America, the only country to use nuclear weapons. Did they save lives?

nontheist

nontheist

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
Bigoted like you?
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Yes I am bigoted towards your crazy ass ideology but I was referencing more of a racial aspect. Even though the Japanese got their ass handed to them they still have the seed of superiority planted. Kinda puts a cramp in your group orgy plans huh abandoned?
 
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
nontheist said:
Yes I am bigoted towards your crazy ass ideology but I was referencing more of a racial aspect. Even though the Japanese got their ass handed to them they still have the seed of superiority planted. Kinda puts a cramp in your group orgy plans huh abandoned?
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No, you just don't understand how to take a bath. I mean Bath house etiquette.
 
olylifter420

olylifter420

Well-Known Member
True, most asian friends that invited me or my gf over when we were kids were extremely racist and had hustlers all over like reading books



nontheist said:
How do you feel about Germans? Japanese are typically bigoted/racist towards all nonnatives it's a poor example.
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OGEvilgenius

OGEvilgenius

Well-Known Member
fb360 said:
No we didn't... You should educate yourself before arguing fallacy.

We fought many battles with the Japanese, resulting in many American deaths, before we nuked them.

edit: @bold
Are you fucking kidding? You mean WAR? They decided to kamikaze some of our ships in Pearl Harbor, we declared war and proceeded as so. Americans died fighting for their opportunity to surrender. We gave them time and their opportunity, they chose to say no. Moreover, if they hadn't finally came to get a grasp on reality after the nukes, we would have killed all of them.
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Such notable American's as Eisenhower completely disagree with the notion it had to be dropped. I agree with him.
 
OGEvilgenius

OGEvilgenius

Well-Known Member
Mindmelted said:
Damn! How did we miss that bastard.
Japans fault that thier government did not think of them first instead fo some silly emperor.
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You dehumanize, but the reality is, that person is you. Your government cared as much about that person as they do about you.
 
fb360

fb360

Active Member
OGEvilgenius said:
Such notable American's as Eisenhower completely disagree with the notion it had to be dropped. I agree with him.
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First of all, I have not argued that it HAD to be dropped.
Second of all, that isn't even the debate of this thread. The argument is whether dropping the bombs saved lives.

Lastly, the Japanese had their chance to surrender. We were at war with the Japanese. Unlike you and some others, I treat war, like war. If they didn't want to get nuked, they could have surrendered.

War is war, you can't make it pretty. Furthermore, if you are going to wage war at your homeland in the midst of your civilians, then you are responsible for their deaths, not the enemy who is following war orders. Flying planes into our ships, and then running back to the home island to hide amongst the civilians was not only extremely cowardly, it led to their race being nuked.

I don't blame America one bit. Just because our weapons are better, doesn't mean our war intentions are any worse
 
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
fb360 said:
First of all, I have not argued that it HAD to be dropped.
Second of all, that isn't even the debate of this thread. The argument is whether dropping the bombs saved lives.

Lastly, the Japanese had their chance to surrender. We were at war with the Japanese. Unlike you and some others, I treat war, like war. If they didn't want to get nuked, they could have surrendered. They were begging to surrender.

War is war, you can't make it pretty. Furthermore, if you are going to wage war at your homeland in the midst of your civilians, then you are responsible for their deaths, not the enemy who is following war orders. Flying planes into our ships, and then running back to the home island to hide amongst the civilians was not only extremely cowardly, it led to their race being nuked.

I don't blame America one bit. Just because our weapons are better, doesn't mean our war intentions are any worse
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"I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.” ~Smedley D. Butler.
 
fb360

fb360

Active Member
abandonconflict said:
"I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.” ~Smedley D. Butler.
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What does one opinion have to do with our debate?

You do realize that Americans were dieing over near and in Japan correct? Both of my grandparents flew fighter planes in WW2, so I not only have my knowledge through research, I have first hand opinions as well.

So you think we should have continued to fight and die to allow them the ability to surrender under their conditions, so that we wouldn't have hurt their civilians they were hiding in, even after having brought war to our homeland? So you're okay with Japanese kamikaze pilots flying airplanes into our ships, unknowing if they would kill civilians, but you're not okay with us defending ourselves?

You don't understand war do you? (rhetoric)
 
Mindmelted

Mindmelted

Well-Known Member
fb360 said:
What does one opinion have to do with our debate?

You do realize that Americans were dieing over near and in Japan correct? Both of my grandparents flew fighter planes in WW2, so I not only have my knowledge through research, I have first hand opinions as well.

So you think we should have continued to fight and die to allow them the ability to surrender under their conditions, so that we wouldn't have hurt their civilians they were hiding in, even after having brought war to our homeland? So you're okay with Japanese kamikaze pilots flying airplanes into our ships, unknowing if they would kill civilians, but you're not okay with us defending ourselves?

You don't understand war do you? (rhetoric)
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No! He is a american hater and needs to be treated as such.
 
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
fb360 said:
What does one opinion have to do with our debate?

You do realize that Americans were dieing over near and in Japan correct? Both of my grandparents flew fighter planes in WW2, so I not only have my knowledge through research, I have first hand opinions as well.

So you think we should have continued to fight and die to allow them the ability to surrender under their conditions, so that we wouldn't have hurt their civilians they were hiding in, even after having brought war to our homeland? So you're okay with Japanese kamikaze pilots flying airplanes into our ships, unknowing if they would kill civilians, but you're not okay with us defending ourselves?

You don't understand war do you? (rhetoric)
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Let me get this straight, you think you understand war, because your grandparents flew planes in WW2 and you conclude with asking me if I don't understand war, then in parentheses, rhetoric. So do you think I don't understand war rhetoric? Or do I not understand the debate? Or do I not understand war?

The Japanese were begging to surrender. What part of that do you not understand? Truman had a policy of unconditional surrender. When that bomb was dropped, the Japanese were losing the worst massacre they had of the entire war at the hands of the Soviet red army.

The nuclear bombs killed tens of thousands of civilians and not even a thousand military personnel.

To respond to your assertion that I don't understand war, I am a veteran of the airborne infantry, Afghanistan in 2002 and Iraq in 2003. My gramps flew in WW2 also.
 
Mindmelted

Mindmelted

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
let me get this straight, you think you understand war, because your grandparents flew planes in ww2 and you conclude with asking me if i don't understand war, then in parentheses, rhetoric. So do you think i don't understand war rhetoric? Or do i not understand the debate? Or do i not understand war?

The japanese were begging to surrender. What part of that do you not understand? Truman had a policy of unconditional surrender. When that bomb was dropped, the japanese were losing the worst massacre they had of the entire war at the hands of the soviet red army.

The nuclear bombs killed tens of thousands of civilians and not even a thousand military personnel.

To respond to your assertion that i don't understand war, i am a veteran of the airborne infantry, afghanistan in 2002 and iraq in 2003. My gramps flew in ww2 also.
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You dont surrender under your own terms retard.
What fucking part of that dont you understand.
 
fb360

fb360

Active Member
abandonconflict said:
Let me get this straight, you think you understand war, because your grandparents flew planes in WW2 and you conclude with asking me if I don't understand war, then in parentheses, rhetoric. So do you think I don't understand war rhetoric? Or do I not understand the debate? Or do I not understand war?

The Japanese were begging to surrender. What part of that do you not understand? Truman had a policy of unconditional surrender. When that bomb was dropped, the Japanese were losing the worst massacre they had of the entire war at the hands of the Soviet red army.

The nuclear bombs killed tens of thousands of civilians and not even a thousand military personnel.

To respond to your assertion that I don't understand war, I am a veteran of the airborne infantry, Afghanistan in 2002 and Iraq in 2003. My gramps flew in WW2 also.
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Then you of all people should know that war means war. If you are coward enough to run suicidal pilots into ships, then don't you think given the opportunity, or better yet, if the Japanese were in our position, do you actually think they would have acted differently in terms of allowing unconditional surrender? Do you think they wouldn't have dropped bombs killing thousands of innocent civilians?

To respond to the beginning of your post, I asked you a question by using a question mark, but told you not to answer it because it is rhetorical. I don't understand how you think while American soldiers were dieing fighting their way in and onto Japanese islands, other Americans were giving the Japanese any benefit of the doubt. No American at that time felt any sympathy. My grandpa still to this day is racist against the Japanese, even in public. I asked him why so and he responded by saying that once he watched his friends die at the hands of a truly evil and cowardly enemy, he hasn't changed his opinion of them.
 
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
fb360 said:
Then you of all people should know that war means war. If you are coward enough to run suicidal pilots into ships, then don't you think given the opportunity, or better yet, if the Japanese were in our position, do you actually think they would have acted differently in terms of allowing unconditional surrender? Do you think they wouldn't have dropped bombs killing thousands of innocent civilians?

To respond to the beginning of your post, I asked you a question by using a question mark, but told you not to answer it because it is rhetorical. I don't understand how you think while American soldiers were dieing fighting their way in and onto Japanese islands, other Americans were giving the Japanese any benefit of the doubt. No American at that time felt any sympathy. My grandpa still to this day is racist against the Japanese, even in public. I asked him why so and he responded by saying that once he watched his friends die at the hands of a truly evil and cowardly enemy, he hasn't changed his opinion of them.
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Deciphering...

"they were genocidal maniacs, so it is justified that we committed acts of genocide upon them and it is justified to act with prejudice, generations later and call ourselves anything but genocidal maniacs."
 
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