Mandala Seeds Kalichakra and Satori

babygro

Well-Known Member
The one bottom left looks like it could be a runt... or was this the last seed to germ'? Still though, this could still mean it'll be a runt.

I'm sure the leaves will lengthen out as the plant grows.
Yeah that's the one that germed after all the others. It may well become a 'runt' but the Sensi Star grow I did from seed I had one out of three that was slower than all the rest and it turned out to be the only female I got, so I may well let this one continue and see what it does.
 

skunkushybrid

New Member
Yeah that's the one that germed after all the others. It may well become a 'runt' but the Sensi Star grow I did from seed I had one out of three that was slower than all the rest and it turned out to be the only female I got, so I may well let this one continue and see what it does.
I hear that. Exactly the same thing just happened to me on the la conf' x mystery haxe. I had what I thought were 2 runts. One was really a runt and the other turned out to be a very small female, I'm guessing following in the bloodline of the LA Conf'.

Oh, I wasn't suggesting you should pull it... i just like to see into the future, if I can.
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
I hear that. Exactly the same thing just happened to me on the la conf' x mystery haxe. I had what I thought were 2 runts. One was really a runt and the other turned out to be a very small female, I'm guessing following in the bloodline of the LA Conf'.

Oh, I wasn't suggesting you should pull it... i just like to see into the future, if I can.
Well I have to confess a certain element of impatience with that seed, as after 4-5 days nothing had happened I decided to dig it up to see what's what, because if nothing had happened a new one was going in. I did so very carefully so as not to cause any damage and there was a taproot of about an inch long, so I decided to very carefully put it back into the soil and see what happened. After a couple of days of nothing happening I decided to pull it out and plant a new seed so after having scooped out the first soil I noticed two cotyledons just below the surface so decided to give it another day or so and covered it over with soil again. Next day it popped the surface and the rest is history so to speak.

So, I don't know what damage I may have caused by digging it up, but I don't think that's the cause of it being a runt - I just think it's a weak seed.

Nevertheless I'll be interested in seeing how it develops.
 

SnowWhite

Well-Known Member
Hey man....how's it's going? Plants were looking great in the last pic update. Hope all is well.

I really like the look of these Mandala seeds dude, and the price, great find! The breeder info on the seeds is very informative as well! I see you are following their recommendations, smart move!

I've just ordered myself 10 x Satori and 10 x Hashberry for my next indoor grow. Which I will get started as soon as I receive my seeds!

I'll be starting another journal when the time comes!

How long did your seeds take to arrive btw??
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
How long did your seeds take to arrive btw??
Heya SW

Thanks for your kind words. I ordered from Dr Chronic on a Thursday and they'd arrived on the Saturday - so pretty quck really!

I think Mandala use some pretty interesting genetics in their crosses and it's a refreshing change from the usual suspects you find in Dutch breeding.

I'm sure you'll be pleased with your Mandala seed purchases :)
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
So 6 days after the last update, it's now day 25 from planting the seeds and about 20 days for 7 of them from popping the soil surface.

As can be seen from the pics they've all had a bit of a growth spurt in the last 6 days or so and are going nicely.

They're all still in their original pots, all I've given them is simple plain tap water warmed up with a little boiled water to tepid temperature - nothing else, no nutrients, no feeds, no foliar sprays. Just light, warmth and water. Temperatures are stable at 20-30 depending on the day, RH is still fine about 30 RH lights on and about 50 lights off.

They look nice and healthy to me and the next stage will be to pot up to some 3L pots or thereabouts, although I'm still waiting for some supplies to come in for that so hoping they'll arrive before the end of the week which is probably about the time I'll need to pot them up.

Positions have all moved again because I moved a couple of them for light purposes (I tend to move them every time I water, which is about every 4 days at the moment) but the Kalichakra are now all at the front and Satori all at the back.

Pleased with progress so far, looking forward to potting them up now.

The 'runt' is back right in all these pics.
 

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babygro

Well-Known Member
Looking good babygro... noticed that the leaves still have a very indica appearance.
Cheers Skunky

I'm really pleased with their progress so far, I've already avoided the mistake I made the first time round growing from seed - potted them up far too quickly - I can see from my notes, I potted them up on day 9 of having broken the soil surface last time!

Yeah, the Indica leaves aren't going to change now - it's a genetic trait I think and the breeder has clearly allowed the broad Indica leaves to become dominant. It doesn't really matter does it as long as the high is Sativa :)

I've also noticed that the 'runt' is a slightly lighter green than all the other plants and I'm wondering if this is a different pheno to the others in which case it's retarded early development may well have been genetic. Either that or it's the same pheno as the others and the colour change is due to it's late development, but that makes less sense than the former reason.

All good and interesting stuff, I'm going to hang by your MK diary now to see how your little baby MK sprouts are doing.
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
Okay update time. Quite a lot has happened since the last update.

So its day 27 from popping the soil surface for Satori 2,3,4 and Kalichakra 1,2,3,4 and 22 days from popping the soil surface for Satori 1.

I got everything I needed assembled for this repot, which I was going to do on Fri/Sat and did repot Satori no1 on Friday using Westland Multi-Purpose Compost with added JI, it was only then that I started noticing a number of comments on another site about how people were having problems with the current bags of this compost - apparently the formulation had changed.

I went ahead and repotted Satori #1 on Friday, because I wanted to see how the compost would perform. The mix I made up comprised 7 parts Westlands, 2 parts Biobizz Allmix (just using it up and taking advantage of the higher N content of Allmix) plus 1/2 part perlite, 1/2 part vermiculite. soil amendments were a 1 tsp of calcified seaweed and 1 tsp of dolomite lime, the lime to help with the ph buffering and the seaweed to add trace elements and magnesium. I also added a tsp of Rootgrow to each repot to add Micorrhizal funghi.

The Westlands broke up okay, but it was very fine and I suspected it has too much clay in it, which is why it compacts down quite hard. I wasn't happy with the Westlands and decided to source an alternative. After much deliberation I decided to go for something from a company in NI called Growmoor and they did a Multi-Purpose compost with added John Innes which was supposed to be a direct replacement for the Westlands MP. So I decided to use this for the rest of the repot. I altered the ratio's a little taking into consideration the 'better' soil texture and less 'fineness' and clay of the Growmoor.

I spent a long time sieving and working the compost to reconstitute it and take out any large stones, pieces of uncomposted bark etc and then mixed it up as follows - 7.5 parts compost, 2 parts Allmix, 0.25 parts Vermiculute and 0.25 parts Perlite, same Calcified seaweed, Lime and Rootgrow as before. I reduced down the soil drainage amendments because this compost looked a lot more 'bulky' and possessed more 'body' than the Westlands did.

I supposed I could be accused of being a bit anal about my compost mixture, in a way I am, because the quality of your compost will have a direct influence on how healthily your plants grow and how quickly they start showing signs of deficiencies - not all composts are the same, drain as well as each other and contain varying amounts of nutrients.

Suffice to say all the plants are now potted up into the new compost mixture and apart from a bit of drooping which was expected from the stress and lack of oxygen to the root zone, are now all doing very nicely. There are a few odd spots on the leaves where I was careless in the repotting and managed to get something on the leaves - may have been water or damp soil.
 

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babygro

Well-Known Member
The first picture shows the difference in colours between the later starting Satori #1 and Satori #2, it's clearly a lighter green and is more pronounced in real life. There's supposed to be two different pheno's of Satori, one more Sativa like and taller than the other and this was has a better yield potential, now I don't know whether it has a different colour as well. The lighter plant certainly seems to have much larger fan leaves than the others.

The second picture shows the internode spacing. They're up to about node 7 or 8 at the moment and I'm happy with the current internode spacing, it's about 3/4 of an inch per node and for a Sativa dominant plants, that's acceptable. I've been paying particular attention to the temperatures and enlarged the passive air intake to a larger size to allow a slower 'velocity' of air to enter the chamber, this has allowed me to lower the fan speed to a more optimal one in terms of noise and importantly, kept the min and max temperatures to within 5 degrees of each other - they're now about 20 -26 min/max at the moment. RH has risen slightly to 40-60 min/max which is pretty much optimal.

The third picture shows them all from above and as you can see they're all nice and healthy apart from one or two water spots to the leaves. There's no signs at all of over/underwatering or nutrient burn. There's a very faint fading and lightening of the leaves on some of the lower leaves, which suggests two things 1) they were simply ready for some more nutrient rich soil, having depleted the old soil reserves and were ready for their repot, which suggests doing it on Saturday may have been a day or so later than it should have been, or 2) they're getting an N or Mg deficiency despite the new soil and may need a weak 'top up' feeding of either N (Biobizz Grow) or Epsom salts, I'll have to watch them over the next few days and see if the lightening worsens, stops or greens up. I may even consider giving them a Maxicrop seaweed foliar spray or get some Biobizz Fishmix and foliar feed them some of that just to green them up a little.

Just one other oddity I noticed whilst inspecting the plants - one of them has 4 leaflets! The fourth leaflet is clearly defined but the one on the other side is completely missing. As you probably know Cannabis leaves go 1, 3, 5, 7, 9, 11 leaflets, it's odd to find one with 4.

Watering tip for anyone interested.
As some of you may know I also border on being anal about watering as well as compost. That's probably because after compost, watering is the next more important thing to get right. Worse damage can be caused by over and under watering than nutrient over-fertilisation and pretty much anything else you can think of, want an easy way to kill you plant or stunt it's growth permanently? Don't water it properly.

Anyway on with the tip. It's a simple and useful little tip that many people simply ignore or aren't aware of, but can play a very important role. When watering on soil, use a little watering can with a little sprinkle rose attached to it. I have one that holds about a pint of water at a time. Use the sprinkling action from the watering can rose to simulate rain falling on the soil surface - this helps to aerate and add oxygen to the soil as it enters. The little droplets of water enter the soil with oxygen and aerate the soil structure. It takes a little longer watering with a sprinkler as less water comes out, but still follow the standard 'wet/dry' watering procedures.

Another tip (I don't do this) is to use an airstone in your irrigation water for a couple of hours before you water your plants. This also aerates and pushes oxygen into the water and when given to the plants carries that oxygen down to the root zone where it's used.
 

SnowWhite

Well-Known Member
Looking good mate......excellent job so far! :joint:

I'm just researching my soil for my Satori and Hashberry grow actually, which I'll be starting in the next week or so. I'm thinking of going for the westland Organic multi purpose potting mix. Like you, I find the BioBizz and Canna soils (which I used for my first grow) a little pricey. The westland stuff is a third of the price.

The airstone idea is one I've been considering too. Just not sure how noisey it is having an air stone bubbling away in some water. Noise is a big consideration for me as my grow is in my shed which is not far enough from the neighbours. I'm going to setup a pump free irrigation system for my next grow as well. Just to be used if I have to go away for more than 3 days. Maybe I'll add an airstone as well to see how noisey it is.
 

skunkushybrid

New Member
My larger grow is in a high rise block of flats, and we had complaints when we first set up the bubblers. The guy downstairs couldn't sleep for the noise. We had to raise everything up on pads to stop the vibrations.

Good to see that your grow is stiil going strong babygro.

Another good way to add oxygen to your feed is to add liquid oxygen.
 

SnowWhite

Well-Known Member
My larger grow is in a high rise block of flats, and we had complaints when we first set up the bubblers. The guy downstairs couldn't sleep for the noise. We had to raise everything up on pads to stop the vibrations.
Yeah shit...I thought they'd be noisey! I worry (only a bit) about the slight humming I get from my fans, and I mounted my 5" extractor on rubber to reduce the vibrations, don't think I could get away with a bubbler as well! :cry:
 

skunkushybrid

New Member
Yeah, if you use an air disk at the bottom of the pot these make a lot of noise when the pot is sitting on the floor. Also the pumps themselves need muffling. It can be done. The noise is more the kind that you feel rather than actually hear, it has to be vibrating against something.
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
I'm just researching my soil for my Satori and Hashberry grow actually, which I'll be starting in the next week or so. I'm thinking of going for the westland Organic multi purpose potting mix. Like you, I find the BioBizz and Canna soils (which I used for my first grow) a little pricey. The westland stuff is a third of the price.
Thanks! I'm pleased with progress so far. I'd get faster growth with more light, such as a 250w MH, but the progress under my 200w blue Enviro is reasonable. I'd be better off in my grow space to use 2 x 125w blue Enviro's though.

Be wary of 'organic composts' from Westlands or anywhere else. They don't grow healthy plants all of the time. In all the Which trial compost tests the organics always perform worse than the Multi-Purpose and peat based composts. One can only assume this is because the organic composts do not use peat like the Multi-purpose ones do. Peat is not considered a 'renewable source' and therefore has not been approved for organic use by the soil association. Organic by definition means having been sourced from a 'living tissue' ie animal and plant sources. Peat is dead and decomposed plant matter and therefore very much 'organic' by definition.

This is the reason for much of the confusion over organic and non-organic derived composts - just because you're using a soil with peat in it does not mean it is not organic, it just doesn't meet the soil associations guidelines on what THEY consider to be organic. It's a 'definition' thing. So stay clear of these supposed approved 'organic' composts, peat based ones will always outperform them. Unless of course it's a 'moral' thing for you in which case get the one with the added John Innes, so you get at least some nutrients in there!

The airstone idea is one I've been considering too. Just not sure how noisey it is having an air stone bubbling away in some water.
It's quite a big consideration for me as well, but it depends on just how noisey it gets.
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
My larger grow is in a high rise block of flats, and we had complaints when we first set up the bubblers. The guy downstairs couldn't sleep for the noise. We had to raise everything up on pads to stop the vibrations.
Thanks for the heads up on the noise of the bubblers. I suspected they may be a little noisey, but for the price, they're quite cheap, it's worth trying one out I think. Instead of perhaps having one going for a full hour, you set it on a timer to run for 15 minutes every hour for 4 hours or something. OR dangle it in the water so it doesn't vibrate.

Good to see that your grow is stiil going strong babygro.
Thanks, I'm pleased with the progress. This ones going a lot more smoothly that the ones before. I've noticed one thing however which I've found a little odd in this grow. Now, it may be me, it might be coincidence, I'm not quite sure yet but I've noticed that the temperatures rise quite considerably when the oscillating fan is operating and drop back down when it stops. Anyone else noticed this? I'm just wondering if the oscillating fan is interfering with the efficiency of the negative pressure ventilation system and not allowing as much fresh cooler air in. Because it's in such a small area the little 6 inch oscillating fan is too powerful even on its lowest setting, it needs another setting down really. :idea: Wonder if a fan speed controller wired into the oscillating fan would help lower its speed? Its not a major deal really as I can control the temperatures easily with the oscilatting fan off and I don't really need it on at the moment there's enough air movement with the intake system.

Another good way to add oxygen to your feed is to add liquid oxygen.
Yeah, I prefer cheap or no-cost solutions though :)
 
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