see4
Well-Known Member
Would you just look at it? I mean would you just look at that. Just look at it.
Two cops got shot in Ferguson last night
- Thread starter sheskunk
- Start date
Would you just look at it? I mean would you just look at that. Just look at it.
see4
Well-Known Member
Especially Republican police. Not that there is anything wrong with that.
Pinworm
Well-Known Member
Just look at it!
OldSoul777
Well-Known Member
I was referring to the asshole who think its ok to shoot cops! I never would have opened the door. two words. fourth amendment!
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Honestly, I think they were doing their best to just handle the complaint and nothing more.
I'm not sure how they could act less corrupt than they did.
Seriously... I know it's not a popular sentiment on this forum, but if cops treat me with respect, they have certainly earned mine.
rollyouron
Well-Known Member
The convenient store owner should have shot Big Brown in the the store. That way I wouldn't have had to read this whole thread. Hardly any of it pertained to Two Cops Get Shot in Ferguson.
OldSoul777
Well-Known Member
This is the words of a cop!
If I walk up to your house and smell the distinct odor of marijuana coming from within, can I then search your house without first obtaining a search warrant?Not likely. The threshold for searching the interior of your home is extremely high, as it should be - courts have affirmed over the years that there is a "high expectation of privacy" in one's residence. In order for me to investigate the odor, I'm going to have to get into the house by some other means. No judge is going to sign a warrant based on a whiff of reefer, so unless exigent circumstances exist in conjunction with the odor for some odd reason, there is really only one other way I'm getting in: Consent.Permission obviously takes away any unreasonableness regarding entry.
In my scenario, I might knock and simply ask if I can come inside. If you let me in, I can visually scan the room I enter, but I cannot manipulate anything in the room - that constitutes a search. Contrary to seemingly widespread belief,permission to enter a dwelling does not automatically constitute permission to conduct a search.
A quick caveat to this idea. If there is a question about how the house is occupied (for instance, if you say you're home alone but I hear voices or footsteps, or any number of other articulable factors), officers are permitted to do an 'officer safety sweep' (quickly going through the structure to ensure there are no threats to our safety) - but even during this sweep, no active search can be made. I can only eliminate the possibility of ambush, which means that I can enter spaces large enough to conceal a human being (walk-in closets, shower enclosures, deep cabinets), but nothing smaller (dresser drawers, file cabinets). Also, I cannot manipulate anything in a room unnecessary to my intent of clearing the structure of possible hostiles during this sweep, or it turns into a search.
If I want to search, I have to specifically ask for consent for this. Some people will insist that the word "search" is magic and must be uttered in my request for it to be valid, but I'm fairly certain this isn't the case. Me asking, "Would you mind if I took a look around" has functionally held as much constitutional weight as, "Do you hereby consent to a search of your residence?" If you consent to a search, I now have legal access to any part of the residence, including those smaller areas, unless you specifically exclude access to a particular area (Pro Tip: Doing so is a huge flaming red flag billowing atop a pole which is itself on fire).If you decline a search, I'm pretty much at the end of my rope on the investigation, unless I see something in plain view. This is the legal basis for your question about detecting an odor, so we need to discuss it first.
Plain view is a long-supported exception to the Fourth Amendment warrant requirement. In the above scenario, if I am granted permission to walk into the living room and see marijuana pipes on top of the coffee table, I can immediately seize them as evidence without obtaining a warrant. Plain view requires three things to withstand judicial scrutiny:
- The officer has lawful access to a constitutionally protected area. If you consented to my entry, I have a search warrant, or I had exigent circumstances compelling me to enter without either (assault in progress, destruction of evidence, etc.), I have such access. This is an important step - even if I saw a trafficking-level grow operation through an open window, I couldn't barge in and secure it without consent or a warrant (I'm getting the latter, by the way).
- The item in question is in 'plain view,' and requires no manipulation to observe. Going to the living room scenario, if I see the outline of what looks to be drug paraphernalia under fabric (or any number of other situations), I cannot move the fabric to make sure and then seize it based on plain view. Legally, even though I saw evidence of it, it required a search to directly observe.
- The officer immediately recognizes the item in question as contraband. I'm not required to have certainty - I can't carry a forensics lab around with me. At the same time, though, I can't be uncertain - I can't seize something because I think there's an off chance it might be black tar heroin. If I seize something, I have to do it in good faith.
Only when all three of those requirements are met can I effect a seizure. Now, let's tie that into the "odor of marijuana" issue. We've established that I cannot enter your house based on odor alone. But let's assume that you allowed me into the residence, and I there smelled such an odor. Can I search then? Still no. I need probable cause to search, and odor in a residence does not give it to me. Maybe the tenant before you smoked marijuana so often the smell permeated the drapes. Maybe a guest smoked a roach while you were in the backyard and took his stash with him. Maybe any number of things - but odor can only give me a hunch, which does not give me license to search
superloud
Well-Known Member
Yeai didn't read the artical so i dont know what happend. i do know there are a lot of careing cops out here just trying to Do their jobs and protect citizens. I also No there are a lot of corrupt pigs out here Just trying to use the power they have to get what they want.
OldSoul777
Well-Known Member
Has nothing to do with respect. You should read what I posted. Point is they abuse your rights as most dont even know what their rights are. A knock and talk is a dirty trick used by cops on people who dont know the law and that they are within their rights to not open the door. I dont care how much respect a cop shows me, i am not opening the door if I have something that will incriminate me like this guy did. That fucker could have stated his peace behind closed doors and been on his way!
Wavels
Well-Known Member
WHAAT?
The two cops who were shot were released from the hospital.
Last I checked they were still alive.
Whaaat?
OldSoul777
Well-Known Member
they are alive, LMAO Man do stories get twisted!
superloud
Well-Known Member
I didn't say anything about respect that was the other guy that replied to me. I do show respect the officers because I don't want any trouble. And if a cop knocks on my door I'm not home.
superloud
Well-Known Member
I didn't read the story I just assumed A post title two cops got shot meant they were dead
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Are you under the assumption that only thugs (aka criminals) would care about their rights?
You seem to be under the impression that using your rights means you have to get in the LEO's face and tell them off. You don't have to do any sort of thing. When they ask if they can search, you can politely say "sorry, I do not consent to any searches." That isn't adversarial at all.
There is no need for arm flailing and foaming at the mouth when screaming about how they are violating the 4th amendment by improper search and seizure. You don't need to do all that and be a dick about it.
OldSoul777
Well-Known Member
I dont respect anyone out of fear!
OldSoul777
Well-Known Member
Anytime! Knowing our rights can mean the difference between jail or no jail. Its very hard for a cop to get into your house legally even if he does know you are growing. There needs to be proof. If a cop knocks on my door and I decide to answer it, I still wont let him in or talk through the door. I will step outside and talk to him and close the door behind me
Just knowing simple things can save your ass! There should be a thread on how not to get busted and knowing your rights.
Jimdamick
Well-Known Member
1973 to be exact. Different cops, different time (the good old day's when you could drive fucked up, the cop would pull you over in your town, say give me the keys, and drive you home).
We were also listening to Hendrix at the time, so these police officers that knew us, and my friends apt, hearing the music and watching the smoke waif under the door, they weren't going to go the fuck away. As a matter of fact, tell that to a cop at your front door that you wont let him in until I see a search warrant, see how far that gets you, while they call in for one, waiting for it to come in so they can rip you apart. 2nd of all, there was probable cause in that instance, so they could do whatever the fuck they wanted to do, including breaking the door down (they would have heard a cry for help) Anyway, all I can say is that I am glad that I was white and Irish when Detective Mahanoy knocked on that door, and go ahead all you tough guy's, tell the coppers to fuck off, and see how far that gets you.
Jimdamick
Well-Known Member
You do that molly bro, you seem wired.
