Fast-Food Workers Strike, Protest For Higher Pay

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
and thus you crash into the brick wall of utopianism, which fails every time it is attempted because IT DOES NOT WORK.

in a perfect world with perfect people, sure, maximum liberty, fuck government, lets all do what we love and shit will magically work out!

it never works.
Indeed, fuck coercive government AND fuck coercive people. Those ideals are not Utopian, they're the underpinning of a free society. Without them there is no real freedom, only a hollow one that falls far short and relies on the redefinition of words to ensure the present paradigm of control.

Things do not magically work out when authority is based on consenting agreements any more than they do when authority is presumed to rest solely in the hands of the state. However, instituting a coercive government, because we "might" have to deal with some coercive people from time to time fails the logic test. The coercion is not a given, it is a variable, variables CAN change. I know we bust each others balls, but I don't think I'm crashing into the wall of Utopianism. I think you are taking an idea out of context, and saying coercive government is the best there will ever be, not seeing the logic of how self defeating that is when measured against history. Burn any witches lately?
 

redivider

Well-Known Member
conservatives act like mcdonnalds' is this small-time venture barely scraping by...

hey folks, mcdonnald's made 15 BILLION dollars in net income applicable to shares in 2012...

i mean 15 BILLION dollars in net income in 1 year is just pocket change when you compare them to Chevron, so how dare those over-paid minimum wage commoners dare want to share in that.... don't they understand they MUST live in poverty, how else is the company jet going to get fueled? how are we going to pay for the executive suite at the stadium?? let them starve!!
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
conservatives act like mcdonnalds' is this small-time venture barely scraping by...

hey folks, mcdonnald's made 15 BILLION dollars in net income applicable to shares in 2012...

i mean 15 BILLION dollars in net income in 1 year is just pocket change when you compare them to Chevron, so how dare those over-paid minimum wage commoners dare want to share in that.... don't they understand they MUST live in poverty, how else is the company jet going to get fueled? how are we going to pay for the executive suite at the stadium?? let them starve!!
the McBurger Corp made that money on the backs of the franchisees.

the franchisees are the ones who will be fucked by this new attempt to double the minimum wage, not the McBurger Corp.

even if all their franchisees lose their shirts and all the McBurger Flippers go on unemployment the McBurger Corp can simply switch their business model to frozen take home Skippy Meals (made in china) in your grocer's freezer and make a packet.

they would almost certainly beat the ass off their only competition, the deplorable "Lunchables" product line
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
Grossly over priced box of cheese and crackers.
indeed.

when my nephews were little they wanted that shit when we went up to pan for gold.

they "forgot to bring them" when they figured out i had packed home made fried chicken and bumbleberry pie

those lunchables were still in the trunk of my brother's car six months later stashed under his spare tire.

lulz

some people's kids.
 

Canna Sylvan

Well-Known Member
There are outreach programs all over the place providing free condoms to those who need it, as well as free needles.

But the brutal answer is, yes, if you are so poor that you can barely fend for yourself, you should be extremely mindful of having sex in the fear you might get pregnant. If you are a fertile individual you should consider abstinence. If you do not choose these things, continue to have sex, get pregnant and have children, you should not expect the government to foot the bill for your extremely misguided actions.

That is very different than saying, the government should not take care of woman with a child or two or three that was recently divorced or husband was killed or whatever, and now they are left alone to fend for themselves and their children. In that situation, I would agree that government should provide for her.

But in the circumstance outlined in the video, no, the government should laugh at her, turn her around, and boot her out the door. Brutal, I know. But that's life.
You're full of shit. The DEA would rather you get an STD from needle sharing than enable your habbit. I once got a blood blister on my stomach from a zipper pinch. I called everyone. Free clinics. Pharmacies. Drug abuse hotlines. Churches. No one would tell me how to get a saringe. I kept getting told the DEA doesn't allow me to get one without a prescription. I ended up having to pay $40 and a doctor drained it.
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
You're full of shit. The DEA would rather you get an STD from needle sharing than enable your habbit. I once got a blood blister on my stomach from a zipper pinch. I called everyone. Free clinics. Pharmacies. Drug abuse hotlines. Churches. No one would tell me how to get a saringe. I kept getting told the DEA doesn't allow me to get one without a prescription. I ended up having to pay $40 and a doctor drained it.
you couldnt find a sewing needle, your jack knife or a pin?

dude.

you must be a delicate flower indeed.
 

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
You're full of shit. The DEA would rather you get an STD from needle sharing than enable your habbit. I once got a blood blister on my stomach from a zipper pinch. I called everyone. Free clinics. Pharmacies. Drug abuse hotlines. Churches. No one would tell me how to get a saringe. I kept getting told the DEA doesn't allow me to get one without a prescription. I ended up having to pay $40 and a doctor drained it.
What? Jesus just leave it alone and peel it off like a scab in 2 weeks, fucking shit I can't imagine how you made it through life so far, I suppose you go to the doctor if you break some ribs too?
 

Canna Sylvan

Well-Known Member
What? Jesus just leave it alone and peel it off like a scab in 2 weeks, fucking shit I can't imagine how you made it through life so far, I suppose you go to the doctor if you break some ribs too?
How come Liver Eating Johnson is such a pussy he needs a plant to go into an altered state. Never heard of a hammer?
 

BigNBushy

Well-Known Member
I've read the last few and first few pages, good thread, good points made by both sides... I found out buck cannot do math... $5.25 to $7.25 is not 140% increase. Indeed the larger number is 140% of the smaller, but a 140% increase of 5.25 would be like $13.00/hr. I'd say he knows the difference, just wants to manipulate his language to make his point hit harder, honesty be damned. He is inherently dishonest, no surprise.

Anyway, I fully support a large min-wage for someone with a decent amount of time on the job. Good help is hard to find. But seriously, one has to be pretty worthless to work at mcdonalds. After I got clean I got a job. Had not had one in a long time. Subway and $8.50 an hour it was for me..... For three months. After I showed I regained the ability to hold down a job I got a good job, just recently started it. I even called and cancelled my food stamps. Those folks who bitch about working at mcdonalds for 10 years and still making a crap wage have only themselves to blame. Show a little ambition.

Then again, I don't see for the life of me how those places get remotely competent people to come in at 5am to start making sausage biscuits for what they pay them. And a good portion of the staff are usually competent.

A massive raise would have minimal impact on Mcdonalds. I'm not sure what percentage of their stores are corporate as opposed to franchised. But mcdonalds gets a lot of their money from the entrapanuer (sp) that owns a franchise. I know such a family with 4 mcdonalds stores. They are comfortable, and I would call them upper middle class. But I got a feeling they would still be ok. Mcdonalds would still get their contractually stipulated franchise fees. The suppliers might take a hit. And because burger king and others want to sell burgers too, they couldn't pass it along willy nilly like to the consumer. Prices would likely increase, but something else would absorb the bulk of the extra costs.

The answer isn't a de jure minimum wage, but a de facto maximum wage. Most would agree the golden age of America was the 1950's and 60's. Check out the top marginal tax rates at that time. If it was still in effect, the CEO wouldn't be making $30 million a year like Wal marts does.
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
A massive raise would have minimal impact on Mcdonalds. I'm not sure what percentage of their stores are corporate as opposed to franchised. But mcdonalds gets a lot of their money from the entrapanuer (sp) that owns a franchise. I know such a family with 4 mcdonalds stores. They are comfortable, and I would call them upper middle class. But I got a feeling they would still be ok. Mcdonalds would still get their contractually stipulated franchise fees. The suppliers might take a hit. And because burger king and others want to sell burgers too, they couldn't pass it along willy nilly like to the consumer. Prices would likely increase, but something else would absorb the bulk of the extra costs.
yes, your right in your first sentence. a massive minimum wage increase would not hurt the McBurger Corp much at all.

but then you spin out of control and wrap your car around a telephone pole.
sticking it to the fanchisees will FUCK THEM and put burger stands out of business and those entrepreneurs will go into some OTHER business that they can make a living at, most likely, selling shit to their former employees who now receive foodstamps unemployment and welfare instead of working for a low, but HONEST wage.

HOW THE FUCK do you propose McBurgers will get franchise fees is all their franchisees are out of business?

HOW THE FUCK will th suppliers take the hit, when the suppliers generally pay MORE than minimum wage already for their skilled labour rather than McBurger stands UnSkilled labour?

when making burgers costs more than burgers sell for, only a fool tries to sell burgers.

"something else" will absorb the cost of end of the line low skill labour rate increases? "something else"?? what else? if prices will not absorb the "bulk" (read ANY if you listen to Buckie and his aggregate demand schemes) then where will those new costs go?
out of the franchisee's pocket. but thats ok, cuz he is "wealthy" so he deserves a kick in the plums.

The answer isn't a de jure minimum wage, but a de facto maximum wage. Most would agree the golden age of America was the 1950's and 60's. Check out the top marginal tax rates at that time. If it was still in effect, the CEO wouldn't be making $30 million a year like Wal marts does.
harking back to the "Golden Era" of liberalism and a tax rate NOBODY paid doesnt get the job done.
 

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
It is amusing to watch someone who is poor in the US support the rich in the US. Please continue.


Do you think that there is a solution which doesn't violate anybodys right of self determination or cause some other unintended consequences?
 

greenlikemoney

Well-Known Member
why don't you ever say that to flaming pie and her beautiful bouncing baby, delivered with thanks to medicaid and nourished with thanks to food stamps?

remember, she is a republican too. go get at it! tell her what an "urban welfare rat" she is, champion!
I'm not a Republican, I'm an Independent.....I don't like Obama, didn't like what Bush did to our economy with his Iraq invasion either. And who is Flaming Pie? Don't know her.
 

NLXSK1

Well-Known Member
Do you think that there is a solution which doesn't violate anybodys right of self determination or cause some other unintended consequences?
El Tiberon is a troll that just wants to be the oppressor rather than the oppressed which he sees himself as. He is in trapped a cell of his own design.
 

junker1

Well-Known Member
Just out of curiosity what would happen if everyone bought American made products, like clothes, food, cars, and whatnot ? wouldn't everyone be working making those products? If it cost a company 15 an hour minimum wage and they raised the price on their products would it even out?
 

echelon1k1

New Member
Just out of curiosity what would happen if everyone bought American made products, like clothes, food, cars, and whatnot ? wouldn't everyone be working making those products? If it cost a company 15 an hour minimum wage would it even out?
cannot happen, everything needs electronic circuit boards, they all come outta asia - the alternative is pay ridiculous amounts of money for a product identical in specification to its overseas counterpart
 
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