And the Majority of America takes a SIGH of relief!

This election meant one thing - we don't want your healthcare bill!

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Nah it means that the people in Mass (that already have a government program better than this one) don't want the healthcare bill.

hanimmal said:

Good for you guys.

But question, what has been passed that makes washington so out of control?

Besides maybe the stimulus package that consisted mostly of tax cuts to the majority of americans?

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About half of all Americans do not pay income taxes.

They received a "tax cut," too; and we all know they did through the Earned Income Tax Credit because the tax cuts bypassed high income earners.

Well, you get the idea.

The Porkulus failed. The only thing stimulated was government.

Indeed one healthcare program is constitutional one is not.
The federal government has no authority to impose on the people this abomination.
While the states do have that authority.
Which is good, why foist crap on red states something they hate.
Several States are going to end up sueing if the senate bill passes.
Let the states experiment with these schemes.
However, nobody is saying how much of a constitutionalist this Brown Character is.
Honestly he does not sound like one to me.

hanimmal said:

Nah it means that the people in Mass (that already have a government program better than this one) don't want the healthcare bill.

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I see. But they just didn't know that three weeks ago when Brown was behind by 20 points?

Were you able to vote for him illegal?

Because it was not all the republicans of the country that voted for him, it was the people of Mass.

meh, either way congrats to everyone that is stoked about this today!

Not trying to piss in your cherrioes.

And Jonny I looked this up for you, mainly because I am stalling doing my homework:

Approximately 47 percent of households, or 71 million people, owe no federal income tax, according to new research by the non-partisan Tax Policy Center.


A number of working Americans even gets money from the government — despite not paying a penny in taxes — because they qualify for income-tax breaks.


The number of non-taxpaying Americans continues to grow. The policy center's first 2009 estimate was 38 percent. That was before passage earlier this year of the $787 billion economic “stimulus,” which included a bevy of expanded tax breaks.
Most households making up to $30,000 pay no federal taxes, and nearly half of all households making between $30,000 and $40,000 pay no taxes either.


The pool of people who don’t pay any federal tax is not just the working poor, though. Close to 22 percent of those making between $50,000 and $75,000 end up with no federal income tax liability or negative liability.


Even 9 percent of households with incomes between $75,000 and $100,000 don’t pay a dime to the IRS.

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But fyi, the Obama cuts was off of paychecks, this is why it was better than the 'stimulus' $500 check we got a few years ago. This way you have to be paying taxes in order to get a tax break. So if you are in the 25% or lower your taxes paid was less under Obama than it was under Bush.

The Porkulus failed. The only thing stimulated was government.

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I respectively disagree.

There has been a lot of people that have benefitted from this, they kept their jobs, and businesses, which meant they were able to stay in their homes, and feed their children. These are hardworking americans that got this money, not some multi billion dollar oil company or hedge manager.

Look at where the market and jobless tragectory was before the bill passed, and look at where it is now.

Then maybe after that someone could give me an example of two about radical leftist agenda that is supposedly being pushed by this super majority that is not the stimulus? Name some bills people please! I really wish to know what you are talking about.

hanimmal said:

Were you able to vote for him illegal?

Because it was not all the republicans of the country that voted for him, it was the people of Mass.

meh, either way congrats to everyone that is stoked about this today!

Not trying to piss in your cherrioes.

And Jonny I looked this up for you, mainly because I am stalling doing my homework:

But fyi, the Obama cuts was off of paychecks, this is why it was better than the 'stimulus' $500 check we got a few years ago. This way you have to be paying taxes in order to get a tax break. So if you are in the 25% or lower your taxes paid was less under Obama than it was under Bush.

I respectively disagree.

There has been a lot of people that have benefitted from this, they kept their jobs, and businesses, which meant they were able to stay in their homes, and feed their children. These are hardworking americans that got this money, not some multi billion dollar oil company or hedge manager.

Look at where the market and jobless tragectory was before the bill passed, and look at where it is now.

Then maybe after that someone could give me an example of two about radical leftist agenda that is supposedly being pushed by this super majority that is not the stimulus? Name some bills people please! I really wish to know what you are talking about.

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Credits were also included in the tax cuts.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2009-02-21-obama-saturday_N.htm

Look at the unemployment rate pre-stimulus and post-stimulus.

Wall Street seems to be faring well.

I know, I know. It's Bush's fault.

Cap and Trade was passed in the House while everyone was paying attention to Michael Jackson's dead ass. It won't pass the Senate, but Pelosi pushed it through.

Health Care was passed on a Saturday night in the House in spite of the drubbing Democrats received in Virginia and New Jersey. Like Cap and Trade, it won't pass the Senate unless the Democrats can pull a rabbit out of a hat.

Government Motors? Please.

The Crotch Bomber was a clear indictment of the Obama Administration's approach to national security. And Janet Napolitano still has a job.

Cap and Trade was passed in the House while everyone was paying attention to Michael Jackson's dead ass. It won't pass the Senate, but Pelosi pushed it through.

Health Care was passed on a Saturday night in the House in spite of the drubbing Democrats received in Virginia and New Jersey. Like Cap and Trade, it won't pass the Senate unless the Democrats can pull a rabbit out of a hat.

Government Motors? Please.

The Crotch Bomber was a clear indictment of the Obama Administration's approach to national security. And Janet Napolitano still has a job.

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See in one year, nothing has passed that is some socialist agenda that is going to turn the US into soviet russia. Super Majority scared you all but really it is no different.

Thank god, because I wouldn't trade rocky for drago any day of the week.


And fyi unemployment is always the last thing to reverse
It continues to climb after the recession ends for a little while before
it starts to come back down. Demand needs to kick in, and all the back stock
has to get sold off before businesses will be forced to rehire to meet the demand:

How will it kick in when businesses experience uncertainty that comes along with existing Democratic initiatives?

Small business owners are running scared because they just don't know what's in store.

But they do know that Obama, by his own admission, considers the private sector 'enemy territory.'

They are keeping their heads down and their powder dry. I am, too.

Only the companies that are so full of fear because they are listening to the rantings of the talking heads on tv that are selling panic.

Cap and trade? Does not affect most companies in america, because it is to 'cap' current pollution levels and reduce over time.

Guess what that will happen naturally (like it already has) because we learn to do things better and cleaner.

Healthcare bill, most companies already take care of that for their patients, and their costs have been shooting up over the last few decades, so that is nothing new.

And putting 80billion out there for small business loans, lowering taxes for their employees, and the fact the system did not melt down should help them don't you think?

And I don't care how panicked you are, if you have customers in your store buying what you have, and you need to restock, your going to restock regardless of how afraid Glenn Beck has made you, and by buying stock, the manufactuers can restock which means they have to re-hire and that spirals throughout the economy.

The thought that you will not try to make ten dollars because you may lose one in the future is retarded.

Obama is currently engaged in the additional deprivation of economic freedom.
This can be in no way helpful in accelerating any economic recovery.
Stunning incompetence underway.




The U.S. Isn't as Free as It Used to Be

Canada now boasts North America's freest economy.

By TERRY MILLER The United States is losing ground to its major competitors in the global marketplace, according to the 2010 Index of Economic Freedom released today by the Heritage Foundation and The Wall Street Journal. This year, of the world's 20 largest economies, the U.S. suffered the largest drop in overall economic freedom
..............

The U.S. lost ground on many fronts. Scores declined in seven of the 10 categories of economic freedom. Losses were particularly significant in the areas of financial and monetary freedom and property rights. Driving it all were the federal government's interventionist responses to the financial and economic crises of the last two years, which have included politically influenced regulatory changes, protectionist trade restrictions, massive stimulus spending and bailouts of financial and automotive firms deemed "too big to fail." These policies have resulted in job losses, discouraged entrepreneurship, and saddled America with unprecedented government deficits.

Full sad article here:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704541004575011684172064228.html?mod=WSJ_article_MoreIn

Johnnyorganic said:

How will it kick in when businesses experience uncertainty that comes along with existing Democratic initiatives?

Small business owners are running scared because they just don't know what's in store.

But they do know that Obama, by his own admission, considers the private sector 'enemy territory.'

They are keeping their heads down and their powder dry. I am, too.

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Wow, you must not have a lot faith in our entrepreneurial spirit if you think business owners small or large are "running scared" because we have a new administration...

Things are actually looking better on a lot of fronts. The only thing in the way of doing business at the moment is the credit slump.

abe23 said:

Wow, you must not have a lot faith in our entrepreneurial spirit if you think business owners small or large are "running scared" because we have a new administration...

Things are actually looking better on a lot of fronts. The only thing in the way of doing business at the moment is the credit slump.

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Oh Please! I'm a small business owner and I know many other small business owners. We've been running scared for over a year at Obama. There is no question that Obama's election itself seriously damaged the economy. Every business owner I know had contingency plans if he got elected, and when he did they began circling the wagons and scaling back in every way.

So your saying that when you get more customers wanting your product, you won't sell it to them because you are afraid?

And if the demand for your product is more than you can produce because of shortage of employees, you would not hire?

If that is the case because you are paralyzed with fear, I would love to own your competition.

ilkhan said:

Well we bought a 50% chance of killing ObamaCare.
Yet added another warhawk, Christian conservative to the mix.
To me this is a mixed bag.
IMO the best thing that could possably happen now is gridlock.

Ok Dark, Obama had super majority in the senate and substantial power in the house.
If the left is so MJ friendly why didn't they pass legislation washing their hands of the whole affair?
They could have drafted legislation giving states the enforcement power over MJ it would have been a five page bill.
They could have sold it easily amoungst fiscal conservatives, social liberals and states rights advicates no problem.
Instead Obama lauphed it off like a million people were signing a petition as a damn joke?
My guess is they use their "Social Liberal" stance as a political tool.
Just like the republicans use abortion and gun rights.
They have NO intention of ever doing anything about it.
If they did they would lose hold on large chunks of their voting block.
IMO the feds should have no authority over MJ, abortion or gun control anyway.

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Well, his attorney general did say he wasn't going to enforce federal MJ laws in medical MJ states. That is a boatload more than Dubya did.
I'm of the same opinion about party affiliation though, they're both fucked. It just seems like the Dems have a better human rights attitude, Point of fact, Katrina, and the Bush response. I'll guarantee you if that would have happened under Obamas watch, the results would have been much different. I'm as pissed at Obama for the things he didn't do as you are for the things he tried to do. It is a no win for Obama. I wonder what fool the repukes will run against him, could be Brown, Eh?

It could be Brown. He will have spent more time in the Senate by 2012 than Obama had spent before the 08 election. And, Brown has a lot more experience overall. I don't think he should. Just because he is more experienced than Obama doesn't mean he is experienced enough. Frankly, I'm putting early money on Pawlenty.

Illegal Smile said:

It could be Brown. He will have spent more time in the Senate by 2012 than Obama had spent before the 08 election. And, Brown has a lot more experience overall. I don't think he should. Just because he is more experienced than Obama doesn't mean he is experienced enough. Frankly, I'm putting early money on Pawlenty.

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Pawlenty, are you serious? He has more gaffs than Joe Biden. Brown would be a much better choice, but I think the geniuses in the teabaggers are going to want someone right of Hitler, like Rush, or Palin, good luck with that scenario. Maybe it could work though, after all, those same idiots elected Dubya for a second term. All this wont affect me much, I'm not in the job market, thank God, I've got all of my "stuff" paid for, have lots of guns and ammo, and live at the end of a cul-de-sac, good for defending my position. Let the good times roll.

Johnnyorganic said:

Apples and oranges. There is a vast difference between the two health care proposals. One is Constitutional and one is not.

.

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How are they different? I could be wrong but i thought in Mass it's state mandated, there isnt a choice. Get insured or pay a fine.

If im wrong please correct me.

How are they different? I could be wrong but i thought in Mass it's state mandated, there isnt a choice. Get insured or pay a fine.

If im wrong please correct me.

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Dude, there is no point, although Jonny and I disagree (I don't feel that back when we used to shit outdoors was the best time to have all the laws of the land forever put in place, and we don't have better insight now), I am sure he will have about 15 constitutional reasons why if you revoke this unconstitutional amendment, this is different somehow.

I mean some of the shit they pull out of the 1700's is amazing! And just wait for Vi to pull out some old school constitutional jargon, it gets fun!

It is better just to stick to provable facts and logic here, and keep double checking what your saying, because they will try to confuse you with links, quotes, and 'news' that is taking everything out of context and wrong if you don't double check it.

So don't ask unless you are going to bust your ass looking it all up and dissecting what is wrong with it. Just my 2 cents.

ink the world said:

How are they different? I could be wrong but i thought in Mass it's state mandated, there isnt a choice. Get insured or pay a fine.

If im wrong please correct me.

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Federally mandated health care is Unconstitutional.

State mandated health care is within the jurisdiction of each individual state. It is Constitutional.

See the 10th Amendment. If it is not specifically delegated to the Federal government by the Constitution, it is state business.

I'm not here to say state sponsored insurance is necessarily a bad thing. When and if my state brings it up I'll look it over.

But it is not any business of the Federal government. Period.

hanimmal said:

Dude, there is no point, although Jonny and I disagree (I don't feel that back when we used to shit outdoors was the best time to have all the laws of the land forever put in place, and we don't have better insight now), I am sure he will have about 15 constitutional reasons why if you revoke this unconstitutional amendment, this is different somehow.

I mean some of the shit they pull out of the 1700's is amazing! And just wait for Vi to pull out some old school constitutional jargon, it gets fun!

It is better just to stick to provable facts and logic here, and keep double checking what your saying, because they will try to confuse you with links, quotes, and 'news' that is taking everything out of context and wrong if you don't double check it.

So don't ask unless you are going to bust your ass looking it all up and dissecting what is wrong with it. Just my 2 cents.

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People still shit outdoors, Han.

And when the Constitution was ratified they shat indoors as well. Surely you've heard of a chamberpot.

Hey, Newton's Three Laws of Motion were written when people shat outdoors. They must be irrelevant to modern physics.

You see where I'm going with this?