Woyaboy
Well-Known Member
what is a "pre veg" area? I wonder if I needed to do this. I put a clone that rooted nicely in a 3 gallon pot and in a tent and it seems to not like my LED's yet. the whole thing shriveled like a chilly wang.
Perpetual SOG Timeline / Feedback Requested
qballizhere
Well-Known Member
its a small area I use when i have to plant clones they get t5 lighting only they will sit there for 2 weeks then go to the main veg under 600 mh one person come to mind that grows like this on youtube and that is medicropper he runs 25k flower rooms a little bigger than my setup
It started when I cloned to many one time and didnt want to throw them out just kept it since
bird mcbride
Well-Known Member
I use a trough from an old constant flow system to put my freshly rooted clones in if they are rooted a bit early. I put a single layer of gravel on the bottom, set the rooted clone in the slot and put a piece of 5"x 5" reflective plastic with a slot cut for the stalk over the roots. I water them with a pump up sprayer using spent res water from the budders. This system relies on the tubes for the moms for lighting. Everything in the green room gets the spent res water from the budders, drain to waste.
Indefinately
Well-Known Member
No buddy,
You can take a clone from a clone for ever and a day.
It's a clone of a clone.
It's identical to the mother.
As long as your mothers are healthy you can take clones of clones of clones of clones of clones.
No problem at all
Same dna/genetics
Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
All the best
Indefinately
" Let it be Green in 2016 "
Indefinately
Well-Known Member
Sorry bud,
You "can" take a clone of a clone an infenite amount of times.
As long as the mother is healthy.
You replace the mother with a clone every few months. The genetics are identical.
You are taking an identical "clone" of the original plant grown from seed.
This can be done and Indefinite amount of times.
BionicΩChronic
Well-Known Member
I dont wish to start an argument. But there are countless studies on the degradation of genectics through cloning clones of clones of clones and so on.
Do a little research, theres even some threads on it here.
Maybe they should sticky those....
BionicΩChronic
Well-Known Member
You can use a clone from the mother as a new mother
And even a clone from that clone as a mother
But after you replace that clone with its clone... This is when the genectic code starts to break down.
And even a clone from that clone as a mother
But after you replace that clone with its clone... This is when the genectic code starts to break down.
GroErr
Well-Known Member
This Jack The Ripper was pulled about 3 weeks ago. It's now 3 years old and cloned from a clone from a clone from a clone, you get the picture. I don't have room like many here to keep mothers and keep a decent array of genetics in the line up so I clone just before flowering to maintain any phenos I want to keep going, It's still in my garden because it's still one of the best phenos and yields as much now and tastes/smells/smokes as well as it did from the original seed.
If you keep the mothers/clones healthy there's probably no limit to how long you can clone a clone and maintain it's original vigour, punch, smell and taste. Sometimes better as I've improved my lighting over time and it's yielding a bit more than the original now.
If you keep the mothers/clones healthy there's probably no limit to how long you can clone a clone and maintain it's original vigour, punch, smell and taste. Sometimes better as I've improved my lighting over time and it's yielding a bit more than the original now.
Indefinately
Well-Known Member
No arguments here buddy.
Just chit chat.
I spent some time looking at "threads" and general google searches.
I can't find any definitive proof that there is any degradation of genetics from cloning a clone.
The closest I can was a seed producer who has been cultivating for many decades.
But then again, he would say you can't keep cloning clones as he is producing seeds.
If you have a source that you can refer me, I would be interested to have a read.
From my own personal experience.
I have replaced my mothers with a clone every 2 or 3 month for many years without absulutely any noticeable difference to the plants qualities.
Indefinately
" Let there be Green in 2016 "
pyrosfire
Active Member
Now I could of been given bad information but I was once told by my high school horticultural teacher. That each individual plant even of the same strain will tolerate the cloning process differently, some would tolerate multigerational cloning better than others but she stress that DNA can be altered by stress hormones in both positive and negitve ways... And that the age of the genetics not the just the cutting should be thought about as the splitting of DNA to produce new cells is not always 100℅ accurate in any carbon based life or viruses and if the occasional errors accumulate it can cause undesired traits in the cloned material.... OK I will admit that we were talking about the comercail pine forest I lived next to (300,000 hecters of pine cloned from the same genetic source)
Afgan King
Well-Known Member
My personal piece on cloning is in a home setting you will never have issues hell I have genetics from '91 still one of my most potent but in commercial setting it's starts messing around. I used to take 256 clones every 9 days. After about 10-11 months shit started throwing out different phenos. We started getting random couple of plants look nothing stature or bud structure wise like its counterpart but same bud so same strain. There can be degradation of genetics in commercial settings but as far as home grows not so much. Gotta think in one year I cloned 40 or so times. That's a lot compared to your 4 times a year or so in most home settings. We started keeping moms and the problems went away
Yeah that's why we tend to clone fresh tissue. The aboveground primarily meristem [shoot apical meristem SAM] consists of pluripotent cells as you know. And this tissue is normally free of virus and strongly resistant. At some extent we are just trying to reach or spin around that 100% accuracy.
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
Good thread. 
I'm hoping to get a half-assed perpetual thing going on here in the next few months but right away I'm going to sprout a shitload of beans and put 6 to 8 in 10 - 2 gal pots, top above the 3rd node and flip them once the new shoots are up and robust. I won't be watering each pot but making a big tray to fit one half of an 8x4 tent that waiting for me to prepare the space for it. Got the 1x4s and panda film to line a 4x4 box so I can just dump in the estimated amount and let them suck it up. Anything left over after an hour gets slurped up with a shop vac and the pots are soaked good. I have 6 plants in the same 2 gal pots now and they take 2L each when good and dry. So a 20L jug of nute mix will be just right for 10 pots. 8 each it is! :
Gonna use styrofoam egg boxes to sprout all these beans. Wife sells eggs and has a big stack she never uses. I put 4 together and ran a drill thru the cups and spent 5 min picking some of the holes clean and voila, 72 cups. Need one more tho as have to do 80 at least but will do 90 I think as a few are bound to fail.
About half will be my own experiment. A regular crossed with an auto so I can hunt for an auto of my own favorite strain. I crossed Kali Mist with NL#5 to get what I call Northern Mist®. I've crossed that with Purple Jem Auto which is Mazar x LowRyder. Have almost 300 beans to play with there. The other main one will be LoneStar Blue Heaven. A Buddy's cross of L.S.D. and Blueberry that came from Barney's Farms about 6 years ago. Fast finish and big frosty yielder. It's a fave too.
Gonna need more room for veg now but just need to toss the junk out of the spare bedroom so I can squeeze that watering tray next to the DIY tent where the plants are now. The four experimental ones are going into the grow room downstairs under a 400mh.
Read all about it in my journal.
I'm hoping to get a half-assed perpetual thing going on here in the next few months but right away I'm going to sprout a shitload of beans and put 6 to 8 in 10 - 2 gal pots, top above the 3rd node and flip them once the new shoots are up and robust. I won't be watering each pot but making a big tray to fit one half of an 8x4 tent that waiting for me to prepare the space for it. Got the 1x4s and panda film to line a 4x4 box so I can just dump in the estimated amount and let them suck it up. Anything left over after an hour gets slurped up with a shop vac and the pots are soaked good. I have 6 plants in the same 2 gal pots now and they take 2L each when good and dry. So a 20L jug of nute mix will be just right for 10 pots. 8 each it is! :
Gonna use styrofoam egg boxes to sprout all these beans. Wife sells eggs and has a big stack she never uses. I put 4 together and ran a drill thru the cups and spent 5 min picking some of the holes clean and voila, 72 cups. Need one more tho as have to do 80 at least but will do 90 I think as a few are bound to fail.
About half will be my own experiment. A regular crossed with an auto so I can hunt for an auto of my own favorite strain. I crossed Kali Mist with NL#5 to get what I call Northern Mist®. I've crossed that with Purple Jem Auto which is Mazar x LowRyder. Have almost 300 beans to play with there. The other main one will be LoneStar Blue Heaven. A Buddy's cross of L.S.D. and Blueberry that came from Barney's Farms about 6 years ago. Fast finish and big frosty yielder. It's a fave too.
Gonna need more room for veg now but just need to toss the junk out of the spare bedroom so I can squeeze that watering tray next to the DIY tent where the plants are now. The four experimental ones are going into the grow room downstairs under a 400mh.
Read all about it in my journal.
Mandingo914
Active Member
For the OP. I used to run a perpetual room when I grew. Like others have stated it's best to maintain mother plants. Every 6 months or so is when I would replace the mom with some cuttings. It is best to cut from the top of the plants. I noticed that when I took cuttings from the lower 3rd of the moms, the subsiquent clones tended to be not as vigorous as one taken from the top third. As far as the schedule goes, if you clone every 2 weeks, then you will harvest every 2 weeks, If you clone every week then you will harvest every week. The main factor is how often you can take cuttings. You want the moms to be healthy and vigorous when you cut them, that leads to healthy vigorous clones. With the limited space you have to work with, 1 mom should be sufficient, after 3-4 rounds it should be bushy enough to allow you to take all the clones you need. I would suggest taking twice as many as your target and keep the strongest ones. think of your perpetual grow as a pipeline, you clone, you veg, you flower. It will be batches that get transitioned to the next stage of development.
As some have said you can take clones of clones of clones, but at some point the genetics COULD have some mutations or abnormalities. It usually takes 2 weeks for roots to pop, and then at least 2 weeks of veg before flowering, unless you wanted REALLY small plants in your SOG. But once you have your pipeline established and are cloning on a schedule (I'd recommend every 2 weeks) you just follow the routine and keep your pipeline full. Your veg and flower room will have plants at various stages of development.
As some have said you can take clones of clones of clones, but at some point the genetics COULD have some mutations or abnormalities. It usually takes 2 weeks for roots to pop, and then at least 2 weeks of veg before flowering, unless you wanted REALLY small plants in your SOG. But once you have your pipeline established and are cloning on a schedule (I'd recommend every 2 weeks) you just follow the routine and keep your pipeline full. Your veg and flower room will have plants at various stages of development.
Craigson
Well-Known Member
Ive been doing this for my SOG
30 clones at a time, staggered by 2 weeks. Was gonna do 120 but SCROGGed my original mothers in the corner.
Not going for perpetual, just wanted to grow 6 strains and pick a couple goid mothers to keep.