Layoffs coming...

Red1966

Well-Known Member
Greed of the CEOs of the manufacturers is what destroys their company, not Wal-Mart.
Blanket statement not based in fact. Some of the "manufacturers" are sole owners of fledgling business that have only one distributor, Walmart. Walmart will threaten to just buy a similar product from China to force price cuts. I can't believe you're defending Walmart.
 

Red1966

Well-Known Member
There are few stores below 60% full time. There is about 20 salaried managers in a store and 50 hourly supervisors. Most night shift workers are full time, and about half of the regular hourly people in the day shift are full time.
I'll take your word for it.
 

tomahawk2406

Well-Known Member
Catepillar is even worse. They activly try to get machine shops to go over the 25% threshold of jobs
i worked for a shop where 85% of the jobs run were catepillar. After a year catepillar demanded cost reductions. Catepillar also demands you supply them with the info on how you produce the parts and your process. And they control who your suppliers for material are
the mill i work at just picked up making motor mounts for cat. is that bad news?
 

Carthoris

Well-Known Member
Blanket statement not based in fact. Some of the "manufacturers" are sole owners of fledgling business that have only one distributor, Walmart. Walmart will threaten to just buy a similar product from China to force price cuts. I can't believe you're defending Walmart.
How did that fledgling company get to be in that position? Could it be that they threw all their eggs in a basket out of greed?
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
actually every big retailier i can think of except some grocery stores are union free zones

Office Depot makes shitty films decrying the union threat and makes their employees watch them.
walmart makes you sign a no-union pledge before you can even get a job there
Staples, fry's electronics, the good guys, best buy, toys r us, winco, orchard supply, ace hardware, lowes and home depot are just the companies i personally know for a fact have anti-union training, indoctrination and anti-union pledges.

im anti-union too. but like all things, when the tales become too tall, and the tout is making wild claims about the glories/horrors of any person place or thing, i immediately disbelieve the doomsayers and used car salesmen who are lying through their teeth for a sale of their agenda.

the pro union touts are exactly as full of shit as the anti-union propagandists. the union cant close the sale if they tell the truth, youll earn more on paper, but union dues and taxes will make the "new higher wage" vanish like a fart in the wind, and yoll be saddled with corrupt greedy shysters deciding who can join your crew, and who gets promoted.

and the anti-union shysters cant make THIER sale if they tell you the truth either, the union will increase their personnel costs and put up an impediment to their plans when they inevitably decide to "rightsize" your job to china, or attempt to buffalo you with their threats and attempts at intimidation.

walmart is just the most dickish and abusive company on the planet right now, they take great joy in fucking their employees, their suppliers, AND the cities states and nations where they do business.
 

doublejj

Well-Known Member
The best jobs I've ever had were union jobs. Better wages, benifits, treated better. All the worst jobs have been non-union. Treated like I didn't matter, low wages, moral, no benifits. Not a nice place to work.
I won't knowingly shop at anti-union stores & I won't cross a union picket line.
Unions are the only ones sticking-up for the workin man. Managments job is to extract as much out of the employees as they can for as little as possible.
And your talking to someone who worked themself up from union apprentice to factory Superintendent. Unions work!
 

Carthoris

Well-Known Member
actually every big retailier i can think of except some grocery stores are union free zones

Office Depot makes shitty films decrying the union threat and makes their employees watch them.
walmart makes you sign a no-union pledge before you can even get a job there
Staples, fry's electronics, the good guys, best buy, toys r us, winco, orchard supply, ace hardware, lowes and home depot are just the companies i personally know for a fact have anti-union training, indoctrination and anti-union pledges.

im anti-union too. but like all things, when the tales become too tall, and the tout is making wild claims about the glories/horrors of any person place or thing, i immediately disbelieve the doomsayers and used car salesmen who are lying through their teeth for a sale of their agenda.

the pro union touts are exactly as full of shit as the anti-union propagandists. the union cant close the sale if they tell the truth, youll earn more on paper, but union dues and taxes will make the "new higher wage" vanish like a fart in the wind, and yoll be saddled with corrupt greedy shysters deciding who can join your crew, and who gets promoted.

and the anti-union shysters cant make THIER sale if they tell you the truth either, the union will increase their personnel costs and put up an impediment to their plans when they inevitably decide to "rightsize" your job to china, or attempt to buffalo you with their threats and attempts at intimidation.

walmart is just the most dickish and abusive company on the planet right now, they take great joy in fucking their employees, their suppliers, AND the cities states and nations where they do business.
Wal-Mart does not make you sign a no-union pledge. In fact, the NLRA makes that illegal. Having been through Wal-Marts union training a half dozen times, I can tell you that you are absolutely incorrect. There is a video for hourly workers that describes Wal-Marts views on why unions are not needed, but no one asks you to sign that you won't join one and that would promptly get a manager fired if he attempted that.

Wal-Mart is not a horrible company like you seem to imagine. You can go to work there, do what you are supposed to do, put your 6% into your 401k(the company matches this) and retire early. If you didn't like it there, just say it. However, telling lies isn't helping anything. Do you know how many people are retiring from Wal-Mart as millionaires after having been there 30 years? I am talking truck drivers, people greeters, cashiers and not managers. Anyone who isn't a retard and even slightly capable ends up being a manager there in a few years.
 

Carthoris

Well-Known Member
The best jobs I've ever had were union jobs. Better wages, benifits, treated better. All the worst jobs have been non-union. Treated like I didn't matter, low wages, moral, no benifits. Not a nice place to work.
I won't knowingly shop at anti-union stores & I won't cross a union picket line.
Unions are the only ones sticking-up for the workin man. Managments job is to extract as much out of the employees as they can for as little as possible.
And your talking to someone who worked themself up from union apprentice to factory Superintendent. Unions work!
I've done the same job union and non union at different companies. I also went from union worker to non union manager in a meat plant in Illinois. (Meat plant under UFCW) I can honestly tell you that the pay wasn't better from one to the other. The only difference was paying dues. I was also a mechanical insulator in a union for a while and did the same job non union. It wasn't much different in pay.

What exactly would a union bring to some place like Wal-Mart? It has cheap insurance, 401k with matching, stock purchase with matching, dental, vision, college grants, pays for GED classes, 10% discount on all durable goods and produce, 10% off on food during nov-dec, had profit sharing until recently, easy promotions based on merit instead of time on job, automatic raises, lots of different jobs to do so you don't have to leave to change what you do. What exactly would a union do to help the average person at Wal-Mart? Would raising prices help Wal-Mart's associates if they have to lay people off? Would the share holders allow the company to suck balls for profit? You are talking 50-60 million hours a week of man power. A couple dollar an hour raise to every associate would be 6 billion a year, and another billion in 401k matching and the like. The unions are wanting 13 dollar an hour starting wage if they get in. This means the average wal-mart would become unprofitable immediately. That being said, it would be very easy to get a union inside of Wal-Mart. There are departments in the stores that are treated as individual businesses that have all of 10-20 workers in them. It would honestly take a half dozen pissed off people to get a union in a store. I really don't understand why the Unions haven't been able to seal the deal - are they even trying?

If the Unions wanted to change Wal-Mart, they would offer it a compromise. Something like "If you spotlight a union/USA made item every week in your store, we will tell our millions of socialist friends to buy them, if we buy enough, you keep it in your store." This would in fact be voting with your wallet and fix the issue by creating union jobs in America if that is their ultimate goal. Do you know there are many made in America items coming back to Wal-Mart? I go to the yearly business meeting every year. They are actively trying to bring American made goods to the table in Wal-Mart. All people have to do is buy them and the company would put them for sale.
 

doublejj

Well-Known Member
Unions are one of the reasons Wal-Mart employees have what they do. It's the fear of the little people banding together that spurs them to action.
I didn't say I wouldn't shop at non-union stores, just the actively anti-union ones.
I guess if everyone treated their employees like wal-mart there would be no need for unions. But take a look around.
I got way more back from the unions I've had the pleasure of being a member of, than the membership dues. I knew they had my back.
I graduated from a union sponsored aircraft machinest program that launched me on a career path that ended with me retiring as a Factory Superintendent. I was not a union member for the second 1/2 of my career, I've always had good relations with the union workers. That's where I came from. I've never had a bad experience with a union in 40 years. I respect them, in turn, they respected me. I've never lost a union grievance.
 

Carthoris

Well-Known Member
Unions are one of the reasons Wal-Mart employees have what they do. It's the fear of the little people banding together that spurs them to action. I didn't say I wouldn't shop at non-union stores, just the actively anti-union ones. I guess if everyone treated their employees like wal-mart there would be no need for unions. But take a look around. I got way more back from the unions I've had the pleasure of being a member of, than the membership dues. I knew they had my back. I graduated from a union sponsored aircraft machinest program that launched me on a career path that ended with me retiring as a Factory Superintendent. I was not a union member for the second 1/2 of my career, I've always had good relations with the union workers. That's where I came from. I've never had a bad experience with a union in 40 years. I respect them, in turn, they respected me. I've never lost a union grievance.
Wal-Marts video on unions when you get hired if you are hourly has the catch line 'Wal-Mart isn't anti-union, it is pro associate!" Occassionally, people in the company treat people badly. The company itself does a pretty good job of regulating itself and taking care of its people. Everything does tie together and unions do have an influence on everything in the country. I guess it becomes a question of your vision for the world. Should someone who works at a remedial job with no education make 30k a year with all the benefits they can handle out of the gate? Do you bump up the doctors and people who went to school for 8 years to make up for raising the pay for the underclass? Does paying people more if it raises the prices of everything thereby negating the pay increase do anyone any good? If it weren't for the minimum wage people, the people making 20 bucks an hour would be poor. It works both ways - Wal-Mart makes life on union pay good and keeps the costs of living down. If everyone made union pay then union pay would suck as the prices in the country would rise to make union pay the new minimum wage if they were payed more at all. You can't buy a $1 burger if you are paying the people ringing you up and making your burgers $15 an hour. It is a balancing act, you can't let the scale tip one way or another. The honest fact is that Unions are falling apart because they are starting to reach the twilight of their usefulness in our society. We are getting to the point where we don't need a union. Why? Because the people of the country demand certain things from companies aside from prices and items. They demand ethical practices. If you don't like a place, you don't shop there or work there.
 

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
The best jobs I've ever had were union jobs. Better wages, benifits, treated better. All the worst jobs have been non-union. Treated like I didn't matter, low wages, moral, no benifits. Not a nice place to work.
I won't knowingly shop at anti-union stores & I won't cross a union picket line.
Unions are the only ones sticking-up for the workin man. Managments job is to extract as much out of the employees as they can for as little as possible.
And your talking to someone who worked themself up from union apprentice to factory Superintendent. Unions work!
The shittiest jobs I ever had were Union. They just paid well.
 

Red1966

Well-Known Member
How did that fledgling company get to be in that position? Could it be that they threw all their eggs in a basket out of greed?
Calling someone greedy just because they're trying to better themselves is dishonest and makes you look petty and jealous. You work for a living? You greedy bastard!
 
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