complete darkness ????

[Dr Kynes]

BS!! The trichomes serve no purpose in reproduction...I mean c'mon think would ya? How could the pistil ever wrangle away the pollen granule from the super adhesive resin head? Have you looked at the pistil structures? They are fine web like hairs meant to snag and entrap the pollen granule and retrieve it into the waiting ovule. The resin glands are to deflect uv, repel trap insects and protection of the ovule and/or embryo from dehydration by shielding. Hey Doc read up on Botany ....

Cannabis Botany- Robert Clarke

"Biology of PollinationPollination is the event of pollen landing on a stig- matic surface such as the pistil, and fertilization isthe union of the staminate chromosomes from the pollen with the pistillate chromosomes from the ovule.Pollination begins with dehiscence (release of pollen) from staminate flowers. Millions of pollen grainsfloat through the air on light breezes, and many land on the stigmatic surfaces of nearby pistillate plants.If the pistil is ripe, the pollen grain will germinate and send out a long pollen tube much as a seed pushesout a root. The tube contains a haploid (in) generative nucleus and grows downward toward the ovule atthe base of the pistils. When the pollen tube reaches the ovule, the staminate haploid nucleus fuses withthe pistillate haploid nucleus and the diploid condition is restored. Germination of the pollen grainoccurs 15 to 20 minutes after contact with the stigmatic surface (pistil); fertilization may take up to twodays in cooler temperatures. Soon after fertilization, the pistils wither away as the ovule and surroundingcalyx begin to swell." No mention of trichome involvement whatsoever...
Furthermore
"Trichomes are plant hairs composed of one or more cells. Almost all gesneriads have leaves and flowers with trichomes. These hairs serve multiple purposes, including discouraging insect predators, reflecting sunlight, and insulating the plant body. The trichomes of the nettle (Urtica dioica), for instance, contain a substance which irritates the skin of a person who touches the leaf and breaks any trichomes.This cool picture, courtesy of Miriam Denham, shows the trichomes on Sinningia sulcata, magnified many times. The trichomes appear to be four (sometimes three) cells long. The purpose of these trichomes is probably insulation, but some species, such as S. amambayensis, have hairs with sticky wax-like substance(s) to deter insects."
http://www.burwur.net/sinns/3tricho.htm
However I am in complete agreement that preharvest flushing is useless and even detrimental to the final product. Its all about properly dried and cured as far as taste and aroma.

curiously, the function of resinous glands in the reproductive cycles of other major dioecious plants are ignored. like again god damned fucking PINES which produce fine windblown pollen, and sticky resinous structures which house the ova. the resinous coating on pine cones are well recognized to be there to TRAP POLLEN, as are the sticky resinous tips of the pistils on perfect flowers. there is no debate about the purpose of THOSE structures, but the purpose of "trichomes" found on many plants are still hotly debated, and in some cases even whether or not a structure IS a trichome can be in doubt.

example: the "trichomes on african violets and tomatoes, as previously mentioned are Proto-roots and will form actual roots when in contact with moist soils, which the stinging hairlike netttle and thistle trichomes will not.

the trichomes of figs cacti and other similar structures are merely bristles which have no particular venom and NONE of those structures produce sticky resin or are found in particular relation to sexual reproductive organs.

meanwhile, even the definition of Resin is up for debate among botanists, though chemists are confident in it's makeup.
some resins are actually saps, nutrient delivery systems, others are found only in relation to reproductive organs, and others are excreted as a response to injury, some are secreted on tendrils which serve no function save to trap and digest insects and small critters while still others are excreted EVERYWHERE on the plant making the whole organism sticky.

again i state categorically, the LACK OF SCHOLARLY WORK ON CANNABIS AND IT'S UNIQUE STRUCTURES IS A RESULT OF THE TABOO CAUSED BY THE BAN ON THE SPECIES!
but other similar species with similar structures are well discussed which is why i keep mentioning conifers, which are also dioecious, and wind pollinated just like cannabis. you might also wich to note that the female Hop flower the closest relative to cannabis, is also often described as coniferous, but not a pine. and within the broad scales of the hop flower cone ar sticky resinous structures. these resinous structures are there to trap fucking pollen.

as far as pistils not removing the pollen grains from the resin glands, the resin glands are NOT that sticky, certainly not as sticky as pine cones, or the tendrils of a sundew which stick like crazyglue. the pistils are designed to grab pollen wherever they find it, and some wind pollinated imperfect flowers barely bother with the sticky resin at all, liike bottle brushes which keep their sticky resin just on the tips of the pistils and noplace else. whilre others, like again, the pine and cedar exude huge amounts of sticky resin all over their female structures.

 

[Dr Kynes]

I know that when i go to create seeds i paste pollen on the pistils not trichomes. Ive also seen many trichomes on stems, stalks, and even broad leaves under magnification. Nit capitate-stalked trichomes but definitely capitate-sessile trichomes right on the leaf. I wouldnt doubt at all that a function of trichomes on cannabis is capturing pollen, but you stated that they transfer pollen right to the calyx and thats simply not true.

the resinous glands trap pollen. the WIND moves the long wavy pistils about which can bring the pisitils into contact with trapped pollen on the resin glands found in abundance around unfertilized calyxes, but which become sparse indeed around that same calyx when the fertilization is done.

you guys kee forgetting that once a calyx is fertilized resin production basically stops and the calyxes shrivel as the seed matures.

an unpollinated calyx produces more and more resin until it is... pollinated.

consider this well accepted and well understood fact.

 

[Dr Kynes]

The more tricomes the higher the chance it has to be pollinated by a bee landing on it or what ever. It will increase the chance of procreation.
Don't you think a bee would be more prone to check out the cannabis covered in tricomes compared to 1 with nothing at all. Dummy ass dummy

bees dont pollinate cannabis. the wind does.

bees have no particular attraction to cannabis. it's flowers produce no nectar, nor do they have showy blooms to trick bees into checking them out, nor do they produce a sweet aroma which would attract bees (despite the aroma's effect on stoners) nor do the flowers display the bright colours which also attract bees and other pollinators.

 

[Dr Kynes]

I do not seek to change his mind...that is his problem...lol

But in furtherance of thought here, if its purpose is as he states to capture pollen, then why does the plant grow trichomes from sprout and what function do the cannabinoids contribute to catching pollen? Utterly preposterous line of thought...wow

cannabinoids are Terpenes,.

Terpenes are the stuff that makes resin sticky.

the particular terpene used by cannabis has delightful properties when smoked, but the particular Terpenes used by pine trees do NOT.

in furtherance of your furtherance of thought, why does a plant stop producing cannabinoids and actually LOSE cannabinoids when the calyxes are pollinated?

if all your calyxes get pollinated, by the time your seeds are mature you have HEMP not dope. however that same cannabis plant NOT exposed to pollen gets more and more potent, creating more and more resin, until it starts dying.

i actually do want to change your mind, since this plant is important, and understanding how it functions in reality is important to producing good dope.

youre mistaken belief that resin glands serve no purpose in reproduction is absurd, and flies in the face of all experience. if your beliefs were true then resin production should INCREASE as seed production begins, to protect the seed and the plant's investment in that seed's future. cannabis resin is not protective, it is reproductive. it's production around unfertilized calyxes and it's disappearance around fertilized ones should make that plain to you.

 

[Figong]

cannabinoids are Terpenes,.

Terpenes are the stuff that makes resin sticky.

the particular terpene used by cannabis has delightful properties when smoked, but the particular Terpenes used by pine trees do NOT.

in furtherance of your furtherance of thought, why does a plant stop producing cannabinoids and actually LOSE cannabinoids when the calyxes are pollinated?

if all your calyxes get pollinated, by the time your seeds are mature you have HEMP not dope. however that same cannabis plant NOT exposed to pollen gets more and more potent, creating more and more resin, until it starts dying.

i actually do want to change your mind, since this plant is important, and understanding how it functions in reality is important to producing good dope.

youre mistaken belief that resin glands serve no purpose in reproduction is absurd, and flies in the face of all experience. if your beliefs were true then resin production should INCREASE as seed production begins, to protect the seed and the plant's investment in that seed's future. cannabis resin is not protective, it is reproductive. it's production around unfertilized calyxes and it's disappearance around fertilized ones should make that plain to you.

Time for a test.. going to put a pine sapling into the turbo pulverizer and put the gel/mesh of what's left into a cured banana leaf homemade cigar-style. This may very well not turn out so well.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Time for a test.. going to put a pine sapling into the turbo pulverizer and put the gel/mesh of what's left into a cured banana leaf homemade cigar-style. This may very well not turn out so well.

if you cook it down in a kettle over low heat and scrape out the scuzzy plant bits that float to the top it will make a fine rosin for your fiddle bow, but it wont get you high.

 

[TWS]

A good male plant, one you might pick for breeding purposes will have trichomes . Please don't go make me find a pic ! There is a lot of good information here but the answer to the posted question Which was "Trichomes pollinate the female flower" is simply not correct. Regardless if trichomes trapping pollen contribute or not. Do they aid in fertility, that seems to be the question here . And bees are every where. They may have landed on a male to drink some early morning dew and flew over to a female for any god given reason and pollinate. All though this is not the case for full pollination, don't count the bee out.

 

[TWS]

Oh and since you guys are getting so technical, if we go back to the original question on 72 hrs of darkness, I bet someone can come up on when starches ,chlorophyll,sugars and nutrients are stored in the root system in darkness and why doing this and chopping in the dark cyle produces better taste ? And I do believe a seeded plant continues to make trichomes for protection from the sun at least.

 

[Figong]

if you cook it down in a kettle over low heat and scrape out the scuzzy plant bits that float to the top it will make a fine rosin for your fiddle bow, but it wont get you high.

Oh, didn't plan for it to get my high - wanted to taste it and see what it smoked like.. harsh vs smooth, if curing the bark pre-grind made a difference, etc.. or if it'd be better to go pure sap concentrate for sealing antique woodwork projects with.. either way, I'd find a new method to use the material for, even if it's just new to me or didn't click initially.

 

[Dr Kynes]

A good male plant, one you might pick for breeding purposes will have trichomes . Please don't go make me find a pic ! There is a lot of good information here but the answer to the posted question Which was "Trichomes pollinate the female flower" is simply not correct. Regardless if trichomes trapping pollen contribute or not. Do they aid in fertility, that seems to be the question here . And bees are every where. They may have landed on a male to drink some early morning dew and flew over to a female for any god given reason and pollinate. All though this is not the case for full pollination, don't count the bee out.

resin glands do not directly fertilize the calyx. the pistils do that. nobody has argued that idea.

the presence of trichomes on male plants is irrelevant. the trichomes on any portion of the plant not in proximity to female flowers will be light on, or devoid of resin and cannabinoids. if it were otherwise, male plants would be grown for hash and keif.

cacti, like the prickly pear make spines all over. the greatest abundance of spines is found on the fertilized calyx (the fruit body) and the spines become MORE profuse as the fruit matures.

nettles and thistles make their greatest profusion of spines on the fertilized calyx, and the spines become MORE profuse as the seeds mature.

pines however STOP producing resin on the cones once the ova are fertilized, just as cannabis stops producing resin when it's calyxes are pollinated. it even reabsorbs the resin which was made at great expense by the plant as the seeds mature which simply demonstrates that the resin is reproductive, not protective.

curiously, roses blackberries and raspberries produce spines on the canes and foliage, but NOT on the calyxes, but that just goes to show, "Fuck Logic".

 

[althor]

What can be said for sure, it has been proven, THC is at it's peak in the dark cycle. Even if you do not believe in the in 24-48-72 hrs darkness, you should definitely believe it is best to cut in the dark cycle.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Oh, didn't plan for it to get my high - wanted to taste it and see what it smoked like.. harsh vs smooth, if curing the bark pre-grind made a difference, etc.. or if it'd be better to go pure sap concentrate for sealing antique woodwork projects with.. either way, I'd find a new method to use the material for, even if it's just new to me or didn't click initially.

seriously, dont do this. the terpenes from pine sap can be toxic when the smoke is inhaled.

the smoke can kill you.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Oh and since you guys are getting so technical, if we go back to the original question on 72 hrs of darkness, I bet someone can come up on when starches ,chlorophyll,sugars and nutrients are stored in the root system in darkness and why doing this and chopping in the dark cyle produces better taste ? And I do believe a seeded plant continues to make trichomes for protection from the sun at least.

taste is a subjective metric, not measurable quantifiable or consistent from one person to another.

the seeded plant may make trichomes but they do NOT produce resin after pollination has occurred. the two structures are not interchangeable. the argument that trichomes protect from the sun is dubious at best, if this were the purpose then the calyx would need MORE protection as the seed matures, not less. and the fertilized calyxes reduce their resin content and their overall trichome count as the seed matures. this is not in doubt.

 

[Figong]

What can be said for sure, it has been proven, THC is at it's peak in the dark cycle. Even if you do not believe in the in 24-48-72 hrs darkness, you should definitely believe it is best to cut in the dark cycle.

I have to disagree with that being the primary reason behind darkness that some introduce. I would introduce darkness for 5 days straight, but not to any supposed THC peak - would do it due to the extended period of total darkness deactivating the chlorophyll, which is only really doing anything / is active during photosynthesis. The result would be less green in the leaves that may in some small way influence the smoke if one were to not properly dry/cure, or affect it greatly in other ways if you're making kief, etc.

My .02

 

[Dr Kynes]

What can be said for sure, it has been proven, THC is at it's peak in the dark cycle. Even if you do not believe in the in 24-48-72 hrs darkness, you should definitely believe it is best to cut in the dark cycle.

most herbs are at their terpene peak shortly after sunrise till just before noon.

i have seen no evidence that cannabis follows a different schedule from basil, thyme, oregano, mint or hops. all these herbs ar most fragrant after sunrise but before noon.

 

[raven1290]

Here's some pictures I took from Jorge Cervantes Grow Bible. You can see trichomes on all the leaves as well as the stem. How would pollen stuck to the stem get to the reproductive parts of the plant? You also said that these only form on the flower, so here's proof thier everywhere.

 

[Figong]

seriously, dont do this. the terpenes from pine sap can be toxic when the smoke is inhaled.

the smoke can kill you.

I'd planned to do plenty of research as to the makeup of it before actually doing so - rest assured, I'm not Finshaggy-like in any respect... and will cancel that idea. Thanks for the heads-up chief.

 

[ProdigalSun]

It might help the plant use up the chlorophyll, which would result in a smoother smoke.

 

[Shivaskunk]

most herbs are at their terpene peak shortly after sunrise till just before noon.

i have seen no evidence that cannabis follows a different schedule from basil, thyme, oregano, mint or hops. all these herbs ar most fragrant after sunrise but before noon.

My plants definitely smell the strongest right around lights on. Maybe even a half of an hour before...as if they are anticipating the light and.gearing up.

 

[raven1290]

most herbs are at their terpene peak shortly after sunrise till just before noon.

i have seen no evidence that cannabis follows a different schedule from basil, thyme, oregano, mint or hops. all these herbs ar most fragrant after sunrise but before noon.

This one I'll agree with you on. It seems to me plants have an internal clock like us and know when it's time to wake up and go to bed. I've found it best to harvest around 1-4 hours after lights on.