12-1 lighting schedule, has anyone actually tried this?

Thanks rev, I was a little nervous, this is technically only my second grow and this happened to me last time, I get all stressed out when I start looking at the trich's trying to figure out when to chop, I'll see a random amber here or there and start thinking I went to far with them. I pulled all of them out last night and sat there with a chair and for awhile along with some pics from grow books etc.. and talked myself out of chopping them down, they are just about there but not quite, I think maybe today, if not definitely by the weekend I'm hoping, I calmed down a little with your advice as well as a few others. I'm using botanicare, not 100% organic but not a straight bottle of chem either.

The one thing that is worrying me a little is my clones, I took the top off the dome last night to air them out a little and a few have pistils, I thought maybe my timer got thrown off but it seems to be set right. I'll have to see how this round goes, I dont see why they shouldnt be alright once I get them potted up and feeding.

Anyhow heres a few pics I grabbed last night...

Chernobyl



the void (2 and 3 I think) they are all pretty well colored up nicely, 1 out of 4 isnt showing any coloring.

whitey78 said:

Thanks rev, I was a little nervous, this is technically only my second grow and this happened to me last time, I get all stressed out when I start looking at the trich's trying to figure out when to chop, I'll see a random amber here or there and start thinking I went to far with them. I pulled all of them out last night and sat there with a chair and for awhile along with some pics from grow books etc.. and talked myself out of chopping them down, they are just about there but not quite, I think maybe today, if not definitely by the weekend I'm hoping, I calmed down a little with your advice as well as a few others. I'm using botanicare, not 100% organic but not a straight bottle of chem either.

The one thing that is worrying me a little is my clones, I took the top off the dome last night to air them out a little and a few have pistils, I thought maybe my timer got thrown off but it seems to be set right. I'll have to see how this round goes, I dont see why they shouldnt be alright once I get them potted up and feeding.

Anyhow heres a few pics I grabbed last night...

Chernobyl

View attachment 1913635

the void (2 and 3 I think) they are all pretty well colored up nicely, 1 out of 4 isnt showing any coloring.

View attachment 1913634View attachment 1913633View attachment 1913632View attachment 1913631View attachment 1913630

Click to expand...

Those look nice W. How far along are you? I'm not using the decreasing flower hours since I have a week or 2 of over lap in beginning/ending flower. But I have always had to go a 4-10 days longer on most strains and it appears I will be finishing on time with just about everything, so I'm please with that.
As for flushing I grow organic and its never been a concern. MJ grow well will taste good.

whitey78 said:

Thanks rev, I was a little nervous, this is technically only my second grow and this happened to me last time, I get all stressed out when I start looking at the trich's trying to figure out when to chop, I'll see a random amber here or there and start thinking I went to far with them. I pulled all of them out last night and sat there with a chair and for awhile along with some pics from grow books etc.. and talked myself out of chopping them down, they are just about there but not quite, I think maybe today, if not definitely by the weekend I'm hoping, I calmed down a little with your advice as well as a few others. I'm using botanicare, not 100% organic but not a straight bottle of chem either.

The one thing that is worrying me a little is my clones, I took the top off the dome last night to air them out a little and a few have pistils, I thought maybe my timer got thrown off but it seems to be set right. I'll have to see how this round goes, I dont see why they shouldnt be alright once I get them potted up and feeding.

Anyhow heres a few pics I grabbed last night...

Chernobyl

View attachment 1913635

the void (2 and 3 I think) they are all pretty well colored up nicely, 1 out of 4 isnt showing any coloring.

View attachment 1913634View attachment 1913633View attachment 1913632View attachment 1913631View attachment 1913630

Click to expand...

Kudos for having a plant with green leaves close to harvest!

Thoughts:

1. You have a window of about 2-3 weeks for maximum THC production and quality with the last 2-3 being the most important,

2. When to harvest is more of an art. Harvest when the calyxes are plump (as if they contain seeds), about 80% of the pistils are brown... 20% of the rest fresh and white, and the production of new material such as pistils and calyxes comes to a halt.

3. IMO, the amber versus cloudy versus clear trichomes is shaky. No one is testing the cannabanoids at such stages. It's all cannabis forum conjecture IMO.

4. If' you start to get incomplete male flowers aka "bananas", it's time to harvest.

I agree with UB on this one. I've never bought into the trichome thing. The whole cloudy vs. amber, I dunno, always seemed made up psuedo science. I harvest when they look "ripe" just as UB described. The flowers stop growing, the color overall changes and I can tell that they are finished. There's maybe about 20-30% white pistils, the rest have usually changed colors, but the biggest indicator is swollen calyx's, hardness and density and of course they've stopped.

snew said:

Me for one my plants are great. Getting ready to harvest and please all the way around with the results of gardening 12-1. My plants are the size I wanted, the buds are dense and full of crystals. My harvest time is right on breeders schedule, I always needed to go and extra week, but not now.
I did this during the summer so I could run my light during the summer (hot room). It was just what I needed.

Click to expand...

Kudos for having a plant with green leaves close to harvest!

Uncle Ben said:

3. IMO, the amber versus cloudy versus clear trichomes is shaky. No one is testing the cannabanoids at such stages. It's all cannabis forum conjecture IMO.

Click to expand...

Yeah i've always just judged by my eyes... I have a scope and have even tried using it a few times, all that happens is that it gets sticky and i can't see anything through it.So i gave up with it... how people tell when trich's on a plant are 80% amber i'll never know. How do they count them all? they look at every trich? how does it work?

Just look at the plant... if your brain is uh'ming and ah'ing chances are you still have some to go. if you look at it and think, holy shit she's done! that's the time to chop.

For me the hairs start turning brown, the calyxes swell out and the pistils knot up.. that's all i know.

This one is enlightened forum post. Thanks a lot for sharing your valuable views through this board.

skunkushybrid01 said:

I'm not closed off... you are. it works both ways. However the only difference is i've listened to all of the arguments here and countered them. My arguments are countered with insults and even outright ignorance.



Your logic here is a little skewed. nowhere in the world will we also find a 12/1 light schedule from the sun. Use less nutes because there is less growth... maybe a little less lost through evaporation too, but the main losses will be to the growth of the plants.



I'll try anything if i can see the logic behind it. I've tried growing a plant in the dark whilst foliar feeding a mixture of water, sucrose, glucose and fructose. Very interesting experiment. Also grown very large plants, 6ft... in a 4 inch pot in coco... also done similar with hydro... shallow water growing... intense UV, a 300W tanning lamp set straight onto two seedlings. that was fun too. The critical feeding experiments where i overfed entire groups of plants just to test the results.

I'm all for experimenting if the experiment makes some type of logical sense before hand. I'm going to get into that .pdf shared from treating yourself magazine in a moment.

Also, i would never allow somebody to push their opinions onto me and i do not have that intention myself either. I'm all about sharing information, helping to educate others and myself that's it. The people responding in this thread are not the only people reading it... some of the people responding just shouldn't be at all.



You shouldn't have responded in this thread. you need to learn a lot more first and would have been far better off sitting back and learning.



different thread... a whole big thread too, a whole new debate. do a search.

Click to expand...

lol learn wat the same methods everyones been using for years.. dude ur a joke tryn to tell me i shudnt of responded and im better sittin back n listen

i have just started yet another using this same lighting method,
my girls are 12 days in to the 12,1 schedule and look lovely.

ive been using this schedule from day 1 and this is my 9th harvest.. from veg to flowering the 12-1 schedule works great and seem to start flowering my plants quicker.. at only 3wks into flowering and my buds are always huge and frosty but i use a 600w led panel with customized spectrum .. I am going compare results to my theory with a 20hr day and 8-12 light schedule, it seems odd but a 7day week with a 20hr day cycle presents 10days of light to the plants giving the illusion of a longer flowering cycle.. I think it will produce the same if not a larger harvest at least in my situation

Wow i can't belive some peoples ignorance.. Just read the post then comment. Im not botanist but i can see both sides of this argurment. UB deff has the science but we never have all the answers! There very well could be chlorophyll bleaching from over saturation in certain strains of MJ at much earlier times. This could be why the people that took the time to experiment (Thank You) could have achived faster and slieightly larger yeilds. Who is to say when over light saturation happens. This could also be simply due to the ventilation set-up and Co2 ppm. I'd like to see some more soild evidence surporrting the 12-5.5-1-5.5 method. IMO if there was over saturation earlier you would benift from a 16 or 18 hour day set up(need a 7 day timer tho). Like i said I'm not botanist!! The way people blindy throw info around its makes you wonder how many people would still belive the world is flat.

reverof said:

UB, can you find me scientific data that the MJ plant can use all 18 hours of light that many run in a 18/6 schedule? Can you then come up with scientific data that shows that 12 hours of continuous light is not enough for a MJ plant

Click to expand...

Was this actually answered. I havent tried the 12-1 schedule yet, but i am very interested in doing it on my next run. Ive read a few threads on it around the internet and from what i can see it cant be disproved, just the current understandings we have about mj growth dont support it...yet?

I respect uncle ben and agree with a lot of his advice on nutes etc, but i do have one question.
How new scientific ideas come about? Science is forever moving forward, constantly changing and improving, usually new ideas are shot down by the current thought paradigm, then eventually after experimentation etc it is proven correct or false.

The only way we will ever know if this lighting technique is better/worse than others is experimenting. Ideally side by side grows probably done in scientifically controlled enviornments. Im sure somewhere in human history humans thought that we could never grow plants inside without the sun and soil. Sure we thought the earth was flat at one stage and look what happened to the guy that proved it wasnt.

Is anyone in a position or has a link to a side by side grow 12-1 vs 18-6? It would be very interesting to see the results.

Thanks to the people that tested this out, i definitley think i'l give it a shot on my next run, no harm in trying.

im on my 3rd grow using this, it works flawlessly. i have nothing to prove and nothing to gain by lying.
i have completed 6 weeks veg, and am now in 6th week of flower.
my plants didnt stretch as much and showed sex at less than 1 week into flowering.
i suspect the flowering time is advanced by the fact that the 1 hour of lighting keeps flowering at bay by interupting the dark period, but the flowering hormone is active during late veg.
so by the time my flowering time is 6 weeks it is actually perhaps more than that as sexing has been done earlier.

Gastman said:

A number of very interesting points were made, but I tend to agree that genetics trump the "natural" environmental factors noted. After years of genetic cloning/hybrids, all presumably grown and evaluated under the classic 18/6 - 12/12 hour regime, the pot plant's genetics are no longer those of the "natural" outdoor plant. Just look at what we have done with dogs................

Click to expand...

If I had a dog it would look lie the one Obama ate.

Well here I am at page 13 and I am learning something here.

The veg cycle looks tight - I'm ready to risk my super duper 4' 95% reflective 6 lamp T-8 with 2X OverDriven Ballasts and 22,000 + lumens on the venture.
That's right - I said T-8 - and I said 22,000 lumens from 6 bulbs.
This Link has a real good explanation and example of the concept.
My veg lamp uses less electricty than when I bought it because of the 2X Overdriven configuration.

I'm still on the fence with the bloom cycle switch - but have already been playing around with intermittent 'side' lighting around my HID.
I've was switching 600 watts of CFL's that surround my 1000 W HID in 26 small twisty bulbs.
Switching it one hour and then off 6 times a day while the HID stayed on.

It seemed to be working well and I was saving electricity and the heat was reduced...
but my timers could not handle the cycling even though they are rated for 15 amps of CFL's and have 7 time cycles a day to program.
They kept 'sticking' on or off at random. I busted one open to see what happened, and the relay was fine.
So I surmise that the relay driver transistor is not sufficient to handle the load at that short of a cycle.
So at present I am building a contactor setup to drive the coil from the timer and see if this works.

I'm all in to saving energy and growing dank buds; so I'm willing to try this 12-5.5-1-5.5 veg cycle.
My bloom room is perpetual grow; so I doubt I can mess with the 12-12 in there.
One contactor is all set I can at least try the light reduction technics some mentioned.

Thanks for this thread op - plus rep

Uncle Ben said:

The point not being discussed around here is the amount of photons required during the daylight period to produce the best vigor, health, bulk, and finally production. I believe I have mastered that. It's all about The Balance, The Balance being your ability as a gardener to balance temps, light, water and other cultural factors. You want the color of your leaves to just approach being lime green but still have a green richness to them. The more foliage bulk you have, the more root system bulk (the plant's foundation) and the better the production.

The gimmicks of a 12/1 DO NOT address anything other than a whim, certainly not botany. If you want to embrace an idealogy, fine, but be honest and say so. Electricity consumption should not be an issue. If it is, you're in the wrong biz.

If your plants are green and healthy looking, then you've done good. If they're straggly and yellow, something's wrong.

UB

Click to expand...

I think you hit a nerve or something here, and it's all starting to make perfect sense to me now.

If a grower doesn't have the best cooling setup, like say a chiller, etc. then:
Reducing the heat produced in the current garden may be the reason these light routines work for many people.

Put that aside completely: I want to address the power usage issue.
Some of us just really want to use less power to conserve.
It's not that we can't afford the bill; it's that we choose to use less if possible.

I guess it is kinda dumb to grow weed for profit unless you have a sterile cave a couple hundred feet into the earth and all the good stuff to make it work.

We can't all be big-time like you man.
If I get similar yields just using this timing in veg I will be estatic; if I get a little less I can accept that too.
Really.

Plus rep for you just because

azman said:

im on my 3rd grow using this, it works flawlessly. i have nothing to prove and nothing to gain by lying.
i have completed 6 weeks veg, and am now in 6th week of flower.
my plants didnt stretch as much and showed sex at less than 1 week into flowering.
i suspect the flowering time is advanced by the fact that the 1 hour of lighting keeps flowering at bay by interupting the dark period, but the flowering hormone is active during late veg.
so by the time my flowering time is 6 weeks it is actually perhaps more than that as sexing has been done earlier.

Click to expand...

Great to know it works for you.
I'm going to flip my veg soon as I can and try it out.

i have been using this for 3-4 months now in two veg rooms and and veg to flower room . . . . buds came on about a week earlier in the flowering room and the other veg rooms growth is the same as normal and im getting better branching without much topping, which i will only have to do twice two get a nice 6-8 top canopy, also i ran from seed and was able to sex males and females after about a 2 weeks into first transplant . . . . . .. .

and im not switching back over 60 bucks a moths in saving on electricity and having a more finely tuned system mean i can share accessories and intakes and exhaust. runing 2 or 1 room at a time on opposite light cycles and A/C use is down too

more monsanto advice from farmer BEN lmao . . . . . tell us the story about how you invented topping early to create a even 4 top canopy or how all other nutrient lines that are not dyna grow(how much stock you got in dyna grow again) are snake oils. . .. . . including kelp products . . .lmfao . ..kelps only been used in growing since idk sliced bread???

and there is no idealogy. . .. . . .what works works . . . . .nothing much more to be siad about it . .. . . some things work better then others. . . .

"The gimmicks of a 12/1 DO NOT address anything other than a whim, certainly not botany."

what are these gimmicks . . . there are no gimmicks what a spin . . . there is this way and that way . .. . . . multiple ways to end up at the same end point . . . . no one growing technique is superioir to another . . . . .gimicks . . . lmfao . . . .your assumption that what you do is the best because it works well for you is the gimmick . . . . .

what ever technique or enviroment you choose or even gentics and design . . .you have to make everyhting work together efficiently . . . .and techique can be refined to perfection . . . .. . pick one and do it .. . . .dont jump on the next fad becuase someone says its the coolest!!!


i changed becuase i was expanding and didnt want to foot a bigger power bill. save money and produce more if not the same .. . . . . . i have much bigger bud developemnt on this run vs last run . . .but thats not neccisarilly becuase of the one change . . . .. . .. but if changing to 12-1 didnt hurt me and is saving me money and expanding my possible space . . . then thats all positives


what are the propossed negatives of 12-1??

12-1 from 3rd week in veg: stadium, COCO with amended canna line on the upper row and some RO707 with amended bio bizz line on ground level. 5" exhaust 4" filtered intake, 4k vertical:with two bulbs suspended on high and two bulbs suspend lower, in a 6.5' X 8.8' x 7' strains are all 9-10 weekers except a few and pic was taken at 20 days



go ahead tell me it doesnt work and doesnt have anything to do with botany, lmfao a photoperiod described with a 12 on, 5 off, 1 on, 6 off light cycles isnt about botony

Im in the middle of using 12-1, well I mean I used it for veg on this run and I am using the gas light routine for flower aswell (start at 12-12 for 1st 2 weeks flower, then drop 30mins of light each week, down to about 11on 13off at the moment). It works great, I dont think its any better than 18-6 BUT it seems to be the same, so you are getting the same result with less light, that seems a good enough reason to use it for me anyway.

karmeron said:

Im in the middle of using 12-1, well I mean I used it for veg on this run and I am using the gas light routine for flower aswell (start at 12-12 for 1st 2 weeks flower, then drop 30mins of light each week, down to about 11on 13off at the moment). It works great, I dont think its any better than 18-6 BUT it seems to be the same, so you are getting the same result with less light, that seems a good enough reason to use it for me anyway.

Click to expand...

nice , i have never fluctuated the cycles like that, and ya i guess the real question is what are the limitations to growing on a odd photoperoid that is consistent with vegging , Calvin cycle times and flowering Calvin cycles times

Samwell Seed Well said:

nice , i have never fluctuated the cycles like that, and ya i guess the real question is what are the limitations to growing on a odd photoperoid that is consistent with vegging , Calvin cycle times and flowering Calvin cycles times

Click to expand...

Yeh I've only ever done 18-6 veg and 12-12 flower and I was expecting some negatives from changing to 12-1, but there was no extra stretch and by the looks of it, no diminished yeild, I didnt see any of those problems. Also you get a nice temperature drop too as the lights are off more. Also for some reason I am able to run my ppm's a bit higher, maybe they are eating more during the lights off phase. I cant wait to get a final yeild though as that really will be the determining factor, but it looks the same, if not better than my last runs.