CrackerJax
New Member
Yes, but guess how much that man has read in his lifetime? 
out.
out.
Global Warming... Oops, I'm Sorry It's Now Called CLIMATE CHANGE :lol:
- Thread starter CrackerJax
- Start date
medicineman
New Member
Well everyone but one that has responded to thios thread so far, has been a right wing nut job. All I can say is bolderdash, poppycock and hogwash: Here's a few before and after glacier pics.
http://digg.com/d1bIYB
http://digg.com/d1mfm7
Scientists have cautioned that a warming planet could melt Greenland's vast ice sheet, a potentially catastrophic event that would raise sea levels and inundate coastal communities around the globe.
Yet while they puzzle over when and whether this might happen, they're also mystified over how giant island formed so much ice in the first place. Greenland's ice sheet is the second largest in the world, behind only Antarctica.
Strangely, other parts of the globe at similar latitudes, including northern Canada and Siberia, don't have year-round patches of ice anywhere near as extensive or thick.
A new study finds that a mysterious drop in greenhouse gases around 3 million years ago allowed Greenland's ice to proliferate. The research could help with forecasts about the fate of the ice and the potential for rising seas.
Why it matters
If all of Greenland's ice were to melt, perhaps as quickly as in a few centuries, seas would rise 21 feet (6.5 meters) all around the planet, according to the U.S. Geological Survey. And already, an alarming melt is under way there, other studies find. In 2007, the ice melted at a rate of 150 percent of the average going back to 1988.
Recent studies have found that as the ice melts more rapidly, water pours through fissures and gets under glaciers, acting like a lubricant to allow the ice to race ever-faster toward the sea. In addition, when snow melts at high altitudes and then refreezes, it can absorb up to four times more sunlight, creating even more melting the next year.
Some scientists fear a snowball effect could exacerbate the ice sheet's disintegration in as little time as a matter of decades.
But given a lack of understanding about the mechanisms, and questions about how warm the planet will get and how much ice will melt, scientists' estimates for the extent of sea-level rise by the end of this century range from just inches to perhaps 6 feet or so.
The new study
Around 3 million years ago, there was an increase in the amount of rock and debris deposited on the ocean floor around Greenland. The stuff must have been deposited by ice that had originated on land and then become icebergs, indicating that large amounts of ice on Greenland only began to form around that time, scientists say.
"Prior to that, Greenland was largely ice-free and probably covered in grass and forest," said Dan Lunt of the University of Bristol in England. "Furthermore, atmospheric carbon dioxide levels were relatively high. So the question we wanted to answer was why did Greenland become covered in an ice-sheet?"
Theories abound, from changes in ocean circulation to changes in the Earth's orbit or tectonic uplift of the planet's surface. Another idea is that atmospheric greenhouse gas concentrations changed. Lunt and his colleagues used computer models of climate and ice sheets to test the theories.
Each theory got some support. But the only one producing effects large enough to explain the current reality was that carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas that acts like a blanket to keep heat in and warm our world, fell to levels closer to those of pre-industrial times.
The research, funded by the British Antarctic Survey, is detailed in the Aug. 28 issue of the journal Nature.
What it means
Here's the really interesting part: When Greenland was ice-free, carbon dioxide was at 400 parts per million by volume in the atmosphere, Lunt explained via email. The level was 280 ppm before the Industrial Revolution. Now it has climbed back to 385 ppm.
Next year, Lunt and colleagues plan to publish a study that applies their finding to the question of what this means for the future of the ice and the potential for higher sea levels. For now, he told LiveScience, "The work does certainly indicate that the ice sheet is sensitive to changes in atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations."
The study does not answer why Greenland got covered in ice but other northern locales did not. Lunt has an idea, however:
"The answer is most likely related to the fact that underneath the ice on Greenland are some high-altitude mountains on the east coast, which are high enough to be cold enough that ice can form, which then flows slowly down the slopes and eventually covers the entire island," Lunt explained. "In certain time periods [for example about 20,000 years ago], when the Earth's orbit is aligned in a certain way, ice does start to form in Canada and Siberia for example in the last Ice Age."
Yet another big question has now been raised: Why did elevated atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations fall so dramatically 3 million years ago?
Lunt's colleague, Alan Haywood of the University of Leeds, tackles that one: "That is the million dollar question which researchers will no doubt be trying to answer during the next few years."
1. Why are global warming specialists watching the Arctic so closely?
The Arctic is global warming's canary in the coal mine. It's a highly sensitive region, and it's being profoundly affected by the changing climate. Most scientists view what's happening now in the Arctic as a harbinger of things to come.
[FONT=helvetica,arial]Since 1979, the size of the summer polar ice cap has shrunk more than 20 percent. (Illustration from NASA)[/FONT]
2. What kinds of changes are taking place in the Arctic now?
Average temperatures in the Arctic region are rising twice as fast as they are elsewhere in the world. Arctic ice is getting thinner, melting and rupturing. For example, the largest single block of ice in the Arctic, the Ward Hunt Ice Shelf, had been around for 3,000 years before it started cracking in 2000. Within two years it had split all the way through and is now breaking into pieces.
The polar ice cap as a whole is shrinking. Images from NASA satellites show that the area of permanent ice cover is contracting at a rate of 9 percent each decade. If this trend continues, summers in the Arctic could become ice-free by the end of the century.
Uhhh, I think it's warming and I also think Man is somewhat responsible. Only the remote and it seems ancient occasional scientist refute this, oh yeah and all the right wing nutjobs. Funny how that works, 99% of scientists say it's getting warmer, the Ice caps are melting, yet you idiots keep claiming it's not. Just wait a while, Hummers are going to go on sale at any time now.
http://digg.com/d1bIYB
http://digg.com/d1mfm7Scientists have cautioned that a warming planet could melt Greenland's vast ice sheet, a potentially catastrophic event that would raise sea levels and inundate coastal communities around the globe.
Yet while they puzzle over when and whether this might happen, they're also mystified over how giant island formed so much ice in the first place. Greenland's ice sheet is the second largest in the world, behind only Antarctica.
Strangely, other parts of the globe at similar latitudes, including northern Canada and Siberia, don't have year-round patches of ice anywhere near as extensive or thick.
A new study finds that a mysterious drop in greenhouse gases around 3 million years ago allowed Greenland's ice to proliferate. The research could help with forecasts about the fate of the ice and the potential for rising seas.
Why it matters
If all of Greenland's ice were to melt, perhaps as quickly as in a few centuries, seas would rise 21 feet (6.5 meters) all around the planet, according to the U.S. Geological Survey. And already, an alarming melt is under way there, other studies find. In 2007, the ice melted at a rate of 150 percent of the average going back to 1988.
Recent studies have found that as the ice melts more rapidly, water pours through fissures and gets under glaciers, acting like a lubricant to allow the ice to race ever-faster toward the sea. In addition, when snow melts at high altitudes and then refreezes, it can absorb up to four times more sunlight, creating even more melting the next year.
Some scientists fear a snowball effect could exacerbate the ice sheet's disintegration in as little time as a matter of decades.
But given a lack of understanding about the mechanisms, and questions about how warm the planet will get and how much ice will melt, scientists' estimates for the extent of sea-level rise by the end of this century range from just inches to perhaps 6 feet or so.
The new study
Around 3 million years ago, there was an increase in the amount of rock and debris deposited on the ocean floor around Greenland. The stuff must have been deposited by ice that had originated on land and then become icebergs, indicating that large amounts of ice on Greenland only began to form around that time, scientists say.
"Prior to that, Greenland was largely ice-free and probably covered in grass and forest," said Dan Lunt of the University of Bristol in England. "Furthermore, atmospheric carbon dioxide levels were relatively high. So the question we wanted to answer was why did Greenland become covered in an ice-sheet?"
Theories abound, from changes in ocean circulation to changes in the Earth's orbit or tectonic uplift of the planet's surface. Another idea is that atmospheric greenhouse gas concentrations changed. Lunt and his colleagues used computer models of climate and ice sheets to test the theories.
Each theory got some support. But the only one producing effects large enough to explain the current reality was that carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas that acts like a blanket to keep heat in and warm our world, fell to levels closer to those of pre-industrial times.
The research, funded by the British Antarctic Survey, is detailed in the Aug. 28 issue of the journal Nature.
What it means
Here's the really interesting part: When Greenland was ice-free, carbon dioxide was at 400 parts per million by volume in the atmosphere, Lunt explained via email. The level was 280 ppm before the Industrial Revolution. Now it has climbed back to 385 ppm.
Next year, Lunt and colleagues plan to publish a study that applies their finding to the question of what this means for the future of the ice and the potential for higher sea levels. For now, he told LiveScience, "The work does certainly indicate that the ice sheet is sensitive to changes in atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations."
The study does not answer why Greenland got covered in ice but other northern locales did not. Lunt has an idea, however:
"The answer is most likely related to the fact that underneath the ice on Greenland are some high-altitude mountains on the east coast, which are high enough to be cold enough that ice can form, which then flows slowly down the slopes and eventually covers the entire island," Lunt explained. "In certain time periods [for example about 20,000 years ago], when the Earth's orbit is aligned in a certain way, ice does start to form in Canada and Siberia for example in the last Ice Age."
Yet another big question has now been raised: Why did elevated atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations fall so dramatically 3 million years ago?
Lunt's colleague, Alan Haywood of the University of Leeds, tackles that one: "That is the million dollar question which researchers will no doubt be trying to answer during the next few years."
1. Why are global warming specialists watching the Arctic so closely?
The Arctic is global warming's canary in the coal mine. It's a highly sensitive region, and it's being profoundly affected by the changing climate. Most scientists view what's happening now in the Arctic as a harbinger of things to come.
2. What kinds of changes are taking place in the Arctic now?
Average temperatures in the Arctic region are rising twice as fast as they are elsewhere in the world. Arctic ice is getting thinner, melting and rupturing. For example, the largest single block of ice in the Arctic, the Ward Hunt Ice Shelf, had been around for 3,000 years before it started cracking in 2000. Within two years it had split all the way through and is now breaking into pieces.
The polar ice cap as a whole is shrinking. Images from NASA satellites show that the area of permanent ice cover is contracting at a rate of 9 percent each decade. If this trend continues, summers in the Arctic could become ice-free by the end of the century.
Uhhh, I think it's warming and I also think Man is somewhat responsible. Only the remote and it seems ancient occasional scientist refute this, oh yeah and all the right wing nutjobs. Funny how that works, 99% of scientists say it's getting warmer, the Ice caps are melting, yet you idiots keep claiming it's not. Just wait a while, Hummers are going to go on sale at any time now.
CrackerJax
New Member
The Antarctic is the key since it holds BY FAR more ice than anywhere else, and it is GROWING...like I said, the EARTH is COOLING....loads of manipulated data out there. Once science gets politicized...we're cooked (pardon the pun).
EPA has now declared that CO2 the LIFE FORCE of the planet is a danger to us all. Pass the pipe please... Lawdy.
Follow the sun, not the hot air on earth....
out.
EPA has now declared that CO2 the LIFE FORCE of the planet is a danger to us all. Pass the pipe please... Lawdy.
Follow the sun, not the hot air on earth....
out.
medicineman
New Member
Have you ever watched a program on glaciel melt? I just watched a program on the Greenland Ice field. It is melting at a far more fast pace that thought before. Glaciel lakes that melt in summer and freeze again in winter are dissapearing in summer, melting and running into and under the glaciers. Some of these lakes are miles accross and hundreds of feet deep. I suggest that you doubters watch some scientific video of glaciel melt and get back to me.The Antarctic is the key since it holds BY FAR more ice than anywhere else, and it is GROWING...like I said, the EARTH is COOLING....loads of manipulated data out there. Once science gets politicized...we're cooked (pardon the pun).
EPA has now declared that CO2 the LIFE FORCE of the planet is a danger to us all. Pass the pipe please... Lawdy.
Follow the sun, not the hot air on earth....
out.
CrackerJax
New Member
Point. This is VERY important. IF indeed the glaciers are melting...there is not a thing we can do about it except move off of the coastlines. Greenland does not include enough water to raise the sea levels much at all. The arctic ice has already been displaced so no worries there. The Antarctic is the HEAVY hitter in the whole thing and it is GAINING ice and lots of it. When you see the footage of shelves falling into the ocean it is because the ice is thickening in the middle. What everybody is screaming about is like flakes falling off of a pie crust as the pie rises. A drop in the bucket, so to speak. And again, whipping up fear to gain control over something UNCONTROLLABLE is a farce, and a cruel one at that.
Look, just remember this bit of advice...if Al Gore says it's day, you can bet it's night.
out.
Look, just remember this bit of advice...if Al Gore says it's day, you can bet it's night.
out.
and this has NEVER happened before? in the history of the planet? this is a "unique" event? i highly doubt it. did you know the sahara dessert used to be a rain forest? now how'd that happen?
earth is NOT a stable environment. it is in constant change. we are NOT in control.
isn't there gold up there?FDD2BLK is correct natural cycle not a damn thing we can do to stop it. Get over yourself, and enjoy a poler bear burger. I can't wait for this shit to warm up I'll move to Alaska. Wide open spaces
SlikWiLL13
Well-Known Member
FDD2BLK is correct natural cycle not a damn thing we can do to stop it. Get over yourself, and enjoy a poler bear burger. I can't wait for this shit to warm up I'll move to Alaska. Wide open spaces
isn't there gold up there?
medicineman
New Member
I realize that we are not the entire cause, But we are the tipping point cause, and BTW if the entire greenland Ice shelf were to melt, predictions are around 20 ft increase in sea level. Actually the level thing won't affect me here in Vegas, 2700 ft elevation, but what seems to be happening is the reduced level in salinity of the ocean is changing the thermal activator, the way the ocean currents flow around the globe. I hope all you doubters get the submersible version of your hummers, there will be a lot of traffic on Cajon pass.and this has NEVER happened before? in the history of the planet? this is a "unique" event? i highly doubt it. did you know the sahara dessert used to be a rain forest? now how'd that happen?
earth is NOT a stable environment. it is in constant change. we are NOT in control.
CrackerJax
New Member
We are not the tipping point...we don't control the climate. We are just riding along, just like any other species. It's only narcissism at play and a willingness to control others through misinformation.
out.
out.
TheBrutalTruth
Well-Known Member
Let's not ignore the fact that the trend has been down for at least the last 5 years.Well everyone but one that has responded to thios thread so far, has been a right wing nut job. All I can say is bolderdash, poppycock and hogwash: Here's a few before and after glacier pics.
Top Left, Winter
Top Right, Summer
At least that's probably when they were taken. Who can forget the Summer Polar Bear Picture.
Scientists have cautioned that a warming planet could melt Greenland's vast ice sheet, a potentially catastrophic event that would raise sea levels and inundate coastal communities around the globe.
Yet while they puzzle over when and whether this might happen, they're also mystified over how giant island formed so much ice in the first place. Greenland's ice sheet is the second largest in the world, behind only Antarctica.
Strangely, other parts of the globe at similar latitudes, including northern Canada and Siberia, don't have year-round patches of ice anywhere near as extensive or thick.
A new study finds that a mysterious drop in greenhouse gases around 3 million years ago allowed Greenland's ice to proliferate. The research could help with forecasts about the fate of the ice and the potential for rising seas.
Why it matters
If all of Greenland's ice were to melt, perhaps as quickly as in a few centuries, seas would rise 21 feet (6.5 meters) all around the planet, according to the U.S. Geological Survey. And already, an alarming melt is under way there, other studies find. In 2007, the ice melted at a rate of 150 percent of the average going back to 1988.
Recent studies have found that as the ice melts more rapidly, water pours through fissures and gets under glaciers, acting like a lubricant to allow the ice to race ever-faster toward the sea. In addition, when snow melts at high altitudes and then refreezes, it can absorb up to four times more sunlight, creating even more melting the next year.
Some scientists fear a snowball effect could exacerbate the ice sheet's disintegration in as little time as a matter of decades.
But given a lack of understanding about the mechanisms, and questions about how warm the planet will get and how much ice will melt, scientists' estimates for the extent of sea-level rise by the end of this century range from just inches to perhaps 6 feet or so.
The new study
Around 3 million years ago, there was an increase in the amount of rock and debris deposited on the ocean floor around Greenland. The stuff must have been deposited by ice that had originated on land and then become icebergs, indicating that large amounts of ice on Greenland only began to form around that time, scientists say.
"Prior to that, Greenland was largely ice-free and probably covered in grass and forest," said Dan Lunt of the University of Bristol in England. "Furthermore, atmospheric carbon dioxide levels were relatively high. So the question we wanted to answer was why did Greenland become covered in an ice-sheet?"
Theories abound, from changes in ocean circulation to changes in the Earth's orbit or tectonic uplift of the planet's surface. Another idea is that atmospheric greenhouse gas concentrations changed. Lunt and his colleagues used computer models of climate and ice sheets to test the theories.
Each theory got some support. But the only one producing effects large enough to explain the current reality was that carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas that acts like a blanket to keep heat in and warm our world, fell to levels closer to those of pre-industrial times.
The research, funded by the British Antarctic Survey, is detailed in the Aug. 28 issue of the journal Nature.
What it means
Here's the really interesting part: When Greenland was ice-free, carbon dioxide was at 400 parts per million by volume in the atmosphere, Lunt explained via email. The level was 280 ppm before the Industrial Revolution. Now it has climbed back to 385 ppm.
Next year, Lunt and colleagues plan to publish a study that applies their finding to the question of what this means for the future of the ice and the potential for higher sea levels. For now, he told LiveScience, "The work does certainly indicate that the ice sheet is sensitive to changes in atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations."
The study does not answer why Greenland got covered in ice but other northern locales did not. Lunt has an idea, however:
"The answer is most likely related to the fact that underneath the ice on Greenland are some high-altitude mountains on the east coast, which are high enough to be cold enough that ice can form, which then flows slowly down the slopes and eventually covers the entire island," Lunt explained. "In certain time periods [for example about 20,000 years ago], when the Earth's orbit is aligned in a certain way, ice does start to form in Canada and Siberia for example in the last Ice Age."
Yet another big question has now been raised: Why did elevated atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations fall so dramatically 3 million years ago?
Lunt's colleague, Alan Haywood of the University of Leeds, tackles that one: "That is the million dollar question which researchers will no doubt be trying to answer during the next few years."
1. Why are global warming specialists watching the Arctic so closely?
The Arctic is global warming's canary in the coal mine. It's a highly sensitive region, and it's being profoundly affected by the changing climate. Most scientists view what's happening now in the Arctic as a harbinger of things to come.
[FONT=helvetica,arial]Since 1979, the size of the summer polar ice cap has shrunk more than 20 percent. (Illustration from NASA)[/FONT]
If the Red Boundary marks the old boundary what's that giant white spot on the right that's outside the boundary? And what about the bits to the north?
More to the point, wouldn't Antarctica (with it's massive amount of ice) be drastically more important than the Arctic?
2. What kinds of changes are taking place in the Arctic now?
Average temperatures in the Arctic region are rising twice as fast as they are elsewhere in the world. Arctic ice is getting thinner, melting and rupturing. For example, the largest single block of ice in the Arctic, the Ward Hunt Ice Shelf, had been around for 3,000 years before it started cracking in 2000. Within two years it had split all the way through and is now breaking into pieces.
Oh, wow, 3,000 years, that's like ... 1/1,000,000 or less the age of the planet. Less than 1/10,000th the amount of time humans have been in existence.
To try basing science on such incredibly short geological time frames is a mark of hubris and stupidity.
Worrying about what is ultimately short term deviations not exceeding previous thresh-holds is a mark of nothing more than narcissistic Hubris.
The polar ice cap as a whole is shrinking. Images from NASA satellites show that the area of permanent ice cover is contracting at a rate of 9 percent each decade. If this trend continues, summers in the Arctic could become ice-free by the end of the century.
Uhhh, I think it's warming and I also think Man is somewhat responsible. Only the remote and it seems ancient occasional scientist refute this, oh yeah and all the right wing nutjobs. Funny how that works, 99% of scientists say it's getting warmer, the Ice caps are melting, yet you idiots keep claiming it's not. Just wait a while, Hummers are going to go on sale at any time now.
Or ignore the fact that there is a large amount of proof that warming would likely be good, leading to more vegetation, longer growing seasons, and ultimately less Carbon Dioxide in the atmosphere.
Perhaps (instead of focusing on the emission of CO2) the idiots in the environmental movement should spend more time focusing on the absorption of CO2.
Of course, such actions would mean they would actually have to give up their plans on killing off 80% of the population.
CO2, a dangerous gas, bah, what's next declaring Dihydrogen Monoxide as a dangerous liquid?
medicineman
New Member
What about de-forestation? Do you also believe that is a good thing?
CrackerJax
New Member
TOPIC SHIFT!!! Did you feel it? 
CO2 is wonderful for forests.... but now CO2 is the enemy...hisss
out.
CO2 is wonderful for forests.... but now CO2 is the enemy...hisss
out.
medicineman
New Member
The enemy is man. Cutting down the forests and burning hydrocarbons like there's no tomorrow. And guess what, there may not be.TOPIC SHIFT!!! Did you feel it?
CO2 is wonderful for forests.... but now CO2 is the enemy...hisss
out.
TheBrutalTruth
Well-Known Member
there is no tomorrow, tomorrow the sun will swell up and swallow the earth and this miserable icy dirtball will be gone.
Antidisestablishmentarian
Well-Known Member
Man, sometimes I feel like it's the Y2K bug all over again.
Deforestation is a product of overpopulation.
Climate change is a naturally occurring event.
To our lifespan, it seems significant.
In the Earth's lifespan, it is but a drop in the bucket.
See, over the 4.5 billion years the Earth has been around, it's climate has changed thousands of times.
Ever hear of the Ice ages? Know how they started? The Earth cooled down(which is what scientists told us was happening in the 70's. Oh no the Ice age is coming back!).
Know how they ended? The Earth warmed up.
It happens a lot.
No reason to be alarmed.
Do I think we could reduce pollutants and go a little more green? Sure.
But not because of global warming. It's because we can save money and use less resources or better resources.
CrackerJax
New Member
The difference is science has been hijacked by politics....powah.
Only the blind are fooled.
out.
potsomker420
Well-Known Member
all those cars driving everywhere doesn't do anything? the billions of people all over the world don't add anything either?, Why dont you hop back in your hummer and drive on down to the gas station for the next 20 years, good idea
medicineman
New Member
People that are very comfortable with the status Quo are less likely to be green, like "Damn the torpedos, full steam ahead". If you have plenty of money and live in a big luxurious house and drive gas guzzlers, why would you be worried about the environment, It won't really get bad untill you're dead and gone anyway, fuck your kids and grandkids, EH?