Coco Growers Unite!

vdubb808

Active Member
The store I usually go to has Botanicare, Bcuzz, BioBizz, Root Organics and a few other brands. To much to remember. I Botanicare & Bcuzz have some stuff for coco growing. But I kinda want to use the Canna stuff, so I might just order it online.

The coco medium I'm using is by Sunleaves, Coco Coir Classic Brick. I not sure how good their coco is, but it 's what I got.
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
Never used that brand of coco but is it a actual compressed brick that expands? or a bail of loose coco? The bricks have to be rinsed and rinsed and then buffered to avoid a number of problems. Sometimes the loose stuff needs to be rinsed and buffered as well even if they claim they have already done that for you, i would still check the EC of any brand of coco (besides canna) before using it if at all possible.
 

ZEN MASTER

Well-Known Member
The store I usually go to has Botanicare, Bcuzz, BioBizz, Root Organics and a few other brands. To much to remember. I Botanicare & Bcuzz have some stuff for coco growing. But I kinda want to use the Canna stuff, so I might just order it online.

The coco medium I'm using is by Sunleaves, Coco Coir Classic Brick. I not sure how good their coco is, but it 's what I got.

research it man. what strain you plan on growing? you might want to try with some bagseed on your first venture or two.
 

vdubb808

Active Member
The coco is compressed.

The seeds I have were given to me by a friend, who got it from his friend on a recent trip to Maui. My friend said that it's a diesel X. He did give me about 20 of them. The first 5 germed I got 4 out of 5 seedlings.

Today I got my nutes. I got CNS17 Grow & Bloom for coco & soil. I did want to go with the Canna coco stuff, but since it's not readily available that will have to wait for another grow.
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
Have u already planted them in a bigger final size container?

If not, I would highly suggest soaking the coco in pure clean water for a minimum of a couple hours or overnight and then drain and rinse it several times unless the manufacturer is extremely confident that they have done this for you, but i highly doubt it... I'm not aware of any compressed coco coir bricks that are actually ready to use.

After rinsing it you want to try to buffer it with some cal/mag plus or magical ect... Its hard to say how much to use but if it were me i would probably divide the coco up and try a few different cal/mag doses to see what works best since you may be using it again in the future it will be nice to know for next round.... I would try a really low dose on some like 60 ppm's and go up as high as 200 ppm's and maybe something between the hi/low dose.
 

Apache

Well-Known Member
I will tell you what. This is my first Coco Grow and I am using Canna Coco to the T. Its as easy as it gets. I have everything set up on a low budge drip system and it feels like it is on cruse control. The growth is crazy too!
 

ZEN MASTER

Well-Known Member
hey Jberry or anyone else that might know. yesterday i came across a 3x2x5 grow tent for $50. i want to make it into my new veg cab but ive already got 1800 watts going(two 600 hps, one 400mh) and the temps are borderline. i was wondering if anyone has used T5 lights for vegging? i was thinking about the fixture with 8-2ft bulbs. thats like 16k lumens. is that enough to get a GOOD veg, or would the plants be underdeveloped, just curious. i have a 400wt halide, but like i said im worried about the heat.


Any input or suggestions will be greatly appreciated.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-
 

buraka415

Active Member
question here about run-off.

I have 3gal containers, 100% coco. I water/feed every other day at this point - but i dont really get a lot of run off per se - other than what is pouring off the "TOP" of the container vs what is coming out the bottom. I'm giving each container 2qt's at this point. Should I be doing more? Am I pouring too fast and I just need to slow WAAYYYYYYYY down? Its not like I'm just turning my hand over and dumping the entire thing out -- I am pouring around in a circle.
 

ZEN MASTER

Well-Known Member
question here about run-off.

I have 3gal containers, 100% coco. I water/feed every other day at this point - but i dont really get a lot of run off per se - other than what is pouring off the "TOP" of the container vs what is coming out the bottom. I'm giving each container 2qt's at this point. Should I be doing more? Am I pouring too fast and I just need to slow WAAYYYYYYYY down? Its not like I'm just turning my hand over and dumping the entire thing out -- I am pouring around in a circle.

hey check this out. when i was using 2gal pots, i only watered them like every four or five days when the pot got light, and with that i was only hitting them with two liters(pretty much 2qt's) at a time. yea you've watered way too much. and like i said earlier this stuff holds water like crazy. it's kinda like this when its dry its like a sponge. you water it, it soaks up what it needs and lets go of the rest. now with you watering it too soon its like you are somewhat pouring water into a cup, or sponge thats full. slow down a bit feel the wieght of your pot when you first fill it with coco, or when its dry, and then when you finish feeding youll see the difference, and you will easily be able to tell the difference when it starts drying. because it will get lighter day by day. then when you feel that it is "close" to the way it felt when it was dry, you feed. because if you keep it soaked, your roots wont have a need to grow, which by the way is awesome with this stuff.
also it helps best if you have something like a watering can, with the holes, in the end thing, you know what i mean. me personally i use a manifold and a pump. but for the ones in my veg cab i use 1L soda bottles with the wide mouth top. just put some holes in the top and there you go(if they still sell them in your area), and yea i take my time squeezing it out, not super slow, but not where im making trenches in it by squeezing too hard you know. i use those because its easier for me to measure in metric. but any way, just to recap. your gonna have to wait about 4-6 days before "those pots" start getting light enough to feed again. only because right now they are soaked. so be patient bro.
btw now i use 1.5 gallon square pots, and i feed every third day, 12 plants with only 12 liters, for real. so yea smaller pot for me and im still can go every three days, keeps them wet to moist, but not soaked.and it only took me about four or five feedings when i first started using them to find out how long they could go between feedings, so trust me its easy.hope that helped.

p.s.
another easy way to tell f you need to feed is when the top looks dry, put your finger about two inches deep. if the coco is the same color(light brown) its time to feed probably. but if the top is light brown and in the hole it is dark brown that means you still have some moisture. at this point keep an eye on it, it may be getting close to feeding time. but like i said it'll take no time for you to learn how to gauge it. hell it'll probably take you longer to read this post.LOL.
props to Jberry!!!!!



PEACE!!!
-ZEN-
 

buraka415

Active Member
hey Zen, thanks for replying. Actually the coco has been drying out pretty good for every other day application. I wouldnt say they all are, but I thought I saw on RIU somewhere that even with giving coco lots of water it can still maintain like a 20 - 25% aeration rate? I'm probably misquoting that.

Seems that about 1/2 are usually dry and ready to go every other day, whereas you're right, some aren't. I dont have a moisture meter, I've just been finger test and/or weight test of container. With about 40 containers, if I dont feed/water them all at same time, who got fed the day before and who didnt. Guess top level inspection could clarify that in some cases.

i thought if you've watered way too much, then the run-off would be very high in % of what went in. No? Seems to me when its dried out, that no run-off occurs, cus its absorbing most of whats going in.
 

ZEN MASTER

Well-Known Member
hey Zen, thanks for replying. Actually the coco has been drying out pretty good for every other day application. I wouldnt say they all are, but I thought I saw on RIU somewhere that even with giving coco lots of water it can still maintain like a 20 - 25% aeration rate? I'm probably misquoting that.

Seems that about 1/2 are usually dry and ready to go every other day, whereas you're right, some aren't. I dont have a moisture meter, I've just been finger test and/or weight test of container. With about 40 containers, if I dont feed/water them all at same time, who got fed the day before and who didnt. Guess top level inspection could clarify that in some cases.

i thought if you've watered way too much, then the run-off would be very high in % of what went in. No? Seems to me when its dried out, that no run-off occurs, cus its absorbing most of whats going in.
heres what i do when i am feeding i dont cover the entire top surface. i try to dispense the nutes right around the stalk in the center.this is my thoery; as the nutes go down the middle of the pot the coco absorbs it outward, get it? that way i am sure the root ball(where most of my roots are) is thuroghly watered, thats when i get a good run off. just a note dont worry about the sides, the coco will distribute the moisture out to the sides. i hope you catch my drift, thats the best i can explain it.
also i was using two gallon pots with two liters(qt's) of nutes each, since you have those big 3 gallon pots you may need to use three to three and a half. that may be the reason you are not getting any runoff, and those "BIG 'OL POTS" are only taking every other day to dry out. like i said its super absorbant so if you stop feeding before your nutes can get to the bottom, or if your not feeding enough in other words. whatever is in that pot is going to be distibuted everywhere. sort of like the sponge analogy: if you've got a sponge that holds three cups of water max, and your are only pouring in two,....what's going to happen. if you want that sponge wet thru and thru with some run off you 're gonns have to give it more than two cups right?
try this: take one of your pots,take four to five quarts of nutes and go one quart at a time. if you dont want to concentrate on the center, imagine that the pot has four sides like a square, and water it like that (left side, right side, topside, bottom side, and the fifth right around the center)
Now if you do concentrate on the center, go one qt at a time with 30 seconds between quarts. i promise three or four quarts in you'll get a run off if you try one of these methods. but you need to see how much your pot will hold first.
oh yea there are always going to be some that dry before the others. thats when you find a time window for all of them.
i have 48 plants flowering and they all get it at the same time, every three days. because the driest i want them to be is three days, and that is also enough time for the slower ones to be watered even though they are not as dry as the others
i hope i explained that well enough. if not hit me back and i'll get with you monday.

ps. remember nothing is LAW, their aeration rates are in "THEIR" pots, every body's is different. just get to know your set up, and evaluate your own rates of aeration ,you know what i mean, the way you like it to feel. and take your time pouring in those nutes. get a watering can or something with some holes to spread things out evenly.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-
 

vdubb808

Active Member
Have u already planted them in a bigger final size container?

If not, I would highly suggest soaking the coco in pure clean water for a minimum of a couple hours or overnight and then drain and rinse it several times unless the manufacturer is extremely confident that they have done this for you, but i highly doubt it... I'm not aware of any compressed coco coir bricks that are actually ready to use.

After rinsing it you want to try to buffer it with some cal/mag plus or magical ect... Its hard to say how much to use but if it were me i would probably divide the coco up and try a few different cal/mag doses to see what works best since you may be using it again in the future it will be nice to know for next round.... I would try a really low dose on some like 60 ppm's and go up as high as 200 ppm's and maybe something between the hi/low dose.
Jberry,
Thanks for the input. No, I have not planted in a bigger container yet, but will be doing that very soon.

I plan on buffering it by soaking it with ph'd water overnight, adding trace nutrients the next day and rehydrating the coco again w/ more ph'd water. I didn't plan on draining and rinsing a few times. But I guess I could, as long as the Ol'lady isn't nagging me saying I spend to much time w/ those damn plants. = ) (I just laugh when she says some shit like that.)

What do you think about using trace nuntrients ? I was thinking of going w/ that for buffering the medium because It only costs me pennies per grow and I didn't want to spend top dollar for buffering the coco. Being that I am using coco specific nutrients they should help w/ any imbalance. And if there is an imbalance I should be able to correct it later in the grow by knowing what I need to look out for concerning deficiencies.

What do you mean by "pure clean water" ? Should I use RO'd water ph'd or tap water PH'd ? Or am I wrong w/ both, and go w/ distilled for buffering the medium ?

All tips and advice really helps, I love to look at things from other peoples perspectives and experiences. Knowing that we all have different ones.

Thanks again Jberry, Zen and everyone else who posts in this forum.
 

vdubb808

Active Member
heres what i do when i am feeding i dont cover the entire top surface. i try to dispense the nutes right around the stalk in the center.this is my thoery; as the nutes go down the middle of the pot the coco absorbs it outward, get it? that way i am sure the root ball(where most of my roots are) is thuroghly watered, thats when i get a good run off. just a note dont worry about the sides, the coco will distribute the moisture out to the sides. i hope you catch my drift, thats the best i can explain it.
also i was using two gallon pots with two liters(qt's) of nutes each, since you have those big 3 gallon pots you may need to use three to three and a half. that may be the reason you are not getting any runoff, and those "BIG 'OL POTS" are only taking every other day to dry out. like i said its super absorbant so if you stop feeding before your nutes can get to the bottom, or if your not feeding enough in other words. whatever is in that pot is going to be distibuted everywhere. sort of like the sponge analogy: if you've got a sponge that holds three cups of water max, and your are only pouring in two,....what's going to happen. if you want that sponge wet thru and thru with some run off you 're gonns have to give it more than two cups right?
try this: take one of your pots,take four to five quarts of nutes and go one quart at a time. if you dont want to concentrate on the center, imagine that the pot has four sides like a square, and water it like that (left side, right side, topside, bottom side, and the fifth right around the center)
Now if you do concentrate on the center, go one qt at a time with 30 seconds between quarts. i promise three or four quarts in you'll get a run off if you try one of these methods. but you need to see how much your pot will hold first.
oh yea there are always going to be some that dry before the others. thats when you find a time window for all of them.
i have 48 plants flowering and they all get it at the same time, every three days. because the driest i want them to be is three days, and that is also enough time for the slower ones to be watered even though they are not as dry as the others
i hope i explained that well enough. if not hit me back and i'll get with you monday.

ps. remember nothing is LAW, their aeration rates are in "THEIR" pots, every body's is different. just get to know your set up, and evaluate your own rates of aeration ,you know what i mean, the way you like it to feel. and take your time pouring in those nutes. get a watering can or something with some holes to spread things out evenly.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-
I'm planning on using 5 gallon Smart Pots, is this to big ? Why do you use 2 gallon pots, that seems kinda small to me. But then again I don't know jack, which is why i'm asking. Also what kinda pots do you use ?
 

buraka415

Active Member
am having some problems with Blue Dream and a few SourD's in coco.

can anyone take a look here:

https://www.rollitup.org/blogs/blog2057-19-days-into-flower-troubleshooting.html

mainly most concerned about the BD, as that represents the bulk of the crop. Lower leaves only affected. Take a look in the link, 3rd pic from the right, is a collection of BD leaves. Those represent the states I find them. Tips/margins affected, and/or just completely crumpled up.

Feel free to chime in on the "SourD-woes" pics too. the symptoms seem similar, especially the 'rusty' colors on the edges.. but the SourD seems more affected on sides of leaves vs what seems to start at tips with BD.

Am using 100% canna coco

MagiCal
Canna A
Canna B
finished up using Rhizo this past week.
1/2 strength PK 13/14 as of this past week

21 days into flower.

my apologies if this is the wrong thread.
 

ZEN MASTER

Well-Known Member
I'm planning on using 5 gallon Smart Pots, is this to big ? Why do you use 2 gallon pots, that seems kinda small to me. But then again I don't know jack, which is why i'm asking. Also what kinda pots do you use ?
no i used to use two gallon round pots, now i use 1.5gal white square pots. #1 i went from being able to fit 20-22 plants to 48 solid. #2 those 1.5gal are big enough to handle 2 weeks veg and 8 weeks flower without getting rootbound.
generally i transfer my clones to 4x4 inch square pots for two weeks of pre veg, then i transfer them to the 1.5 square pots, let them veg for two more weeks, then put them out to flower in the same pot. IMO pot size is very important to a certian extent. ive seen a guy grow a nice ass lolipop(i think about 10-12 inches) in a dixie cup. i think it was this guy named MADAZZ.
if i figure out how a strain grows roots, usually after one or two cycles, i tailor my pot size to it. now in this case with the NL and BLUE VENOM, which ive been working with for about a year, the 1.5gal are more then enough. plus it seems that in the white square pots the roots dont circle, they go out and down, which is good. remember this: too small will have the roots rootbound, too big and you waste nutes saturating a big ass pot in which the roots might not grow enough to get to take advantage of, always pot up(i go from 3oz cup for clones, 4x4 inch then to the 1.5gal or7x7(same thing). but in my opinion, unless you are vegging for like 4,5, or 6 weeks that big 5 gal pot "may" be too big. a plant, for the most part, vegging for two maybe three weeks probably wont have enough roots to take advantage of a 5gal pot. if i flower one of my mothers(which i usually cut from for about two months)i only use a three gallon pot, feeding four to five liters at a time and it keeps up with the others at every three days needing nutes. so no those 5gal pots are not too big if you veg accordingly, but remember bigger pots dont neccesarily mean bigger plants, unless you what .....veg accordingly. because if i'm right most of your root formation is in the veg stage, and not as much in the flower stage. thats why i pre veg , and veg in different sizes. kinda letting the plant form roots at different levels. look at it like this, i dont know how old you are, but when you were 15 if someone gave you a five bedroom house it would have been too much for you. a one bedroom or an efficiency would have been awesome, but now that you are older i'm sure five bedrooms would probably be a perfect fit, get it.

how long are you letting your clones go, and how long are you vegging? because the pots you are using now may be just fine. next time you transfer your clones, or transfer your vegged plants take notice on how much roots your getting with the time you are allowing them. you may want to add another week, or start in something smaller or bigger, its your own personal recipe.it just takes time, on a side note thats why i reccomend to people when they start, to find out what they are looking for in their smoke, and get maybe one or two strains and just concentrate on those for about six months, and learn them. instead of getting 5,6, or 7 different strains(unless you are pretty well versed). cause then you potentially have 5,6, or 7 different personalities, sensitivities, absorbtion rates, or what ever else to deal with. not saying thats what you are doing, thats just what i tell folks. but yea how long are you vegging bro? give me your rundown from cutting the clone to putting it out to flower. times and pot size only, not the feeding routine. just curious.
looks like i just wrote another chapter huh?


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-
 

vdubb808

Active Member
no i used to use two gallon round pots, now i use 1.5gal white square pots. #1 i went from being able to fit 20-22 plants to 48 solid. #2 those 1.5gal are big enough to handle 2 weeks veg and 8 weeks flower without getting rootbound.
generally i transfer my clones to 4x4 inch square pots for two weeks of pre veg, then i transfer them to the 1.5 square pots, let them veg for two more weeks, then put them out to flower in the same pot. IMO pot size is very important to a certian extent. ive seen a guy grow a nice ass lolipop(i think about 10-12 inches) in a dixie cup. i think it was this guy named MADAZZ.
if i figure out how a strain grows roots, usually after one or two cycles, i tailor my pot size to it. now in this case with the NL and BLUE VENOM, which ive been working with for about a year, the 1.5gal are more then enough. plus it seems that in the white square pots the roots dont circle, they go out and down, which is good. remember this: too small will have the roots rootbound, too big and you waste nutes saturating a big ass pot in which the roots might not grow enough to get to take advantage of, always pot up(i go from 3oz cup for clones, 4x4 inch then to the 1.5gal or7x7(same thing). but in my opinion, unless you are vegging for like 4,5, or 6 weeks that big 5 gal pot "may" be too big. a plant, for the most part, vegging for two maybe three weeks probably wont have enough roots to take advantage of a 5gal pot. if i flower one of my mothers(which i usually cut from for about two months)i only use a three gallon pot, feeding four to five liters at a time and it keeps up with the others at every three days needing nutes. so no those 5gal pots are not too big if you veg accordingly, but remember bigger pots dont neccesarily mean bigger plants, unless you what .....veg accordingly. because if i'm right most of your root formation is in the veg stage, and not as much in the flower stage. thats why i pre veg , and veg in different sizes. kinda letting the plant form roots at different levels. look at it like this, i dont know how old you are, but when you were 15 if someone gave you a five bedroom house it would have been too much for you. a one bedroom or an efficiency would have been awesome, but now that you are older i'm sure five bedrooms would probably be a perfect fit, get it.

how long are you letting your clones go, and how long are you vegging? because the pots you are using now may be just fine. next time you transfer your clones, or transfer your vegged plants take notice on how much roots your getting with the time you are allowing them. you may want to add another week, or start in something smaller or bigger, its your own personal recipe.it just takes time, on a side note thats why i reccomend to people when they start, to find out what they are looking for in their smoke, and get maybe one or two strains and just concentrate on those for about six months, and learn them. instead of getting 5,6, or 7 different strains(unless you are pretty well versed). cause then you potentially have 5,6, or 7 different personalities, sensitivities, absorbtion rates, or what ever else to deal with. not saying thats what you are doing, thats just what i tell folks. but yea how long are you vegging bro? give me your rundown from cutting the clone to putting it out to flower. times and pot size only, not the feeding routine. just curious.
looks like i just wrote another chapter huh?


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-
Zen,
This is my first grow so I'm not using clones yet. I'm starting from seeds that a friend gave me. He said they're a diesel X. So I'm not sure what it is. I'll probably get some clones soon from this plant I got going. I've been trying to find clones, but no luck yet. By the time I find me some clones, I won't need'um.

I will probably veg for 2 to 3 wks. Depends on how fast it's growing. I will reduce the size of the pot. I picked up some #3 smart pots today. I guess I'll put the #5 smart pots on stand-by. I will probably use those for my outdoor grow, being that they will probably be on their own for a week at a time. I'll probably try smaller pots when I get clones and see ho wthey do.

Thanks for the info Zen..........
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
Yea filtered water is what i meant but it is not a must... As far as buffering goes, you really want to buffer with Cal/mag or you will end up with pH issues... The repeated rinsing is to wash away excess salts so if you had a meter then you could test the run off to see if you should continue rinsing. Ideally you would want to rinse the coco until the run off comes out clean (no, or little ec) then add your cal/mag solution back into the medium. Once you have buffered your coco, then you can feed as you normally would... dont use plain water after buffering or you will just wash it away.

Jberry,
Thanks for the input. No, I have not planted in a bigger container yet, but will be doing that very soon.

I plan on buffering it by soaking it with ph'd water overnight, adding trace nutrients the next day and rehydrating the coco again w/ more ph'd water. I didn't plan on draining and rinsing a few times. But I guess I could, as long as the Ol'lady isn't nagging me saying I spend to much time w/ those damn plants. = ) (I just laugh when she says some shit like that.)

What do you think about using trace nuntrients ? I was thinking of going w/ that for buffering the medium because It only costs me pennies per grow and I didn't want to spend top dollar for buffering the coco. Being that I am using coco specific nutrients they should help w/ any imbalance. And if there is an imbalance I should be able to correct it later in the grow by knowing what I need to look out for concerning deficiencies.

What do you mean by "pure clean water" ? Should I use RO'd water ph'd or tap water PH'd ? Or am I wrong w/ both, and go w/ distilled for buffering the medium ?

All tips and advice really helps, I love to look at things from other peoples perspectives and experiences. Knowing that we all have different ones.

Thanks again Jberry, Zen and everyone else who posts in this forum.
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
if your tap water was high in usable calcium then you could probably even buffer with that but it probably has chlorine in it which is going to effect your beneficials in a negative way so it just depends on how much effort you want to put into all of this growing thing... You can certainly get away with breaking many of the "rules" i lay out for everyone... if you want to keep things cheap and simple you can use tap water, a one part nutrient, and cal/mag as your supplement... If you wanted to take it to the next level, i would suggest a rooting supplement and a blooming supplement and a chlorine filter for your tap water... beyond that, there is a million other things you can do... innoculate, aminos, ect, ect...
 
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