Way too many contradictions in this hobby.

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singlecoiled said:
1/2 the seedbanks start from 12/12 the other from first signs of buds. It's really silly to have to figure this stuff out.
Click to expand...

Breeder estimates are just that, estimates. They put you in the ballpark of reasonable harvest time.

What's the best way to count days? It's whatever you decide.

I start Day 1 on the first full day of 12/12 the plant sees. That way I'm consistent. Doesn't matter to me what the breeder says, or how long it takes to show flowers.
 
The thing about breeder times is what even makes them a breeder to begin with? How many have any higher education in the study of plant science, genetics, etc... Just crossing this with that and coming up with something doesn't make you a breeder. The term breeder gets tossed around much too loosely. Pollen Chucker is a better description for most outfits selling seeds.
 
xtsho said:
Many are lying about more than just flower times. Flowering time is pretty insignificant compared to some of the other lies.
Click to expand...

Yeah, this thread really dug into flowering time which wasnt my intention, use of Bloom nutrients is the big headache for me now as this is another subject I'm gettiong mixed signals about. I'm torn and am unsure what to feed, For now, I'll stick with the Dynagrow feed chart and go easy useage of Bloom nutrients without Cha-Ching, Beastie Bloomz, or Open Sesame......

Bloom Nutrients are pure evil that will wreck your grow according to many.... Nitrogen should not be used late flower, according to many. WTF?

Has anyone ever had a successful grow using bloom nutrients?

Bloom Notes Below

Below are some conversations etc... That I've been saving to read and learn from...


Dyna Grow stuff !

Here is an interview with the president of Dyna-Grow.

Rather than listen to forum "experts" with more experience posting than knowledge of growing here is the owner of a fertilizer company telling the truth about nutes and marijuana.

You can throw away the bloom bottle. He only produced that due to customer demand. Not plants demand. And he admits it here.

I had to learn the hard way about bloom. Kept reducing and reducing but never eliminated it until I got into a convo with another member here. His comments matched my results but I still couldn't believe that the whole industry pushes the wrong balances. It's worse than propaganda and the simple fact all the wrong ratios have names like bloom or boosters we all think we need it. Or at least I did. I'm done with bloom.

As a beginner who wouldn't want to flower without a bloom product? And holy shit if I could boost that blossom wouldn't that be great ! But that's not what they do like dude said some could be toxic.

Dyna Gro is highly concentrated so less is more. If you are growing in coco I'll post a recommended feed chart below. This feed chart was created by Costa Mesa Steve, so I want to give credit where it's deserved. His Feed Chart was developed using Growmore Nutrients, however it works perfectly for Dyna Gro.

Just one other thing to note - the highest my PPM's ever go are about 800, and even then there are only a few strains that can routinely feed that heavy in my experience. You'll want to gradually work your way up.

By the way - when you add 5ML calmag to your RO water it's going to increase the PPM's significantly so don't be scared of that. Follow what I have down below and I can damn near guarantee you'll be really successful with DG. Once you get comfortable then you can start tweaking things.

**I'm assuming you are using R/O water**
If you are using tap water then cut the Calmag down to 2.5ML or even 0 depending on your tap water PPM's.

**If using coco then feed this every watering**
**If using soil then feed this recipe 1x per week, with normal watering in between of just 5ML calmag and RO water + 2.5ML of Recharge**

Week 1 Veg
2ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag (always add 2nd)
2.5ML Protekt (always add first)
2.5ML Recharge (go buy this stuff, it's worth it's weight in gold)

Week 2 Veg
2ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
2.5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 3 Veg
3ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 4, Week 5, & Week 6 Veg
4ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 1 Flower
4ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 2 Flower
5ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 3 Flower
6ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
2.5ML Protekt (last week using Protekt)
2.5ML Recharge

Week 4, Week 5, Week 6, & Week 7 Flower
6ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
2.5ML Recharge

Week 8
2.5ML Recharge

Do you use dyna gro? Need some advice..

Hey so I've got a bunch of dyna gro nutes and I downloaded the feeding schedule they have on their website and I'm having issues with some of it. The bloom schedule they have is fine for me. The ladies love it. But the schedule for veg is not working for me. I'm using foliage pro instead of...
www.rollitup.org

I've have been using DG for years. Don't use their feed schedule. I like grow and foliage pro as well as protekt. Ive stopped using mag pro and as time has gone on I've used less and less bloom. Use what your plants need not what a feed schedule tells you. I found that you need to use grow or foliage pro through the stretch. I wouldn't touch bloom until completion of the 3rd week of flower. At this point I'd still be mixing my nutes the same way I always have with grow or foliage pro (300ppm). Then each week I'd slowly raise that PPM with bloom. I'd never exceed 500 ppm. I'd reach 500 ppm during the 5th week and I'd maintain 500 ppm through about week 8. Then I'd start decreasing the bloom to decrease the PPM to desired level. I don't flush just slowly decrease ppms.

I'm surprised you're not complaining about yellow leaves. If you follow their feed schedule and start bloom day 1 of 12/12 generally yellowing leaves sets in prior to week 4. I learned plants need more N than most bloom products provide. It took a while and plenty of tweaking. But I figured it out and was able to keep nice healthy plants through completion.

A few months ago I started a convo with another grower. Who I don't know personally. But I've been seeing his posts for years and from what I've read I felt this guy makes sense and he's got decades under his belt for experience. He's explained to me that the issue I was facing wasn't only lack of N. But there's to much P also. That excess P supposedly makes it harder for the plants to get N. In other words he believes although my plants were healthy I really hadn't fixed the problem. I was only masking it by my increased N.

It sure seems logical so logical I decided to run a test. I used jacks classic citrus on some plants and on the others foliage pro and NO BLOOM. I'm sorry to say that I've had problems. My test included 3 strains. One of which I've had most leaves turn yellow with both nutes. I should have raised the PPM earlier than I did. I could go back to mixing grow or foliage pro with bloom. But even though I fucked up this batch I think it's all on me and I'm going down the right path. So I'm going to run my next set with jacks classic only and I'm going to raise my PPMs as I have in the past.

Since both these sets of nutes have more N than by old combo of grow and bloom I didn't think I'd have to adjust my PPM as much as I have in the past. My take away from this test is that was a bad assumption. So I expect much better results next time.

Foliage pro is stronger than grow so it will take less to get the job done. Those feed schedules usually run strong. Never use them. Start out with less than they say and raise it if more is needed. In veg I'd give 3 ml a gallon of grow with protect and RO water. The ppm comes out to about 280. That's full strength veg nutes for me for WELL established plants. Week 1 5mls is WAY to strong. Since I've got a cycle going I've always got plants in all phases. So I'd always have full strength veg nutes (280 ppm) on hand. For week 1 I'd cut my full strength veg nutes with RO water until the PPM was down to about 50. And I'd dilute less and less until it was well established.

I've got a blulab combo meter they work great. If it says 650. It's 650. Use less and get the PPMs where you want them. Much lower.
 
singlecoiled said:
Yeah, this thread really dug into flowering time which wasnt my intention, use of Bloom nutrients is the big headache for me now as this is another subject I'm gettiong mixed signals about. I'm torn and am unsure what to feed, For now, I'll stick with the Dynagrow feed chart and go easy useage of Bloom nutrients without Cha-Ching, Beastie Bloomz, or Open Sesame......

Bloom Nutrients are pure evil that will wreck your grow according to many.... Nitrogen should not be used late flower, according to many. WTF?

Has anyone ever had a successful grow using bloom nutrients with success?

Bloom Notes Below

Below are some conversations etc... That I've been saving to read and learn from...


Dyna Grow stuff !

Here is an interview with the president of Dyna-Grow.

Rather than listen to forum "experts" with more experience posting than knowledge of growing here is the owner of a fertilizer company telling the truth about nutes and marijuana.

You can throw away the bloom bottle. He only produced that due to customer demand. Not plants demand. And he admits it here.

I had to learn the hard way about bloom. Kept reducing and reducing but never eliminated it until I got into a convo with another member here. His comments matched my results but I still couldn't believe that the whole industry pushes the wrong balances. It's worse than propaganda and the simple fact all the wrong ratios have names like bloom or boosters we all think we need it. Or at least I did. I'm done with bloom.

As a beginner who wouldn't want to flower without a bloom product? And holy shit if I could boost that blossom wouldn't that be great ! But that's not what they do like dude said some could be toxic.

Dyna Gro is highly concentrated so less is more. If you are growing in coco I'll post a recommended feed chart below. This feed chart was created by Costa Mesa Steve, so I want to give credit where it's deserved. His Feed Chart was developed using Growmore Nutrients, however it works perfectly for Dyna Gro.

Just one other thing to note - the highest my PPM's ever go are about 800, and even then there are only a few strains that can routinely feed that heavy in my experience. You'll want to gradually work your way up.

By the way - when you add 5ML calmag to your RO water it's going to increase the PPM's significantly so don't be scared of that. Follow what I have down below and I can damn near guarantee you'll be really successful with DG. Once you get comfortable then you can start tweaking things.

**I'm assuming you are using R/O water**
If you are using tap water then cut the Calmag down to 2.5ML or even 0 depending on your tap water PPM's.

**If using coco then feed this every watering**
**If using soil then feed this recipe 1x per week, with normal watering in between of just 5ML calmag and RO water + 2.5ML of Recharge**

Week 1 Veg
2ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag (always add 2nd)
2.5ML Protekt (always add first)
2.5ML Recharge (go buy this stuff, it's worth it's weight in gold)

Week 2 Veg
2ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
2.5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 3 Veg
3ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 4, Week 5, & Week 6 Veg
4ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 1 Flower
4ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 2 Flower
5ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
5ML Protekt
2.5ML Recharge

Week 3 Flower
6ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
2.5ML Protekt (last week using Protekt)
2.5ML Recharge

Week 4, Week 5, Week 6, & Week 7 Flower
6ML Foliage Pro
5ML Calmag
2.5ML Recharge

Week 8
2.5ML Recharge

Do you use dyna gro? Need some advice..

Hey so I've got a bunch of dyna gro nutes and I downloaded the feeding schedule they have on their website and I'm having issues with some of it. The bloom schedule they have is fine for me. The ladies love it. But the schedule for veg is not working for me. I'm using foliage pro instead of...
www.rollitup.org

I've have been using DG for years. Don't use their feed schedule. I like grow and foliage pro as well as protekt. Ive stopped using mag pro and as time has gone on I've used less and less bloom. Use what your plants need not what a feed schedule tells you. I found that you need to use grow or foliage pro through the stretch. I wouldn't touch bloom until completion of the 3rd week of flower. At this point I'd still be mixing my nutes the same way I always have with grow or foliage pro (300ppm). Then each week I'd slowly raise that PPM with bloom. I'd never exceed 500 ppm. I'd reach 500 ppm during the 5th week and I'd maintain 500 ppm through about week 8. Then I'd start decreasing the bloom to decrease the PPM to desired level. I don't flush just slowly decrease ppms.

I'm surprised you're not complaining about yellow leaves. If you follow their feed schedule and start bloom day 1 of 12/12 generally yellowing leaves sets in prior to week 4. I learned plants need more N than most bloom products provide. It took a while and plenty of tweaking. But I figured it out and was able to keep nice healthy plants through completion.

A few months ago I started a convo with another grower. Who I don't know personally. But I've been seeing his posts for years and from what I've read I felt this guy makes sense and he's got decades under his belt for experience. He's explained to me that the issue I was facing wasn't only lack of N. But there's to much P also. That excess P supposedly makes it harder for the plants to get N. In other words he believes although my plants were healthy I really hadn't fixed the problem. I was only masking it by my increased N.

It sure seems logical so logical I decided to run a test. I used jacks classic citrus on some plants and on the others foliage pro and NO BLOOM. I'm sorry to say that I've had problems. My test included 3 strains. One of which I've had most leaves turn yellow with both nutes. I should have raised the PPM earlier than I did. I could go back to mixing grow or foliage pro with bloom. But even though I fucked up this batch I think it's all on me and I'm going down the right path. So I'm going to run my next set with jacks classic only and I'm going to raise my PPMs as I have in the past.

Since both these sets of nutes have more N than by old combo of grow and bloom I didn't think I'd have to adjust my PPM as much as I have in the past. My take away from this test is that was a bad assumption. So I expect much better results next time.

Foliage pro is stronger than grow so it will take less to get the job done. Those feed schedules usually run strong. Never use them. Start out with less than they say and raise it if more is needed. In veg I'd give 3 ml a gallon of grow with protect and RO water. The ppm comes out to about 280. That's full strength veg nutes for me for WELL established plants. Week 1 5mls is WAY to strong. Since I've got a cycle going I've always got plants in all phases. So I'd always have full strength veg nutes (280 ppm) on hand. For week 1 I'd cut my full strength veg nutes with RO water until the PPM was down to about 50. And I'd dilute less and less until it was well established.

I've got a blulab combo meter they work great. If it says 650. It's 650. Use less and get the PPMs where you want them. Much lower.
Click to expand...
That's way too much to read, lol. I saw you mention the N in flower though again. Ya, they still need N during flower, but too much can mess with flowering a bit.
 
singlecoiled said:
Good stuff thanks,I didnt really think about the fact that their are different approaches that work for folks. unfortunately for me, I havent had success yet after four grows. I'm not giving up but I'm preparing my towel.... (to toss in) Week 7 flower is brutal for me and I cant get past it. Its a perfect time to fail too, right at the end !

The grow below is current. Watch how bad it gets in the next few weeks. I still have 3-4 week to go. This is my third grow of the same strain, and I've tried everything without luck....
Click to expand...
buildasoil.com

Enhance Florals with BuildABloom Amino-Chelated Bloom Booster

Boost your blooms with BuildABloom, the gardeners' choice for a world-renowned bloom booster. Our vegan-friendly, amino acid chelated formula nourishes flowering plants without harsh chemicals. Perfect for those seeking an organic approach to vibrant blooms. BuildABloom is the eco-conscious way...
buildasoil.com buildasoil.com
 
PadawanWarrior said:
That's way too much to read, lol. I saw you mention the N in flower though again. Ya, they still need N during flower, but too much can mess with flowering a bit.
Click to expand...

Lol, yeah sorry man. In short, I'm reading a lot of experienced growers that say Bloom nutrients are bad.....I put the juicy parts in bold if you just want to browse it. The interesting thing is the comment from the President of Dynagrow stating that Bloom is BS>... Its an important point to at least consider. (I fead Bloom nutrients last feeding at full dose following the Dynagrow feed chart. Until I learn, I'll have to rely on that. My plant is hungry and my buds are smaller than they should be, I have to do SOMETHING !


Side note: Strain is Nirvana Northern Lights Fem, This is my third grow and without using the bloom boosters and bloom nutrients my buds are smaller and have zero smell. My past two grows with this strain used way too much Bloom and Bloom boosters, but they stunk to high heaven by this time and the buds were noticably bigger. So again, I'm chasing my tail or learning, I'm not sure.
 
Great forum by the way all, thanks for listening to me and all my whining... Its a tough crowd here with some real clowns just looking to bash someone, I figured I'd get beat down with this thread but I had to say something. This stuff is driving me crazy !

Is it possible for the fools here to play nice? Your making a great hobby thats supposed to be laid back look very bad. We weed smokers need to come together, not beat each other down. And please have a heart for us newbies--- Just because youve been growing for years and know your stuff, doesnt mean you need to belittle folks trying to learn or making mistakes.

In short, Be nice ! Smoke some Indica and relax !
 
singlecoiled said:
Great forum by the way all, thanks for listening to me and all my whining... Its a tough crowd here with some real clowns just looking to bash someone, I figured I'd get beat down with this thread but I had to say something. This stuff is driving me crazy !
Click to expand...
I hear ya. I was trying to help. But it's not worth my time if people are just gonna bash on the shit.
 
Modern Selections said:
I am just trying to understand your advice. Why does N mess with flowering a bit?
Click to expand...

Not sure if your talking to me but.

I dont have time to post every book or artical Ive read, but many say high doses of Nitrogen is bad in flower. Then there are those that say Nitrogen is needed all the way through flower. So there you have it. Mixed signals. Some say yes, some say no to Nitrogen late flower. In my opinion and from what I'm learning, Nitrogen IS needed in flower. I have been using Foliage Pro (Grow Nutrient with Nitrogen) all the way to week 7 in flower to see if it helped reduce yellowing of leaves. At least, thats what I'm experimenting with this grow. I did cave in and fead Bloom last feeding though, mainly because I'm confused now and all I have is a feedchart to go by. My plants need something !
 
singlecoiled said:
I dont have time to post every book or artical Ive read, but many say high doses of Nitrogen is bad in flower. Then there are those that say Nitrogen is needed all the way through flower. So there you have it. Mixed signals.
Click to expand...
No it’s not mixed signals. Those are two completely different statements. Go through and look at the plants people grow giving you advice. Find the ones you like and listen. Ignore the guy that gives advice on here daily but his plants look horrible.
 
PadawanWarrior said:
I hear ya. I was trying to help. But it's not worth my time if people are just gonna bash on the shit.
Click to expand...

This is the problem, people can't come together and they arent playing nice.

Thanks, I really appreciate your help, but dont blame you if you bail. I've already made my points, hopefully my point of view will remind experienced growers what it was like to be a newbie. Especially with all the conflicting advice being given.
 
singlecoiled said:
Lol, yeah sorry man. In short, I'm reading a lot of experienced growers that say Bloom nutrients are bad.....I put the juicy parts in bold if you just want to browse it. The interesting thing is the comment from the President of Dynagrow stating that Bloom is BS>... Its an important point to at least consider. (I fead Bloom nutrients last feeding at full dose following the Dynagrow feed chart. Until I learn, I'll have to rely on that. My plant is hungry and my buds are smaller than they should be, I have to do SOMETHING !


Side note: Strain is Nirvana Northern Lights Fem, This is my third grow and without using the bloom boosters and bloom nutrients my buds are smaller and have zero smell. My past two grows with this strain used way too much Bloom and Bloom boosters, but they stunk to high heaven by this time and the buds were noticably bigger. So again, I'm chasing my tail or learning, I'm not sure.
Click to expand...

This should help answer your questions about what the plant requires at different stages. Different grow medium have different requirements as well

CannaStats - Nutrient Profiles for Cannabis

This page provides a common language spoken by all fertilizer solutions and a way to mix them for growing cannabis hydroponically. Sometimes referred to as the Lucas formula, this page explains the true origin of this well known proven formula and the project that led to its discovery. Emphasis...
www.angelfire.com
 
MannyPacs said:
This should help answer your questions about what the plant requires at different stages. Different grow medium have different requirements as well

CannaStats - Nutrient Profiles for Cannabis

This page provides a common language spoken by all fertilizer solutions and a way to mix them for growing cannabis hydroponically. Sometimes referred to as the Lucas formula, this page explains the true origin of this well known proven formula and the project that led to its discovery. Emphasis...
www.angelfire.com
Click to expand...

Great stuff ! Thanks, I'll take this and put it with the rest of my saved articles. It seems to be really well done !
 
xtsho said:
eggplant918.jpg
Click to expand...
The timing of this pic.
LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
 
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