Roy O'Bannon
Well-Known Member
Migrow has a bunch of light testing on his channel. He is a real good explainer and shows his data.
Are 600w hps being discontinued??
- Thread starter dredra
- Start date
jimihendrix1
Well-Known Member
Hortilux Blue-MMS Halide, both have a spectrum of 280nm-2500+.
NO LED has such a broad spectrum. What?? 380nm-750nm at best? Not even close to an HID.
NO LED has such a broad spectrum. What?? 380nm-750nm at best? Not even close to an HID.
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
Its easy to just say. Have you really tried out what led can give once you properly adjust the spectrum? I would say leds seem to be the standard of the market here tbh: you can even see some strains start to only look good under leds nowadays from breeding them under leds.
To "hit the mouth right" you just have to add a little blue/violet lower than 450nm and maybe a little reds/far reds on the other side of the spectru. to get it right. If you also leave an incandescent light bulb on dimmer you cover infra red and anything your darling hps is able to produce in spectrum.
HPS would only be the standard for those who cannot make the switch, or is too lazy to figure out how to make the switch with better results than HPS; which is more than doable.
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
280nm is hype, not even their own spectrograph gives them any coverage lower then 320nm. Not sure what part of +750nm you would like to have built in to your base spectrum tbh; its all infra red, could just as well be added thru incandescent?
Maybe a good option when power is cheap, light bulb exchange is not an issue and grower doesnt need to steer their crop really. And of course having good HVAC for the heat.
Edit: also, in general, if your light has any significant output at 280nm it needs very stringent compliance testing with regards to Health and Safety. I extremely doubt that this light has any 280nm. If it has then the manufacturer would have some actual prese table proof of it.
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DanKiller
Well-Known Member
You are not understanding simple facts, growing with LEDs is like growing your plants under a microwave oven.
No spectrum change will change this fact.
No spectrum change will make led bud good, it's designed to "kill" everything.
LEDs don't grow essential oils from garlic, lavender, etc...
Weed is no different, it's a living tissue, but it's much more fragile, it's not a human being.
LEDs are the only light source that emits this harmful qty.
There's a reason you see them everywhere in your life, they are a tool to radiate and harm your body and eyes, it was never about "saving power", if you don't believe this so called conspiracy, to each his own.. but it still don't change the fact it emits high levels of harming radiation.
So, HIDs, not HPS, is still the golden std of sun like light sources today, the closest you'll get.
love it or hate it.
LEDs spread light better, and make more light, but that light is destructive to plants and essential oils.
Not really in a sense the light is destructive, but the following RF it emits is a major downfall.
No spectrum change will change this fact.
No spectrum change will make led bud good, it's designed to "kill" everything.
LEDs don't grow essential oils from garlic, lavender, etc...
Weed is no different, it's a living tissue, but it's much more fragile, it's not a human being.
LEDs are the only light source that emits this harmful qty.
There's a reason you see them everywhere in your life, they are a tool to radiate and harm your body and eyes, it was never about "saving power", if you don't believe this so called conspiracy, to each his own.. but it still don't change the fact it emits high levels of harming radiation.
So, HIDs, not HPS, is still the golden std of sun like light sources today, the closest you'll get.
love it or hate it.
LEDs spread light better, and make more light, but that light is destructive to plants and essential oils.
Not really in a sense the light is destructive, but the following RF it emits is a major downfall.
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Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
Is there something other than "trust me bro" behind this? Whats the difference between one watt of HID red and Led red after they have been emitted from the light? What RF interference are you talking about? We harvest with radio on and we can hear when the phone rings in the speaker but nothing from the leds or the drivers; no interference what so ever, nothing with standard tv and no complaints from the neighbours... I just wanna know what it is that your talking about, facts or your own led nightmares, cause what youre talking about doesn't seem to happen anywhere ive been. But i do know that some led drivers may be a bit dodgy with rf, just as some old hps ballasts.
But please specify what part of the led engine is making what type of rf and how you can see this as if not this is as good as just saying "Leds>HID just cuz trust me bro..."
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Hollatchaboy
Well-Known Member
Don't plants sit in uv radiation, from the sun, all day?
I don't believe they are a fragile as you think.
Humans don't do to well, sitting in the sun all day, everyday.
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
You are not understanding simple facts, growing with LEDs is like growing your plants under a microwave oven.
-youd need to show that to thousands of growers, both cannabis and other crops, who use leds successfully.
No spectrum change will change this fact.
- microwaves are EM radiation, just like light, so really something that is part of the spectrum, if it where there as you state.
No spectrum change will make led bud good, it's designed to "kill" everything.
LOL you have not tried mine, they beat hps on all fronts
you should try how far you can get, there is sooooooopo much to be gained in quality, production and growth-behaviour, by just going a little bit outside the standard led light that you probably tried, and got a bad result from. May i ask what leds youve tried exactly to have your position.
Designed to kill? Thats a pretty loaded thing to say - if you have proof that there are leds with a builtin (and intentional!) death-ray being sold all over the place i would encourage you to buy some leds and then raise a law suit against manufacturers. Its usually illegal to manufacture household items with built in death rays im sure you could make a lot of money if you could come up with proof.
LEDs don't grow essential oils from garlic, lavender, etc...
-mine does...
Weed is no different, it's a living tissue, but it's much more fragile, it's not a human being.
LEDs are the only light source that emits this harmful qty.
- Again, could you show what this qty is? Anything more than just words?
There's a reason you see them everywhere in your life, they are a tool to radiate and harm your body and eyes, it was never about "saving power", if you don't believe this so called conspiracy, to each his own.. but it still don't change the fact it emits high levels of harming radiation.
- what radiation? Specify please and from where. Anything but just words.
So, HIDs, not HPS, is still the golden std of sun like light sources today, the closest you'll get.
love it or hate it.
LEDs spread light better, and make more light, but that light is destructive to plants and essential oils.
Not really in a sense the light is destructive, but the following RF it emits is a major downfall.
- You seem to specify the led emissions to radio bands; short, middle or long wave? Can you just give anything but "Trust me, bro, i found that conspiracy where they are actually right"
One thing i can get on board with: the efficiency mania around leds are a bit of a trap.
When growing you should be able to generate whatever you yourself feel is a quality environment (intensity/spectrum). Dont settle for anything less than what how ideally want your plant to grow. Now efficiency tells you how many watts you need to get this. It doesnt give any extra special thing, just power efficiency. I would prefer a 2.5ppf light with nice spectrum to a 3 ppf/w light with shitty spectrum.
But your troubles seem to have little to do with leds actual light: plant problems are due to missing IR or ambient heat (you cant grow good with leds at 20C) and some missing coverage of blues/violet in the range of 400-450nm (but not 450 itself.
The dangers of leds and humans are resumed in the blue spike in white lighting: its quite big and has an influence on the triggering and inhibition of melatonin and sleep cycles. But thats about it.
-youd need to show that to thousands of growers, both cannabis and other crops, who use leds successfully.
No spectrum change will change this fact.
- microwaves are EM radiation, just like light, so really something that is part of the spectrum, if it where there as you state.
No spectrum change will make led bud good, it's designed to "kill" everything.
LOL you have not tried mine, they beat hps on all fronts
you should try how far you can get, there is sooooooopo much to be gained in quality, production and growth-behaviour, by just going a little bit outside the standard led light that you probably tried, and got a bad result from. May i ask what leds youve tried exactly to have your position. Designed to kill? Thats a pretty loaded thing to say - if you have proof that there are leds with a builtin (and intentional!) death-ray being sold all over the place i would encourage you to buy some leds and then raise a law suit against manufacturers. Its usually illegal to manufacture household items with built in death rays im sure you could make a lot of money if you could come up with proof.
LEDs don't grow essential oils from garlic, lavender, etc...
-mine does...
Weed is no different, it's a living tissue, but it's much more fragile, it's not a human being.
LEDs are the only light source that emits this harmful qty.
- Again, could you show what this qty is? Anything more than just words?
There's a reason you see them everywhere in your life, they are a tool to radiate and harm your body and eyes, it was never about "saving power", if you don't believe this so called conspiracy, to each his own.. but it still don't change the fact it emits high levels of harming radiation.
- what radiation? Specify please and from where. Anything but just words.
So, HIDs, not HPS, is still the golden std of sun like light sources today, the closest you'll get.
love it or hate it.
LEDs spread light better, and make more light, but that light is destructive to plants and essential oils.
Not really in a sense the light is destructive, but the following RF it emits is a major downfall.
- You seem to specify the led emissions to radio bands; short, middle or long wave? Can you just give anything but "Trust me, bro, i found that conspiracy where they are actually right"
One thing i can get on board with: the efficiency mania around leds are a bit of a trap.
When growing you should be able to generate whatever you yourself feel is a quality environment (intensity/spectrum). Dont settle for anything less than what how ideally want your plant to grow. Now efficiency tells you how many watts you need to get this. It doesnt give any extra special thing, just power efficiency. I would prefer a 2.5ppf light with nice spectrum to a 3 ppf/w light with shitty spectrum.
But your troubles seem to have little to do with leds actual light: plant problems are due to missing IR or ambient heat (you cant grow good with leds at 20C) and some missing coverage of blues/violet in the range of 400-450nm (but not 450 itself.
The dangers of leds and humans are resumed in the blue spike in white lighting: its quite big and has an influence on the triggering and inhibition of melatonin and sleep cycles. But thats about it.
DanKiller
Well-Known Member
That's why sitting in high sun will radiate you aswell, not so good right ?
The atmosphere is filtering most of the harmful rays of the sun anyways so it's very marginal as it is.
@Rocket Soul try to stick to the subject, it's not about difference in photons, a red is a red and so fourth no matter which light made it
But if that light is coupled with harmful EMF radiation, it's a microwave with added light making abilities.
You ever heard of a simple google or YouTube search ? Just write EMF from leds
Observe it's the only light source emitting those harmful qtys, ask yourself why and come back with answers
The atmosphere is filtering most of the harmful rays of the sun anyways so it's very marginal as it is.
@Rocket Soul try to stick to the subject, it's not about difference in photons, a red is a red and so fourth no matter which light made it
But if that light is coupled with harmful EMF radiation, it's a microwave with added light making abilities.
You ever heard of a simple google or YouTube search ? Just write EMF from leds
Observe it's the only light source emitting those harmful qtys, ask yourself why and come back with answers
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
N
After google : Dude, the only thing that seems to emitt EM/RF around a led is a rectifying power supply- but this is not related to the led its down to the ac/dc transforming - and these rectifiers are generally only ever seen on household bulbs and other AC powered led items - not the same as a led growlight with a driver. Can you ask the conspiracy braintrust for some more info on the led death rays cause im not finding them. Better search terms or a link to something
No link? Ill try to get into this and google when theres nothing important going on cause all this sounds like loonie tunes a bit. Anything at all you could say about those EMFs from leds? Wavelength? Source within the diode? Anything but "lord save us from the led"?
After google : Dude, the only thing that seems to emitt EM/RF around a led is a rectifying power supply- but this is not related to the led its down to the ac/dc transforming - and these rectifiers are generally only ever seen on household bulbs and other AC powered led items - not the same as a led growlight with a driver. Can you ask the conspiracy braintrust for some more info on the led death rays cause im not finding them. Better search terms or a link to something
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tstick
Well-Known Member
Interesting. To be fair, the computer screen also emits harmful radiation....as do televisions and smartphones. Harmful radiation seems to be everywhere nowadays.
But, in my own experience, plants really do love HID light. I'm convinced it's the heat they emit in addition to the light.
I've said this before: Put two lights in an empty room -one being an LED and the other being an HID. Now put a cat in that room and wait about a half hour. Come back into the room and see where the cat is sitting. Life seeks warmth as well as light!
Having said that, I have gotten great results from my LED lights, as well. The buds grown under LED were also very sticky, oily and had a strong smell. I believe the real advantage to LEDs is that they are much less of a fire hazard than HID bulbs. I don't like being away from the grow, during lights-on time, when using HID bulbs. That's the trade off for me -safety.
But, in my own experience, plants really do love HID light. I'm convinced it's the heat they emit in addition to the light.
I've said this before: Put two lights in an empty room -one being an LED and the other being an HID. Now put a cat in that room and wait about a half hour. Come back into the room and see where the cat is sitting. Life seeks warmth as well as light!
Having said that, I have gotten great results from my LED lights, as well. The buds grown under LED were also very sticky, oily and had a strong smell. I believe the real advantage to LEDs is that they are much less of a fire hazard than HID bulbs. I don't like being away from the grow, during lights-on time, when using HID bulbs. That's the trade off for me -safety.
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
Yes, plants do love lights that emitt heat aswell as light. With leds comes an adaptation to this. Then seems to be fine. Also most incandescent or his have a continuous (all though very low in some places) coverage of the spectrum. Even hps has a small sliver of blue on one side. This is an argument why hid would be superior in some cases. I just make sure to cover all this anyways.
DanKiller
Well-Known Member
Computers, phones, tv, all emit EMF, the amount is what matters.
@Rocket Soul your comparisons are useless and don't mean nothing I'm sorry.
Take that same emf meter outside or wherever you and your plants are, compare the reading under your LEDs and tell me if it's the same
Your comparisons are saying we are all emfd all day which is true to some extant, but not to the extant your plants are exposed to it 24/7 and in the amount under your panel.
This debate is pointless, if you are unable to accept basic facts about the light source you so eager to explain.
Peace friends, stick to the facts
@Rocket Soul your comparisons are useless and don't mean nothing I'm sorry.
Take that same emf meter outside or wherever you and your plants are, compare the reading under your LEDs and tell me if it's the same
Your comparisons are saying we are all emfd all day which is true to some extant, but not to the extant your plants are exposed to it 24/7 and in the amount under your panel.
This debate is pointless, if you are unable to accept basic facts about the light source you so eager to explain.
Peace friends, stick to the facts
DanKiller
Well-Known Member
@tstick
Heat is a big factor, but it doesn't have to come from lights, I grew with LEDs on 31-32c, and indeed they were better performing at those temps.
Plants just love growing without being bombarded with EMF 24/7
Weed and trichomes especially are a very resilient plant and substance, even under 12 hours of constant EMF (LED) it will perform somewhat hence Jordey famous saying that led bud won't hit the mouth right...
LEDs make plants under perform, that's why it's impossible to extract allicin from garlic grown under leds and essential oil from lavender.
You wanna grow under them be my guest, I'm just saying facts here.
Heat is a big factor, but it doesn't have to come from lights, I grew with LEDs on 31-32c, and indeed they were better performing at those temps.
Plants just love growing without being bombarded with EMF 24/7
Weed and trichomes especially are a very resilient plant and substance, even under 12 hours of constant EMF (LED) it will perform somewhat hence Jordey famous saying that led bud won't hit the mouth right...
LEDs make plants under perform, that's why it's impossible to extract allicin from garlic grown under leds and essential oil from lavender.
You wanna grow under them be my guest, I'm just saying facts here.
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
Its more or less what youre saying?
How does "plant dont recieve this in nature" become "this is dangerous to plants"? How does RF of the rectifiers hurt plants? Youve missed that step. Only showing that there is rf in a led lightbulb doesnt really show any danger from led growlights, that have another powering method. You still to show 1 source of leds creating rf (and not led light bulbs with a rectifier attached). All other light bulbs showed was AC so no rf. But how do you go from "some rf" to "rectifier rf harmfull"? Youre still on "trust me bro" sorry but no more.
