Should Christians judge God?

[PetFlora]

I try to remain open minded, willing to change my mind. Something that most have a problem with, especially as it relates to politics, religion, personal responsibility, evolution/creation, such is the power of telling lies repeatedly in every possible way (print/airwaves/tv...) and convincing people that lies are truth and that Conspiracy Theorists are lunatics.

/shrug, whatever we tell ourselves we know.

 

[Nevaeh420]

Thanks for responding, but you sidestepped my question George. You base your belief that you are christ on certain bibical content that runs parallel to your life, but what if that content is part of the bible that didn't actually happen. Then your belief that you are christ would be based on fiction, correct? Which may mean that you're not actually christ, only that your life is similar to some fictional content...

That's true.

But that's doesn't make Me NOT Christ. I might have some serious parallels to a fictional character, Jesus, but many millions of people believe that fictional character is Christ or even God. I have no idea what's true in the Bible or not, but I do know that I have fulfilled some of the stories of the most "sacred" book in the world, one that has sold more copies then any other book in history.

I have to go, I don't have any more time on the internet right now, maybe I'll give a proper reply tomorrow.

~PEACE~

 

[Greatest I am]

OK, 'conscious of its' function' was a bad choice.

I believe that it can be reprogrammed to do our bidding instead of 'theirs'

And of course we have to mine the 'sheeple' to amass the opposing energy needed before we will see the dark energy disappear before our eyes.

That said, more and more 'sheeple' are waking up, and as a result, the dark is being exposed as never before

Soonest is best. My kingdom for a huge alarm clock. Regards DL

 

[Nevaeh420]

Thanks for responding, but you sidestepped my question George. You base your belief that you are christ on certain bibical content that runs parallel to your life, but what if that content is part of the bible that didn't actually happen. Then your belief that you are christ would be based on fiction, correct? Which may mean that you're not actually christ, only that your life is similar to some fictional content...

It is irrelevant whether the Bible is true or not. The fact is that the Bible is an "ancient" book and its the best selling book of all time too. All that matters is that it says XYZ in the Bible and XYZ happened to Me, for the most part. I'm not trying to pass the Bible off as truth because I don't know whats true in it or not. What I am trying to pass off as truth is the fact that I did the XYZ thats written in the Bible. The Bible is considered the "Holy Scriptures" by millions of Christians. I have fulfilled maybe a dozen of these stories that are in the Bible, more or less.

But yes, I'm actually Christ (in My opinion) whether the Bible is true or not. The fact that I fulfilled stories from the Bible is not the main reason why I believe I'm Christ. I first actually started to believe I'm Christ just because I have the Name above all names. The fact that I have fulfilled stories in the Bible is just icing on top of the cake.

Even if the New Testament isn't an accurate historical record (which it surely isn't - though there may well be elements of truth in it) - even if it were a complete embellishment - that doesn't mean Christ wasn't still Christ. Nor that if he were to return, he would be any different. If that's what you believe.

You can be as literal as you like - it doesn't change what Christians perceive to be the truth.

And mock Nevaeh all you like, but his answer to your question is already in his reply. You just can't see it.


The Bible is an allegory and Christ is a representation. It wouldn't matter if none of the things in the Bible were true, it's what they represent - what Christ represents - that people believe.

In that sense, if enough people believed Nevaeh420 was Christ, then he would be. To those people. And who would you be to argue? It would be like arguing with any other theist . . . Good luck with that!

I like you, you should post in the S,S&P section of RIU more often.

I thought I already answered his question Myself but Tyler always likes to "dig deeper" and ask many questions, which I don't mind.

I actually believe there was a Jesus ~2,000 years ago, but I highly doubt the veracity of the Bible and if all the New Testament is accurate. But on the other hand, I have said exactly what I have said, it should be a fact that I have said what I have said. And what have I said? Haha! I have made some extraordinary claims, in My opinion.

Hey Eye. George states that he believes that some things listed in the bible actually occurred, and most did not. He believes that he is christ because of specific biblical content, which I am assuming he believes actually occurred, is similar to his own life. My question to him is; what if the biblical content he is basing his belief that he is christ on is included in the majority of the bible that did not actually occur? Wouldn't that mean that he may not be christ? IOW, if the Harry Potter series wasn't fiction and I realized that my own life is strikingly similar to the lives of sorcerers in those books, I may believe that I, too, may be a sorcerer. But if I found out the books were actually fiction, the similarities of those sorcerer's lives to my own wouldn't really mean anything, since those things in the books did not actually happen because they are fiction. Is my logic not as clear as I perceive it to be?

I don't know where you are getting your information from. I never said that "some things listed in the bible actually occurred"! I never said that. What I said what that there has to be some facts in the Bible but I can't discern the fact from the fiction.

I do "believe that he is christ because of specific biblical content", but I have other reasons for believing I'm Christ other then because of what the Bible says. For example, another reason I believe I'm Christ is because of My prophecies. If I'm not Christ then I have to be the ultimate Prophet of all time, but how do you prove if ones a prophet or not?

Tyler, I have many reasons to believe that I'm Christ, or at the least, a Prophet that believes Hes Christ. I don't speak for God but My Words are divine. I will always believe that people can believe whatever they want, but I should also be able to believe whatever I want too, including the belief that I'm Christ. You may not ever believe that I'm Christ, but I do. And I base My beliefs on the evidence that I have seen for Myself.

Tyler, I think the following link below is what you are referring to as the Scripture that I believe I have fulfilled?

https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/671505-what-would-make-future-christ-19.html

You all can watch My videos again (or for the first time) if you want to, and see Me face to face. Its post #194 in the link below.

https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/671505-what-would-make-future-christ-20.html

Your logic is limited to your understanding.

He's already suggested the Bible is a metaphor. His "belief" that he is Christ may well be the same. He doesn't have to be any more literal than that. Any more than Jesus turning water into wine.

I think the Bible has some facts in it, but I don't know what they are, but yes, the Bible is loaded with metaphors in My opinion.

The belief that I'm Christ is just a personal belief, its not like anyone else believes I'm Christ. Because how do you prove one is the Christ? I tried to prove it in the links in My signature but to no avail.

Everyone's logic is limited to their understanding, how would one's logic go beyond one's understanding?

Well, you're relatively new to this sub-forum. If you've read as much George as I have, you'd know that he believes that he is the actual christ. He doesn't have to do anything, which is his right. I am asking him to, which is mine. George is perfectly willing to answer questions posed to him, he'll let you guys know when he isn't...

I'll give you this one Tyler, I do believe I'm the actual Christ, but who am I being compared to? How can you compare Me to Jesus when we don't actually know what Jesus said when he was alive? And what did Jesus actually do? For real.

What do you want to know about Me Tyler? What are your questions? Do you just want to debase Me or are you truly interested? I know one of your goals is to "break My delusion". And that's not going to happen, not anytime soon anyways. I may live the rest of My life believing that I'm Christ or I may see that its not doing Me any good and I should just move on. But regardless, I have seen enough evidence for Myself to have rational conclusions for My beliefs. I'm not perfect but who is?

This is bible God we are discussing. That God is shown as always killing instead of curing those he deems to be defective or deficient somehow, --- including children and babies. Is that the work of a perfect God and if so, please explain why curing is less honorable and immoral than killing. Regards DL

You can talk about the the Bible God all you want bro, but I don't believe the Bible accurately depicts the God I know. My God would never kill anyone. I don't know what My God would do to be honest but I'm sure He would have the best intentions for everyone and not take sides.

Seems to me he's already answered your questions.

Maybe I explained it better in this post.

I like you Prawn Connery, keep posting on here. We need more open minded individuals to speak on these forums. Some of the Atheists on here are actually closed minded because they think there absolutely is no God and there are no exceptions. I think your open to the possibility that there might be a power greater then yourself, like I believe too.

~PEACE~

 

[tyler.durden]

^^ I get it now, George. Thanks for the detailed reply. If I were christian, I would be very turned off by your claim to be christ. In their eyes, christ was so special because they believe he did amazing things: born unto a prophesy in the old testament, was tested by his father who was really himself (hey, Moe!), born of a virgin (yeah, right), was an advanced prodigy from an early age, made a bunch of prophesies that they believe came to pass, performed miracles that were seemingly against the laws of physics (magic), taught everyone how access the eternal paradise of heaven, died for everyone's sins, rose bodily from the tomb to be by his father's (which is really himself) side forever. That's a stark contrast to you and what you've accomplished. If christ isn't anything special then what is the point? We could all say we were christ, even average people with average accomplishments. You've brought the concept of christ down to your level, and made it average...

 

[Prawn Connery]

So what's wrong with an "average" or "accessible" Christ? Was not the whole point of "God" becoming a man to prove how accessible he was? To walk amongst us? To experience and endure the human condition?

By being so literal all the time, you are simply narrowing your own views of what other people might - or might not - believe. If you are not a Christian, how would you actually know what they believe in the first place that might upset them? All your assumptions are based on your own moral - and limited understanding - judgements.

If you can't understand what someone like George is saying - if you can't see his reasoning (whether it conforms to your logic or not) - then what hope have you of understanding others who may or may not share similar beliefs?

][/COLOR]Some of the Atheists on here are actually closed minded because they think there absolutely is no God and there are no exceptions. I think your open to the possibility that there might be a power greater then yourself, like I believe too.

^ I think this makes more sense than anything I have seen you write so far, tyler. It sums you up much better than you could ever hope to sum up George.

 

[Padawanbater2]

If you are not a Christian, how would you actually know what they believe in the first place that might upset them?

I used to be a Christian (as did many other atheists).

If you can't understand what someone like George is saying - if you can't see his reasoning (whether it conforms to your logic or not) - then what hope have you of understanding others who may or may not share similar beliefs?

Why would you assume since his logic is being questioned, we can't understand what he is saying? Can his logic not be questioned because it is simply inconsistent with the conclusions he's drawing from it?

 

[Prawn Connery]

Maybe because you guys keep asking him the same questions.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result.

 

[Padawanbater2]

Maybe because you guys keep asking him the same questions.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result.

Can his logic not be questioned because it is simply inconsistent with the conclusions he's drawing from it?

 

[Prawn Connery]

He gave you the reasons for his "logic" - right from the outset - yet you people continue to ask him the same, droll, unimaginative questions. Questions he's already answered. Now I'm repeating myself just like you.

 

[tyler.durden]

So what's wrong with an "average" or "accessible" Christ? Was not the whole point of "God" becoming a man to prove how accessible he was? To walk amongst us? To experience and endure the human condition?

I mentioned the supposed acts that christ performed, it is these magical powers that seem to make him so revered. If he was simply average and did not do these things, why would he be remembered, much less worshiped?

By being so literal all the time, you are simply narrowing your own views of what other people might - or might not - believe.

Correct. By asking very specific questions I am attempting to narrow down precisely what a person believes and why. It is by design, that is the point of my questions. Now that I've asked George very specific questions, and he so graciously replied to them, I now am much clearer in my understanding of what he believes and why...

If you are not a Christian, how would you actually know what they believe in the first place that might upset them? All your assumptions are based on your own moral - and limited understanding - judgements.

Actually, you may be projecting in this case as you are the one making assumptions and displaying limited understanding. I was raised as a christian, and all of my family and a few friends, are still practicing christians. If you had bothered to inquire about my qualifications to comment from a christian perspective, you may have saved yourself from tasting your foot yet again. From reading your exchanges with others in this sub-forum, I'm beginning to believe you enjoy the taste...

If you can't understand what someone like George is saying - if you can't see his reasoning (whether it conforms to your logic or not) - then what hope have you of understanding others who may or may not share similar beliefs?

I was unclear on George's reasoning, so I did the specific questions thing and now I understand it much better...

Neveah posted - ' Some of the Atheists on here are actually closed minded because they think there absolutely is no God and there are no exceptions. I think your open to the possibility that there might be a power greater then yourself, like I believe too.'

^ I think this makes more sense than anything I have seen you write so far, tyler. It sums you up much better than you could ever hope to sum up George.

Well, I'm truly glad that you made a friend here, it seems you both sorely needed one. To George's point, there very well may be atheists in this sub-forum that believe it is impossible for some deity to exist. All I can say is in my 3+ years here, I cannot recall a single one...

 

[PetFlora]

If everyone did 'question' by researching the so-called magic and devastation attributed to God, then at the very least people should begin to see evidence of extra-terrestrial visitation.

People from early biblical recounts were ill-equipped to make sense of space craft and alien beings. Easy to call such advanced tech as Gods. The fact that people were subsequently used as slaves should be all anyone needs to realize there is much to question. A lie repeated for thousands of years, is still a lie

 

[Prawn Connery]

I mentioned the supposed acts that christ performed, it is these magical powers that seem to make him so revered. If he was simply average and did not do these things, why would he be remembered, much less worshiped?

You say you were brought up a Christian, that you understand why people believe in Christ and what he stands for.

Yet you honestly think most Christians only believe in Christ because he allegedly turned water into wine and made some bread and fish go far.

Actually, you may be projecting in this case as you are the one making assumptions and displaying limited understanding. I was raised as a christian, and all of my family and a few friends, are still practicing christians. If you had bothered to inquire about my qualifications to comment from a christian perspective, you may have saved yourself from tasting your foot yet again. From reading your exchanges with others in this sub-forum, I'm beginning to believe you enjoy the taste...

I'd love to know what my foot tastes like. As much as I'd love to meet a Christian who only believes in Christ because of his "magical powers".

Is your understanding of Christianity - after all these years and all your alleged experiences - still so shallow that you think if Christ didn't turn water into wine, no-one would believe in him?

Did Buddha turn water into wine? He has a cult following, too, you know . . .

Well, I'm truly glad that you made a friend here, it seems you both sorely needed one. To George's point, there very well may be atheists in this sub-forum that believe it is impossible for some deity to exist. All I can say is in my 3+ years here, I cannot recall a single one...

So what exactly are you saying? A deity could really be anything - not necessarily a scriptured "god", omniscient being or collective consciousness. A deity could be a being from another planet for what little we know. I can guarantee if superior beings one day made their presence known here, someone - somewhere - would worship them.

 

[Prawn Connery]

If everyone did 'question' by researching the so-called magic and devastation attributed to God, then at the very least people should begin to see evidence of extra-terrestrial visitation.

People from early biblical recounts were ill-equipped to make sense of space craft and alien beings. Easy to call such advanced tech as Gods. The fact that people were subsequently used as slaves should be all anyone needs to realize there is much to question. A lie repeated for thousands of years, is still a lie

You could be very close to the mark. The Australian aborigines created rock art 60,000 years ago - way, way before any other scriptures - that depict men with what appear to be helmets or space suits (as some have tried to interpret them as), leading many to wonder what exactly they represent and where such concepts apparently evolved from.

Mankind is a lot older than the Dead Sea Scrolls.

 

[FilthyFletch]

I don't really support any religion and have yet to come across anyone who really does what is required of their religion to be considered faithful following. Most who claim they are Christian or whichever tend to cherry pick what they wish to follow from the religion then will still say oh yes I'm very religious. Sorry you can not pick and choose which parts of something like the bible or commandments say. Things like judging, pre-martial sex,coveting,cheating,lying,stealing, some muslims eat some pork, I know so called devoted jewish friends who eat shrimp.. I say if your gonna claim it and be taken serious you have to follow all the requirements or else its more of just a hobby. Religion has been the creation of most of the evil,hate, and killing in this world and I for one do not partake in such an evil belief system.Man should live life with respect and regards to all other life and your heaven or hell is how you live your life. You can have a life of heaven on Earth or make your life a living hell. that's the religion of life.

 

[Beefbisquit]

You say you were brought up a Christian, that you understand why people believe in Christ and what he stands for.

Yet you honestly think most Christians only believe in Christ because he allegedly turned water into wine and made some bread and fish go far.

The entire point of Christianity is the belief that Jesus was the literal 'son of god', and died on the cross to remove the burden of original sin from humanity. If you don't believe that, you are not a Christian.

I'd love to know what my foot tastes like.

You've already had a few tastes.

As much as I'd love to meet a Christian who only believes in Christ because of his "magical powers".

The fact that Christ and god are both possess supernatural powers is fundamental to Christianity, or you're just worshiping and praying to no one special. If Jesus/God can't hear your telepathic wishes, perform miracles, or resserect (all fundamental aspects of Christianity), there is no reason for reverence.

Is your understanding of Christianity - after all these years and all your alleged experiences - still so shallow that you think if Christ didn't turn water into wine, no-one would believe in him?

Considering the fact that the new testament was written decades to centuries after Jesus died, it's pretty safe to say that he never actually did change water into wine. Alchemy is not real.

Did Buddha turn water into wine? He has a cult following, too, you know . . .

Buddha had supernatural powers too.

1. IDDHIVIDHA - THE POWER OF TRANSFORMATION.
2. DIBBASOTA - CELESTIAL HEARING.
3. CETOPARIYA. - THE POWER OF DISCERNMENT OF THE MIND OF OTHERS.
4. PUBBENIVASA - POWER OF KNOWING PREVIOUS EXISTENCES.
5. DIBBA-CAKKHU - CELESTIAL VISION.
6. ASAVAKKHAYA - SUPRA-MUNDANE KNOWLEDGE OR POWER RELATING TO DESTRUCTIONOF ASAVAS AND THE RECOGNITION OF THE FOUR NOBLE TRUTHS.

Did you miss those?

So what exactly are you saying? A deity could really be anything - not necessarily a scriptured "god", omniscient being or collective consciousness. A deity could be a being from another planet for what little we know.

The definition of deity refers to a 'god', and in several definitions it specifically states a 'supernatural being'. Unless the alien you're talking about is supernatural, it doesn't exactly fit the description of deity - but we all know you don't care about what words mean, you just use them however you want and blame other people for not knowing what you're talking about.

I can guarantee if superior beings one day made their presence known here, someone - somewhere - would worship them.

For someone who makes statements like 'for what little we know', you make an abhorrently large amount of assumptions and guesses as to what will come in the future. It's quite hypocritical (and amusing).

 

[Zaehet Strife]

A little off subject, but my girlfriend and her friend were making home made bread today. I heard from the living room "i'm not sure why it didn't rise again" so i blurted out, "because you didn't crucify it before!" HEHEHEHEHEHEEEEE!!!

<--- Winner!

 

[Greatest I am]

^^ I get it now, George. Thanks for the detailed reply. If I were christian, I would be very turned off by your claim to be christ. In their eyes, christ was so special because they believe he did amazing things: born unto a prophesy in the old testament, was tested by his father who was really himself (hey, Moe!), born of a virgin (yeah, right), was an advanced prodigy from an early age, made a bunch of prophesies that they believe came to pass, performed miracles that were seemingly against the laws of physics (magic), taught everyone how access the eternal paradise of heaven, died for everyone's sins, rose bodily from the tomb to be by his father's (which is really himself) side forever. That's a stark contrast to you and what you've accomplished. If christ isn't anything special then what is the point? We could all say we were christ, even average people with average accomplishments. You've brought the concept of christ down to your level, and made it average...

The teachings of Jesus do work quite well in elevating and freeing the minds of men if you read them right. Listen to what he says from an esoteric POV and without magic and miracles and it is a good message. You cannot believe that he is the messiah or that we need salvation though. Regards DL http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

 

[eye exaggerate]

"Born of a virgin"

If you were to look at the universe as a womb...untouched by man...birthing a 'son', and notice how her robe is blue, and that light is generally shown as coming from her hands...

 

[Beefbisquit]

"Born of a virgin"

If you were to look at the universe as a womb...untouched by man...birthing a 'son', and notice how her robe is blue, and that light is generally shown as coming from her hands...

How was the universe untouched by man? People already existed long before Jesus, Moses, Abraham, and Adam and Eve. so I'm not sure how the universe would be untouched prior to the, *cough* immaculate *cough* conception.