why do you want the government?

londonfog

Well-Known Member
exactly he was the first. who did it before him? it was privately run.
Wrong again....You going to flunk history..lol
[SIZE=-1][SIZE=-1]In early colonial times, correspondents depended on friends, merchants, and Native Americans to carry messages between the colonies. However, most correspondence ran between the colonists and England, their mother country. It was largely to handle this mail that, in 1633, the first official notice of a postal service in the colonies appeared. The General Court of Massachusetts designated Richard Fairbanks' tavern in Boston as the official repository of mail brought from or sent overseas, in line with the practice in England and other nations to use coffee houses and taverns as mail drops. Local authorities operated post routes within the colonies. Then, in 1673, Governor Francis Lovelace of New York set up a monthly post between New York and Boston. The service was of short duration, but the post rider's trail became known as the Old Boston Post Road, part of today's U.S. Route 1. William Penn established Pennsylvania's first post office in 1683. In the South, private messengers, usually slaves, connected the huge plantations; a hogshead of tobacco was the penalty for failing to relay mail to the next plantation. Central postal organization came to the colonies only after 1691 when Thomas Neale received a 21-year grant from the British Crown for a North American postal service. Neale never visited America. Instead, he appointed Governor Andrew Hamilton of New Jersey as his Deputy Postmaster General. Neale's franchise cost him only 80 cents a year but was no bargain; he died heavily in debt, in 1633, after assigning his interests in America to Andrew Hamilton and another Englishman, R. West. In 1707, the British Government bought the rights to the North American postal service from West and the widow of Andrew Hamilton. It then appointed John Hamilton, Andrew's son, as Deputy Postmaster General of America. He served until 1721 when he was succeeded by John Lloyd of Charleston, South Carolina. In 1730, Alexander Spotswood, a former lieutenant governor of Virginia, became Deputy Postmaster General for America. His most notable achievement probably was the appointment of Benjamin Franklin as postmaster of Philadelphia in 1737. Franklin was only 31 years old at the time, the struggling printer and publisher of The Pennsylvania Gazette. Later he would become one of the most popular men of his age. Two other Virginians succeeded Spotswood: Head Lynch in 1733 and Elliot Benger in 1743. When Benger died in 1753, Franklin and William Hunter, postmaster of Williamsburg, Virginia, were appointed by the Crown as Joint Postmaster- General for the colonies. Hunter died in 1761, and John Foxcroft of New York succeeded him, serving until the outbreak of the Revolution. During his time as a Joint Postmaster General for the Crown, Franklin effected many important and lasting improvements in the colonial posts. He immediately began to reorganize the service, setting out on a long tour to inspect post offices in the North and others as far south as Virginia. New surveys were made, milestones were placed on principal roads, and new and shorter routes laid out. For the first time, post riders carried mail at night between Philadelphia and New York, with the travel time shortened by at least half. In 1760, Franklin reported a surplus to the British Postmaster General -- a first for the postal service in North America. When Franklin left office, post roads operated from Maine to Florida and from New York to Canada, and mail between the colonies and the mother country operated on a regular schedule, with posted times. In addition, to regulate post offices and audit accounts, the position of surveyor was created in 1772; this is considered the precursor of today's Postal Inspection Service. By 1774, however, the colonists viewed the royal post office with suspicion. Franklin was dismissed by the Crown for actions sympathetic to the cause of the colonies. Shortly after, William Goddard, a printer and newspaper publisher (whose father had been postmaster of New London, Connecticut, under Franklin) set up a Constitutional Post for inter-colonial mail service. Colonies funded it by subscription, and net revenues were to be used to improve the postal service rather than to be paid back to the subscribers. By 1775, when the Continental Congress met at Philadelphia, Goddard's colonial post was flourishing, and 30 post offices operated between Portsmouth, New Hampshire, and Williamsburg[/SIZE][/SIZE]
 

Cloud City

New Member
The point with the light bulbs is that when you need to heat your home, you won't need to heat it as much if you use incandescent, because the incandescent put off gobs of heat themselves. Thats the whole point. When they say that Fluoros are so much more efficient they are correct, but in the winter those incandescent bulbs help to heat the home, so the fluoros would provide no net energy savings because you will have to compensate for the less heat they put out by running your furnace longer. So when you are heating your home, fluoros provide no energy savings overall. Get it?
:dunce:


Heating your home with incandescent bulbs is a waste of electricity and money. You'd have to be running more than 50 100+ watt incandescents in the same room before you even see a difference in temps, if any.
 

Wordz

Well-Known Member
The government did not make Murder Illegal. Man did. I do not advocate government not making laws that protect kids, I never said that, your just trying to straw man the argument. By your reasoning would you neglect your child if the government did NOT have a law against it? If there was no law against murder, would you go around murdering? well would you? I don't think we need a law telling us we need to take care of our kids, it should be a natural instinct, just as we know that murdering others is wrong even if there is no law against it. Thats my argument, but your argument is that if there were no laws against doing bad things that people would just go ape shit doing bad things. Have some faith in your Neighbor.


Do you grow pot because it is legal to do so?

The point with the light bulbs is that when you need to heat your home, you won't need to heat it as much if you use incandescent, because the incandescent put off gobs of heat themselves. Thats the whole point. When they say that Fluoros are so much more efficient they are correct, but in the winter those incandescent bulbs help to heat the home, so the fluoros would provide no net energy savings because you will have to compensate for the less heat they put out by running your furnace longer. So when you are heating your home, fluoros provide no energy savings overall. Get it?
1. so kids that get abused by their parents would just be "unlucky". their parents shouldn't be accountable if they just don't have the instinct? Thats gotta be one of the stupidest ideas I've ever seen written onto the internet.

2. If murder wasn't illegal of course more murders would be committed think of all the drunks piling out of the clubs. Having a bad day and get cut off in traffic fuck it just cap that motherfucker why not? it's not like you'd be sitting in prison for a minute.:wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall:
 

maxamus1

Well-Known Member
Wrong again....You going to flunk history..lol
[SIZE=-1][SIZE=-1]In early colonial times, correspondents depended on friends, merchants, and Native Americans to carry messages between the colonies. However, most correspondence ran between the colonists and England, their mother country. It was largely to handle this mail that, in 1633, the first official notice of a postal service in the colonies appeared. The General Court of Massachusetts designated Richard Fairbanks' tavern in Boston as the official repository of mail brought from or sent overseas, in line with the practice in England and other nations to use coffee houses and taverns as mail drops. Local authorities operated post routes within the colonies. Then, in 1673, Governor Francis Lovelace of New York set up a monthly post between New York and Boston. The service was of short duration, but the post rider's trail became known as the Old Boston Post Road, part of today's U.S. Route 1. William Penn established Pennsylvania's first post office in 1683. In the South, private messengers, usually slaves, connected the huge plantations; a hogshead of tobacco was the penalty for failing to relay mail to the next plantation. Central postal organization came to the colonies only after 1691 when Thomas Neale received a 21-year grant from the British Crown for a North American postal service. Neale never visited America. Instead, he appointed Governor Andrew Hamilton of New Jersey as his Deputy Postmaster General. Neale's franchise cost him only 80 cents a year but was no bargain; he died heavily in debt, in 1633, after assigning his interests in America to Andrew Hamilton and another Englishman, R. West. In 1707, the British Government bought the rights to the North American postal service from West and the widow of Andrew Hamilton. It then appointed John Hamilton, Andrew's son, as Deputy Postmaster General of America. He served until 1721 when he was succeeded by John Lloyd of Charleston, South Carolina. In 1730, Alexander Spotswood, a former lieutenant governor of Virginia, became Deputy Postmaster General for America. His most notable achievement probably was the appointment of Benjamin Franklin as postmaster of Philadelphia in 1737. Franklin was only 31 years old at the time, the struggling printer and publisher of The Pennsylvania Gazette. Later he would become one of the most popular men of his age. Two other Virginians succeeded Spotswood: Head Lynch in 1733 and Elliot Benger in 1743. When Benger died in 1753, Franklin and William Hunter, postmaster of Williamsburg, Virginia, were appointed by the Crown as Joint Postmaster- General for the colonies. Hunter died in 1761, and John Foxcroft of New York succeeded him, serving until the outbreak of the Revolution. During his time as a Joint Postmaster General for the Crown, Franklin effected many important and lasting improvements in the colonial posts. He immediately began to reorganize the service, setting out on a long tour to inspect post offices in the North and others as far south as Virginia. New surveys were made, milestones were placed on principal roads, and new and shorter routes laid out. For the first time, post riders carried mail at night between Philadelphia and New York, with the travel time shortened by at least half. In 1760, Franklin reported a surplus to the British Postmaster General -- a first for the postal service in North America. When Franklin left office, post roads operated from Maine to Florida and from New York to Canada, and mail between the colonies and the mother country operated on a regular schedule, with posted times. In addition, to regulate post offices and audit accounts, the position of surveyor was created in 1772; this is considered the precursor of today's Postal Inspection Service. By 1774, however, the colonists viewed the royal post office with suspicion. Franklin was dismissed by the Crown for actions sympathetic to the cause of the colonies. Shortly after, William Goddard, a printer and newspaper publisher (whose father had been postmaster of New London, Connecticut, under Franklin) set up a Constitutional Post for inter-colonial mail service. Colonies funded it by subscription, and net revenues were to be used to improve the postal service rather than to be paid back to the subscribers. By 1775, when the Continental Congress met at Philadelphia, Goddard's colonial post was flourishing, and 30 post offices operated between Portsmouth, New Hampshire, and Williamsburg[/SIZE][/SIZE]

lol. ok you got me. besides the point.... privateers can handle the mail.
 

Cloud City

New Member
yeah not a bad idea, but the old base must be able to function own its own..Maybe create some jobs for the homeless by doing so hey use the old bx/px as a grocery store...use the land for farming and such...hey starting to get something here...hmmmm



Thats what I'm talking about, or even turning the bases into affordable housing whatever. Just getting the military out and cleaning it up and opening it to the public would be a good start.
 

Cloud City

New Member
Cloud City,

Don't mean to sound trite, but there is no such thing as free healthcare.



Yeah and Bush's wars were'nt free either. Had he not shipped all our money into Baghdad by the plane load it would have been more than enough to fully fund a public health care system for every man, woman, child, and illegal alien in America.
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
Thats what I'm talking about, or even turning the bases into affordable housing whatever. Just getting the military out and cleaning it up and opening it to the public would be a good start.
I saw a base outside of Saginaw Mi. that they converted and used it to refurbish aircraft..Got base in San Bernadino Ca. they converted to an airport,but they still wasting a lot of land with that one..
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
Yeah and Bush's wars were'nt free either. Had he not shipped all our money into Baghdad by the plane load it would have been more than enough to fully fund a public health care system for every man, woman, child, and illegal alien in America.
Amen.......
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
lol. ok you got me. besides the point.... privateers can handle the mail.
Ask UPS how that's working out...guy you got to start paying attention to whats going on in the world...USPS owns delivery systems world wide..Big props to Royal Mail as well ..lol
 

maxamus1

Well-Known Member
so the US postal service is just killing the rest of them huh. they are doing such a great job, haveing no problems to deal with. yea. ill get back to ya got to watch soa.
 

BlueBalls

Well-Known Member
Ask UPS how that's working out...guy you got to start paying attention to whats going on in the world...USPS owns delivery systems world wide..Big props to Royal Mail as well ..lol
What does the success of the USPS have anything to do with how the private sector would succeed in its absence?
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
so the US postal service is just killing the rest of them huh. they are doing such a great job, having no problems to deal with. yea. ill get back to ya got to watch soa.
Hey don't get me wrong I'm glad we have UPS,USPS,FEDEX....the all bring us competition which can get you lower prices, but do you really think for one minute that if you had to have UPS deliver you a piece of mail it would just cost more then 44 cents to send it...hence why I say America needs to have the government get into Americas health care and give the people Health Care For All... lol had to go there ..
 

ancap

Active Member
Ask UPS how that's working out...guy you got to start paying attention to whats going on in the world...USPS owns delivery systems world wide..Big props to Royal Mail as well ..lol

I don't know how a monopoly couldn't "own" a particular service. The further a service provider is separated from their customers (i.e any government service), the less accountability that service provider has to deliver a quality service (no pun intended). You have no company to compare the USPS to because they do not, nor have they ever existed.
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
I don't know how a monopoly couldn't "own" a particular service. The further a service provider is separated from their customers (i.e any government service), the less accountability that service provider has to deliver a quality service (no pun intended). You have no company to compare the USPS to because they do not, nor have they ever existed.
whos that guy that brings me my bills??? who he work for???? what about that place I go to send a package from??? whats that called...what are you saying ?????? maybe I'm reading it wrong...who don't exist
 

ancap

Active Member
whos that guy that brings me my bills??? who he work for???? what about that place I go to send a package from??? whats that called...what are you saying ?????? maybe I'm reading it wrong...who don't exist
Maybe you're not familiar with our current postal system, and that's OK, but there really is no need for you to be defensive since I was just stating a fact.

The US Postal Service has a government enforced monopoly on first class mail. Other companies such as UPS and FedEx are allowed to compete for parcel services, which is why these companies dominate market share for commercial shipments.
 

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
Rob Roy you actually make a great point...Not sure what you could do ....but do you now use any services supplied by or help by the government ??? Do you really want to live in a world with no government ???
Yes.
No government to me does not mean
chaos. I want to live in a world where people are free to associate without being
extorted. This does not mean things do not get done. It means those who desire certain things do not force others to deliver them.

If you are truly open minded I can recommend this book. The Market For Liberty. It was written by a friend of friend, Morris Tannehill. It does a much better job than I can discussing why government is often the CAUSE of problems rather than the solution.

Being a voluntaryist, I'd be okay if YOU and others form alliances and call it government, just don't force me or other peaceful people to belong and we'll get along fine. Sadly, I can't say "government" reciprocates though.
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
Maybe you're not familiar with our current postal system, and that's OK, but there really is no need for you to be defensive since I was just stating a fact.

The US Postal Service has a government enforced monopoly on first class mail. Other companies such as UPS and FedEx are allowed to compete for parcel services, which is why these companies dominate market share for commercial shipments.
wasn't being defensive was just not understanding who you said didn't exist...If UPS had to deliver first class mail it would cost more the 44 cent for a letter...hmmm what about that wonderful junk mail who going to take that load..
 

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
:dunce:


Heating your home with incandescent bulbs is a waste of electricity and money. You'd have to be running more than 50 100+ watt incandescents in the same room before you even see a difference in temps, if any.
Not a single one of you radical left wingers has a fucking clue what Im talking about with the light bulbs do you? not one complete brain even if you put all your parts of a brain together. And Cloud, no matter how many posts you make claiming to be a conservative will make anyone actually believe you are anything other than a radical leftist.
 
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