Vegan Organics Aka Veganics With Matt Rize

GreenSanta said:

one more question, how about you grow a forest of maple trees heavily mulch with horse manure or all kind of other manure, are you allowed to rake them leaves to use all mulch? they might have manure on them!

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Veganics Defined

Organics: are grown without the use of chemicals, an organic certification does allow farmers to use animal waste, including blood meal and bone meal, to fertilize fields. Some organic farms purchase these animal by-products from slaughterhouses and other non-organic sources. The animals have been given antibiotics and hormones throughout their lives, and exposed to pesticides and other chemicals.

Veganics: use only plant-based fertilizers, together with smart growing techniques such as alternating crops over time to build nutrients in the soil.

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Seriously, the core difference between the two is the fertilizers a farmer chooses to use. If the birds and other animal wild life already living in the fields leave droppings the farmers aren't going to complain, because other beneficial insects break down the animal droppings in the fields.

Veganics as it applies to an indoor grow operation... No guano, chicken/horse/cow/lamb manure, blood meal, bone meal, feather meal, fish emulsion.

Earthworm castings are fine because most do not mistreat or slaughter earthworms. Most people just feed the worms and leave them alone to do what they do. Earthworm castings are generally in the soil already and earthworms are part of the soil food web.

BioCanna is veganic.

Veganics is unnatural and sucks. There

Matt Rize said:

Some tips i've learned along the way (3 vegan runs complete):
- feed heavy, supplementation will be needed for advanced gardeners
- brew microbe teas, low NPK so no worries
- feed microbes, in the brewer and in the soil.
- IMHO and according to the microscope, BioBoost cuts flower time 3 to 10 days depending of course.
- feed all mixed nutes asap and flush your res/hoses/wand or whatever you top feed with
- oh yeah, top feed the bio canna line. too thick to drip or flood/drain.
- don't flush until the last week or two. no residues from veganics.
- no worries with a vegan garden. don't have to wash hands after, non-toxic nutes!
- also, if in the budget, the BioBoost can be used in small amounts at any time after flipping.

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Hell yea you have to wash you hands the stuff smells

stonedmetalhead1 said:

That sounds more like human error which could have been prevented and the end product grown with manures wouldn't be contaminated so you wouldn't be putting patients at risk with the herb you are supplying them. If you take proper safety and sanitation precautions when dealing with manures you shouldn't have any problems not to mention you can get a bacterial infection from any type of organic matter.

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The whole story sounds suspect to me

upthearsenal said:

haha, how about you make a vid, sit back out of frame, take a huge rip, release and prove there is no cough?

i believe you can grow amazing buds like above with plant based nutrition, of course you can as long as you give them what they want/need. yet it's hard not to be skeptical when you say smoking this doesn't make you cough

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I have some white widow that wont make you cough

New_Caprica said:

Do you think I can bug you, possibly a lot when we get our growing going? We are waiting for the MM license to get processed but we are Vegan so this really did interest me. Also, I am a fan of as natural as possible.

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IF you want a product that works that is vegan General Hydroponics Biothrive works great.

Over 100,00 people use this recipe including many soil companies it works simple we pull 2 pounds a light for the last 15 year but it certainly isn't the only way to grow dank.

Sub

PS think I'd break my back if it didn;t work

greetings, i have put together my own soil mix for the first time using 60% peat moss, 25% worm castings, 15% coco coir base soil, with neem seed, kelp, alfalfa meal, azomite, garden lime, and 6 Down To Earth all natural amendments: vegan mix, acid mix, all-purpose mix, bio-live, bio-fish, and soybean meal but i was wanting to get some suggestions on how i could modify my mix to be improved, if anyone can make any suggestions how i can improve please give me some truth. i've been reading @subcoolgrower all your stuff and even been watching the Round Table on youtube, and i love the community its just that im new to growing. im just a beginner but hey we all gotta start somewhere. Attached is a Dinafem Cheese cbd that is in this soil i mixed to give an idea how it is performing so far: slight nute burn on some tips but not too bad, so am I on the right track?

GroDank101 said:

greetings, i have put together my own soil mix for the first time using 60% peat moss, 25% worm castings, 15% coco coir base soil, with neem seed, kelp, alfalfa meal, azomite, garden lime, and 6 Down To Earth all natural amendments: vegan mix, acid mix, all-purpose mix, bio-live, bio-fish, and soybean meal but i was wanting to get some suggestions on how i could modify my mix to be improved, if anyone can make any suggestions how i can improve please give me some truth. i've been reading @subcoolgrower all your stuff and even been watching the Round Table on youtube, and i love the community its just that im new to growing. im just a beginner but hey we all gotta start somewhere. Attached is a Dinafem Cheese cbd that is in this soil i mixed to give an idea how it is performing so far: slight nute burn on some tips but not too bad, so am I on the right track?

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Definitely on the right track @GroDank101.. First off, congrats just for being in the right jungle!

How you geared in terms of aeration?
What percentage would you consider aeration?

A volcanic element would be nice but not many are running so clean so quick so pat yourself on the back..

If you don't mind vacuuming a bit of soil here and there, i'd make your own compost pile outside if you can? and worm bin under a sink, without delay.. Easy peasy my friend.. feed them a hi quality vegetarian diet. With high quality artisan crafted castings you could cut it down to as low as 15% from 25 / 33 and see improvement in all areas.. and not need the acid mix or soybean meal, or any mixes from DTE. . .all while boosting microbial and worm populations, and therefore soil aeration and texture

That said, Leaf mould and or a nice thermophillic woodchip compost would bump yields and fungal populations.. Or rotting wood chunks as they're called would be great if can find an old tree. To round out that beautiful beneficial bacterial web
(Simple brewed teas with some oat fed soil will suffice til then..)

Of course as you may know, myco fungi at transplants for yield yet and to witness a symbiotic relationship where the plant trades 5% sugars from photosynthesis for a 45% increase in water and nutrient supply due to extend reach .. Essentially limiting droughts, equating to a nice little yield % bump too, but you're prob on that..

I could go on about peak performance / high brix / mineral ratios or foliars for different effects or enviro and bio controls.. but this is the foundation to making great soil.. Which can account for a massive amount of gene expression and therefore is the foundation to making great herb as well

Rrog said:

Veganics is unnatural and sucks. There

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It "sucks" @Rrog ? Can you expand or elaborate please?

i didn't know this thread existed till a few minutes ago.
i used veganics for 2 years. the only real complaint i have about it is the price. i got good results with it, but it costs me about 300 a year for my small set up, flowering 4 plants at a time.
i've since switched to Jack's, 20-20-20 during veg and 10-30-20 blossom booster during flower. that, along with a bag of epsom salt and a bag of calcium nitrate, cost me less than 100 a year, i get the same results, and have less stuff to mix.

Roger A. Shrubber said:

i didn't know this thread existed till a few minutes ago.
i used veganics for 2 years. the only real complaint i have about it is the price. i got good results with it, but it costs me about 300 a year for my small set up, flowering 4 plants at a time.
i've since switched to Jack's, 20-20-20 during veg and 10-30-20 blossom booster during flower. that, along with a bag of epsom salt and a bag of calcium nitrate, cost me less than 100 a year, i get the same results, and have less stuff to mix.

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$25 a month was too much to produce your own top shelf, seems like a great price! What produce/products did you use. How was the quality, not higher?

i bought a bag of southern ag calcium nitrate, some Jacks 20-20-20 classic for veg, Jack's bloom booster for flower, some epsom salts, and a bag of sul-po-mag (pretty much epsom salts with added K) mondays veg plants get calcium nitrate and a little jacks 20-20-20, thursdays they get a little epsom salts and a little jacks's. flower is jack's BB with a little sul-po-mag every other time. i haven't had a big problem with cal def, but if i do i have a foliar product i use on my tomatoes that works just as good on weed.
i won't say its any better than it was using veganics, but its certainly not any worse, at 1/3 the price. and not like it was a huge chore, but measuring shit out of 7 bottles every other day is kind of a pain in the ass, now its a scoop of this, a scoop of that, and i'm done

you know, that reminded me, the actual biggest pain in the ass about veganics is their bottle design, i would end up with shit everywhere, and if you shake the stuff up with the cap on, then pour it and replace the cap, it'll ooze out and run down the side of the bottle. the cabinet where i kept it is stained all to hell. and they're too deep to get at the shit in the bottom without just pouring it out, none of my droppers or syringes i use for measuring will reach after they're half empty
see whut i mean, Vern?

I'm gonna be doing a bottle free veganic run, I was never impressed with the facade of messy bottles either. there's definetly a better way

Pretty bottles. Looks very natural

i like the design on the label...

Good point. Maybe bottles are great and we should all abandon soil.

I love the commercialization of things that really require no commercialization.

did you read back a few posts? you seems to be giving me shit for the wrong thing.....

Rising Moon said:

Bump...

Amazes me after being gone from this forum for more than 6 months, this thread still argues about the same old shit....

Build your soil with herbs, flowers and plant meals, leave the bottles for the kids. Time to move into real farming folks...

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I agree but I'm having trouble finding recipes, everyone says a little of this a little of that, but it seems far less common to post a recipe.

Instead of a five year thread arguing about two or three large companies' questionable nutrient systems, why not talk about personalizing and mix/matching existing nutrient and soil builds, and hydro nutrient teas and etc. I personally am dying to do an organic dwc

Matt Rize said:

and back to PLANT BASED ORGANICS

Lost along the way:
Opinion's on humboldt nutes natural flower 0-10-0? plant based organics i believe...
Anyone here friends with Dr. VonDank? Tell him; we need him.
Vegan line from GH? Anyone test it yet?
Feeding microbes in the soil with molasses (or whatevs); anyone got a take on that theory?
Who wants to tackle the posts about seabirds as biovectors, or guano harvests destroying biodiversity, or fish emulsion being gross?

And the benefits of nutes from farmed hops and beet by-product, plants that got fed (traditional) organics .
Versus the environmental impacts of wild harvested products...? Overfishing, global insect and bat population decreases...

By using bio canna plant based organics you are supporting organic farming instead of wild harvesting...if you gotta buy something premade.
So your plants are 100% great to ferment/extract and feed to my plants, jk

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I think I'm gonna go with bio canna for my dwc, will it be able to be brewed out and bubbled?