people think about our situation.

What I'm getting at is the tendency for people to jump to a conclusion without spending the time to evaluate all the alternatives before committing resources on one. Doing the obvious isn't necessarily the right thing to do when something new like this virus comes on the scene.

 

[Wattzzup]

Well we’re capable of getting the internet there I’m sure the only thing holding it back is whether or not it’s profitable to get the “last mile”. I’m sure that’s where the hold up is.

 

[Fogdog]

BTW @Fogdog those remote areas you’re talking about building internet for are not even wearing masks or practicing any social distancing. They don’t seem effected but I’m sure they’re red areas so....

Yah

This isn't a great time for social experiments. I'm stuck in a cooperation paradigm and a lot of places simply don't have either the resources or the culture to try that experiment. Not only that but the Trump administration seems intent on just ignoring the problems altogether.

I'm safe. My kids are safe. I live on a large lot with plenty of activities for them to do and I have access to the internet. Also job is safe. So I guess I could just pull the Linus Blanket over my head and feel good for a while. I'm worried that our ad hoc approach is failing kids in our society every bit as much as it has in controlling this epidemic. Oops, I have to pull that blanket down again.

 

[Fogdog]

Well we’re capable of getting the internet there I’m sure the only thing holding it back is whether or not it’s profitable to get the “last mile”. I’m sure that’s where the hold up is.

This gets us back to the idea that capitalism doesn't solve problems unless people have the money to pay for it. The cost will be felt 20 years from now, so, why make the investment now when I can buy a yacht instead?

 

[hanimmal]

Don't take me wrong, I'm not pointing my finger at you, I'm just riffing on what you just said.

You proposed just one solution: handing out money for everybody. That seems to me to be a static and stale solution. I don't even think it can work, given how few people in this country are able to teach kids well, much less have the education to do so. For example, although my parents cared, they were pretty much unable to help me with math. My mom was a lover of reading and she gave me that gift but she sure as hell couldn't teach me much about geometry, biology or chemistry. My dad was a wonderful artist but he topped off at 9th grade education. I could learn some creative arts from him and did so. History, sociology, civics, math, sciences, sports were all outside of their skill set, much less patience with an obnoxious little shit like me. I was physically and verbally abused, so there is that too. They were not good at teaching and flew off the handle sometimes. I don't blame them very much, they were who they were and not all that different from other parents of the day.

Are there other alternatives to pouring money on the problem and turning the solution over to parents? For example, we could fund an army of tutors who treat each student as an individual case. Some kids might require personal attention and others can work in an online classroom. Clearly we can't open schools where there are high rates of infection, so any solution would rely on remote learning. So, we have to build out the internet to the last mile everywhere. $$$ That brings us to another value from public education: socializing kids. I don't know how we do that but the solution where we just pay parents to home school doesn't address that.

I like that, would be a huge jobs initiative the Federal government could easily (and is designed to) fund.

I would add to it, for every 'entry' level job in the frontline community should have 3 employees for every 1 slot and make it federally funded. The wealthy who should have to fit the bill can't complain, because they are the ones getting the money they earn due to their lowest level employees exposure to the rest of the population.

And then have a week-on/ 2 week off quarantine period for these folks.

I really like the idea of small group teaching groups for more 1 on 1 in the kids home/daycare. It would make contact tracing possible too.

 

[hanimmal]

Our local area school claimed that 92% of parents and 88% of teachers wanted to go back to school full time. My wife and I both called bullshit on those numbers.

I don’t see how anyone would choose to go back with the numbers getting worse. Hopefully us keeping ours home and others too, will lessen the burden on teachers and staff at the school for those forced to go.

'Wanting to go back" is not the same as "Think it is safe enough to go back".

Those numbers are meaningless bullshit you are correct.

Edit: I do want to note, I did hear a lady who teaches special needs kids in the city. And I can really see a need for them to have the ability to meet in a building with access to everything they may need that they cannot get from home.

I can see how this segment of our society could be safely returned to empty/cleaned schools as long as everyone was tested ahead of time, and it would be easier generally to practice social distancing when not in classes.

But not if hundreds of kids are stuffed back in the building around them spreading germs to everyone including their families and teachers.

 

[Fogdog]

I like that, would be a huge jobs initiative the Federal government could easily (and is designed to) fund.

I would add to it, for every 'entry' level job in the frontline community should have 3 employees for every 1 slot and make it federally funded. The wealthy who should have to fit the bill can't complain, because they are the ones getting the money they earn due to their lowest level employees exposure to the rest of the population.

And then have a week-on/ 2 week off quarantine period for these folks.

I really like the idea of small group teaching groups for more 1 on 1 in the kids home/daycare. It would make contact tracing possible too.

All we are presented with right now is: stay home or send your kid off to school. It's the same old unimaginative conservative mindset at work. We can't send our kids back into school as if it's OK simply because they are less at risk. The whole system around the kids collapse when their parents or family become ill and die or overwhelm hospitals.

We need to open up our minds to alternatives and seek something that fits the new normal created by a disease that seems to be here to stay. It could be years before a vaccine is found. Maybe not but we have to consider how to deal with the reality we are in and not the one we had last year.

 

[Queen2Green]

BTW @Fogdog those remote areas you’re talking about building internet for are not even wearing masks or practicing any social distancing. They don’t seem effected but I’m sure they’re red areas so....

It's creeping on them. My hometown county didn't have any cases until about 2 weeks ago, and then they had 8 in one week. Welcome to covid They already voted on school and are using a blended model of online and in person learning. Following CDC and state and local guidelines. They will shut down if necessary...they've shut down school more than once a few times, for norovirus. It's a small town of mainly republicans but they are die-hards for their little farming community, and families. Their views on the rest of the world are pretty fucked up. Plus irrelevant, because they've never actually seen the rest of the world. They love their safety bubble. Lol, it's pretty crazy actually. Most small towns I've been to act that way.

Edit: All the sport coaches got together over the summer and had "sewing days" and created thousands of masks for the kids, and adults too I am sure. The lady who does all the sport clothing made "fight covid" t-shirts and gave them out. They also shut down and social distanced for months when they had no cases. Things like this is the reason I stand firm in my belief that "all republicans aren't bad." Some are just uneducated on world issues. They farm, work, fish, hunt, and play poker. They don't know what's going on outside their bubble and if they choose to live like that, that's their choice. I don't want people to judge me for my choices. That's why I left. Also, they likely mainly vote republican because oil and coal are big there. That's the economy outside of farming. So of course they are going to vote what they feel is best for their lifestyle. Sorry for the long edit. Forgot I wanted to contribute my feelings on that part.

 

[schuylaar]

shut it down..this virus is two weeks ahead + two weeks waiting for results = month head start everywhere.

A black bear wheeled a trash can up this house's driveway before looking for leftovers

This Florida black bear stood upright to a roll a residential trash bin toward a home before bringing the bin to the ground to search for leftovers.

www.usatoday.com

holy shit never knew florida had black bears this whole time.

 

[Fogdog]

shut it down..this virus is two weeks ahead + two weeks waiting for results = month head start everywhere.

A black bear wheeled a trash can up this house's driveway before looking for leftovers

This Florida black bear stood upright to a roll a residential trash bin toward a home before bringing the bin to the ground to search for leftovers.

www.usatoday.com

holy shit never knew florida had black bears this whole time.

Another effect of the virus. Turns people into Yogi Bears.

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

As the GOP plunges into the abyss, they only missed them being on fire and screaming in agony all the way to the bottom of the crater that they will make in the solid bedrock of their base.

 

[Gorillabilly]

its all a big sham. Both political parties and the media will quit using it to scare us into giving our country and rights away after the election.

I know that aint popular but this is a country that is ok with millions dieing every year from smoking, yet you can get smokes on any corner store in America. The politicians don't give a damn, this pandemic is just a crisis to take advantage of.

 

[Fogdog]

its all a big sham. Both political parties and the media will quit using it to scare us into giving our country and rights away after the election.

I know that aint popular but this is a country that is ok with millions dieing every year from smoking, yet you can get smokes on any corner store in America. The politicians don't give a damn, this pandemic is just a crisis to take advantage of.

naive

 

[UncleBuck]

its all a big sham. Both political parties and the media will quit using it to scare us into giving our country and rights away after the election.

I know that aint popular but this is a country that is ok with millions dieing every year from smoking, yet you can get smokes on any corner store in America. The politicians don't give a damn, this pandemic is just a crisis to take advantage of.

cigarettes aren’t contagious

 

[Gorillabilly]

cigarettes aren’t contagious

Valid point, but second hand smoken is. We've done some to help that but it don't stop Susie may trailer park from goin on a 6 hr road trip, with her new boyfriend who just got out of jail for his second math lab, and smokin a pack apiece with the 3yo in the back. Without a proper car seat of course.

 

[UncleBuck]

Valid point, but second hand smoken is

Hence why you can’t smoke just about anywhere in public now, dumbass

And you’d better tell this administration that smoking kills because pence still isn’t convinced

Two face

 

[Gorillabilly]

Hence why you can’t smoke just about anywhere in public now, dumbass

And you’d better tell this administration that smoking kills because pence still isn’t convinced

Two face

Yep, can't formulate an argument without name calling and personal attacks. You are the hallmark of your generation. Upside, makes it easy to tell when im winning.