giving defoliation during flower a try

[jacksthc]

if your having light penetration problems, I would get a better light,not molest my girls.

I have a 600w hps and the plants are about 2ft tall and the room is 1m x 1m square, the canopy not very dense
the lights about 12" above the canopy, but I an sure I will get a fair amount of airy buds in late flower because I have not remove fan leaves in flower
time will tell

 

[Uncle Ben]

Enjoy your airy little popcorn fluff that gets no light..

Enjoy your ignorance.

 

[Uncle Ben]

well fk it guys why not spin them on a lazy susan and have some side lighting?

It's not about light! When are you noobs ever gone get your ass out of forums like this and into a book on botany and plant processes. Grow an outdoor plant and get educated regarding your misguided forum belief systems.

 

[Uncle Ben]

wonder how a experiment would do if you somehow shaded the top of the plant and provided light the the underside, would the top remain the heaviest yeilding portion of the plant?

Of course it will.

 

[Eflo]

Of course it will.

Why do you believe that? Just wondering

 

[BDOGKush]

Apical dominance....

 

[Wilksey]

Throw all the horticultural mumbo jumbo that you learned in your book that you want. Ill take the word of experience over a booksmart wannabe anyday. I've seen the side by side differences many many times.. if you think that bud down in the shade is going to grow and mature just as well as a bud that's getting direct light then you have more learning to do, and I don't mean by reading your books.

/shrug

I LIKE seeing "horticultural mumbo jumbo" being thrown around on forums as it forces me to do something crazy called RESEARCH to either understand said "mumbo jumbo" or confirm or deny the validity of said "mumbo jumbo".

Experience CAN be great, but it can also bite you in the ass when it limits progress and NEW information.

Basing the potential of a grow on experience alone, and excluding SCIENCE, is just....naive, ignorant, and down right stupid.

We ALL want to become better growers, and botanical research WILL help us achieve this goal, IF we take the time to do the proper research.

Best of luck, regardless.

 

[jacksthc]

the last time I looked up anything to do with science was the book UB said about and before then it was science homework for school
I can't think of one thing in my life that would improve if I knew the science be hind it

do you read (science) on the best way to have sex or cook a dinner, or maybe drive a car

just think your taking a basic think too far

 

[NewtoMJ]

I know some commercial fruit growers spray auxins to make sure all of their flowers produce fruit. Because auxins are also produced by seeds to ensure enough fruit grows to protect it while it is developing. Can we get some of these commercial auxins and use them to spray our lower buds to create a larger harvest?

 

[Cubicfrost]

Apple trees produce big dense apples from twigs and most are in the shade.

 

[Wilksey]

I can't think of one thing in my life that would improve if I knew the science be hind it

How about your health? Is that not important enough to do some research? What kind of regular exercise program do you follow, if any, and if you don't, why not?

As far as growing goes, there's plenty of information that can improve your life as a grower. Grow mediums, nutrient quantities and types, lights, reflectors, curing techniques, watering and feeding frequencies, hell, there's a LOT of research you can do on growing alone that could improve your life because it might improve your harvest, and that's NEVER a bad thing.

I guess research alone isn't that important if you won't apply what you learn anyway.

Best of luck, regardless.

 

[Stompromper]

I'm sorry but how the fuck are you guys spinning apical dominance into a defoliating thread Ffs?

There is no apical dominance in a plant that is lst'd correctly.

Other than maybe the fattest stems might suck more of the juice..

That has nothing to do with the lower buds in the shade getting larger in the direct light. Please stay on the topic.

 

[Uncle Ben]

I'm sorry but how the fuck are you guys spinning apical dominance into a defoliating thread Ffs?

There is no apical dominance in a plant that is lst'd correctly.

Other than maybe the fattest stems might suck more of the juice..

That has nothing to do with the lower buds in the shade getting larger in the direct light. Please stay on the topic.

I rest my case.

 

[NewtoMJ]

I'm sorry but how the fuck are you guys spinning apical dominance into a defoliating thread Ffs?

There is no apical dominance in a plant that is lst'd correctly.

Other than maybe the fattest stems might suck more of the juice..

That has nothing to do with the lower buds in the shade getting larger in the direct light. Please stay on the topic.

We are on topic, because the argument being made is auxin production dictates the maturity and size of the flowers not light. Naturally if a plant is trained in a way that negates most if not all of it's apical dominance(LST'ed properly as you said), then the auxin distribution would be such that yes, apical dominance won't play a role in your grow. You will also notice that your buds won't be as big as the apical branch of the same plant if it would not have been lst'ed, and that's because the auxin distribution would be such that your buds will grow uniformly. that's not to say the apical plant will yield more just that it has a larger top bud. The argument is that the larger bottom growth on a "properly" trained plant isn't from more light penetration, but from better auxin distribution. So by people arguing apical dominance, they in turn are saying removing leaves will not give you better buds from light penetration.

 

[Slab]

Don't bother he is not bright.

 

[Growan]

Apple trees produce big dense apples from twigs and most are in the shade.

I worked in orchards for years. The way we ensured good sized fruit was to thin out numbers so each remaining fruit could grow bigger.
Leaf clusters were removed strategically to allow sunlight to hit the almost fully developed fruit, but the purpose of this was to developed colour on the skin of the fruit. Greens would ripen to reds improving the look and appeal of the fruit.

Fruit yield was never attributed to sunlight hitting the fruit directly.

So.... Yeah. Exactly as you say!

 

[skunkd0c]

One of the ICE (indica) x Cannalope Haze (sativa-dom pheno) crosses I've grown last round was so leafy it wouldn't surprise me if it would have done at least as well with less leaves, maybe... maybe even a little better. Indica-short internodes from top to bottom.

i find many indica doms are too leafy and have a horrible natural top heavy shape, i tend to top these plants and bend open all the branches
i find colas do grow better when not shaded, buds inside a deep canopy can have that light green/white appearance going on, shading should be avoided imo
its better if all the leaves get light including the little bud leaves but this does not have to be strong light

some plants are bottom heavy and produce large bottom colas even when several feet from the lights
blue cheese plant i grew recently finished at just over 16 oz the second largest cola was 4ft + from any light on one of the bottom branches
middle branches 2ft from the light with no shading were smaller

you make a good point about bad genetics, there are so many poorly structured plants which accounts for most of them imo,
finding the ideal hybrid/pheno with good node spacing not too many leaves open structure, colas on every branch etc / and also being a nice smoke
often requires more selection than just a pack of 10

when you have two hybrid plants that are sisters, one is expressing very indica traits and is very leafy
the other is expressing sativa traits and has fewer leaves, i do not think it is such a crime to make the ugly indica sister look a little more like her prettier sativa sister
by removing a few of the leaves lol, but only a few or she might throw a fit

peace

 

[skunkd0c]

Apical dominance....

don't forget those big bottom girls, they need love too, this plant was not topped
apart from the main cola (Apical dominance) the largest colas were all near the bottom of the plant around 4ft from the lights

the right hand side colas are smaller as they are receiving less spread of light than the left side which is in between 2x 600w

peace

 

[NewtoMJ]

don't forget those big bottom girls, they need love too, this plant was not topped
apart from the main cola (Apical dominance) the largest colas were all near the bottom of the plant around 4ft from the lights

the right hand side colas are smaller as they are receiving less spread of light than the left side which is in between 2x 600w

peace

Nice plant!

 

[jacksthc]

How about your health? Is that not important enough to do some research? What kind of regular exercise program do you follow, if any, and if you don't, why not?

As far as growing goes, there's plenty of information that can improve your life as a grower. Grow mediums, nutrient quantities and types, lights, reflectors, curing techniques, watering and feeding frequencies, hell, there's a LOT of research you can do on growing alone that could improve your life because it might improve your harvest, and that's NEVER a bad thing.

I guess research alone isn't that important if you won't apply what you learn anyway.

Best of luck, regardless.

there a big difference between biology, science and a few basic facts

I don't need to know the how every piece of my body works by reading a few books on biology
just the basic thing's most people know and that goes for my hart too lol

I don't need to know how a hps bulb is made and how every spectrum of light will affect the plants as they grow, only need to know hps works really well in flower and a few basic facts

you can read up on how one brand of bulb is better than another because one gives more lums than the other one
or read how one bran of soil has more bat shit in so it feeds your plant for longer but its too hot for seedling

spend endless time trying to work out what is the best nutes on the market and then find out a brand has changed the npk ratio so you have to start again

and at the same time your trying different strains under different lights

over time I have worked out, as long as you have good nutes, soil and light, it will not make a lot of difference changing to other brands
you can spend a lot of time reading up on the science behind all these different things and the shops would be happy to take your money good luck to you
just like my cutting I use an old 2ltr pot, bag and a 1ft t5 light, the steams stay green and roots really quick

I have some read one of the science mag in the grow shop on doing this with trays, res, pumps and a purple light, taking loads of room up and costing loads of money, looks a load of crap to me

I learn' t some basic facts on growing and contrasted on different ways to train my plants with the same plant for 5 crops or more,
by spend my time learning how to train plants, shape the canopy and keep my running cost low, I am more than happy with my harvest I pull

good luck with the books